*WARNING* *Political* *Unemployment*

[Chan]

It seems likely that congress will not approve any additional extensions to the 99 week limit on unemployment benefits.  Given the current high rate of unemployment/underemployment and the bleak state of the economy some fear that we will see an immediate increase in homelessness, hunger, suicide and other social ills if support should be withdrawn.  Others argue that an excessive reliance upon unemployment assistance and other social programs will turn the US into a welfare state, no longer fit to be a leader in a competitive global economy.   I’m interested to hear your opinions.

[paddlesurf.net]

I've got some strong opinions about this- I apologize in advance if I offend anybody, it's just the way I see things based on my life experiences.

Here's what I've seen on my beach with a friend of mine who's been on unemployment for two years:

1. He surfs a lot.

2. He was offered jobs but didn't take them- his excuse: "Man, I'm not going to do that sh$t... Home Depot sucks."

3. He just got a job. Why? "Because eventually they're going to stop sending me checks- I can see it coming".

I didn't know that you could take unemployment for 99 weeks... that pretty unbelievable. Cut the unemployment and people will find work.

I don't buy the, "There's no jobs out there" excuse- there are always jobs. I graduated in '91 everybody said we were screwed, "there's no jobs". I left UCSB with a degree in Aquatic Biology and took my first job walking around the dump picking up trash blown into the wind screens. I comboed that with a night job loading Milgard windows into trucks. Did life suck for a short while? Yep. But I sucked it up long enough to get into grad school, take a loan (best reason to ever borrow money) and bust my ass working as a substitute teacher while going to school.

I guess it comes down to how you look at the situation you find yourself in. Me? I choose to make life my b#tch (I'm sorry if that offends anybody but I feel strongly about it).

[PonoBill]

We're certainly headed that way, but it isn't unemployment insurance that's shoving us down that slippery slope, it's the percentage of the GNP that goes to running the government. In many ways the US, and the individual states have become fundamentally ungovernable. It's incredibly difficult to end programs that don't work. It's difficult to reduce the governmental workforces (unions, votes, patronage). Pork and special interests (including unions, banks, pharma, you name it) drive policy.

You might think that unemployment insurance should be just that--a pooling of interest--and if I paid into it for 40 years without withdrawing any that my benefits should last longer than someone who was employed for a year or two. If it were structured that way, the people in the most trouble--those who have worked a long time in careers that no longer exist--would at least have some time to find a new path. Instead we have programs that are fundamentally arbitrary.

Oregon faces a 3 billion dollar deficit, and neither the governor nor the legislature are taking significant actions to reduce spending. It's actually rising in the face of this impending crisis, growing 50% over the last four years. Instead the administrators that control budgets are doing the usual punitive things to convince the voters that added taxes are necessary--school furloughs, closing parks (even ones that pay for themselves). It's not that Oregon has a poor economy, it's that the government spends far too much--mostly on bullshit programs and patronage jobs.

Truth is that most people would like to see the state doing a lot less. We don't really need health inspectors closing down kids lemonade stands, or forcing people selling artisan bread at farmers markets to have a health certificate and eliminate all cheese breads because they are "dangerous". If you have that many health inspectors then you have too many.

It's far worse at the federal level. If you spend any time in DC you quickly learn that people in senior positions in government live like potentates. There was a time when working in the public sector meant you were paid less but had more security, and health and retirement benefits that were actually worth something (they are NOT in the social Security program). Now the public sector on average earns more than private. You've got to wonder why.

I don't have many answers. It would be nice to be able to elect people who could change that, but politics in America have become a pure money and influence game.

[Chan]

Bill, I almost mistook you for a Tolstoy character.  The French and Russian revolutions have been (at least partially) blamed on bloated inept governments.  Ironically, these revolutions eventually culminated in the current bloated inept socialist governments in both countries (No offense to the Commie’s or the Frog's). 

[PonoBill]

So was the American revolution, the french revolution, and probably when Malays migrated to Hawaii they were fleeing bloated, inept government.

In Greece the bloated, inept government workers are rioting because other bloated inept officials want them to work until the absurd age of 62. Oh, the humanity.  In other news the European Union is demonstrating how tying sinking ships together makes them all float. 

[Dwight (DW)]

Regan could fix it. The young may not remember the balls it took to fire all the air traffic controllers and hire non union replacements. That guy had big balls. He deregulated the airlines and told those that couldn't live without it, to just go under!

He'd end unemployment now!

[juandoe]

When my brother was laid off, he spent his time on the beach.  When people asked him what he did for a living, he told them, "I'm a windsurfer for the state of Hawaii."  Once his benefits ran out, he went out and got another job.   It is a fundamental part of human nature.  As long as you hand out something for free, the majority will take advantage of it.

[Bravo]

After reading the responses here, I think you all have discovered a way to get the unemployment rate to ZERO.  All that need to be done is to eliminate the unemployment benefits so then everyone on Unemployment would have to get a job thus reducing the unemployment rate to ZERO.  Brilliant.  Why has no one thought of this before?

[Admin]

Seen this one in your inbox?

When I grow up....
 
 
I recently asked my friend's little girl what she wanted to be when she
grows up. She said she wanted to be President some day. Both of her
parents, liberal Democrats, were standing there, so I asked her, 'If you
were President what would be the first thing you would do?'
 
She replied, 'I'd give food and money to all the unemployed people.'
 
Her parents beamed.
 
'Wow....what a worthy goal.' I told her, 'But you don't have to wait
until you're President to do that. You can come over to my house and mow
the lawn, pull weeds, and sweep my yard, and I'll pay you $50. Then I'll
take you over to the beach where the unemployed guys hang out, and
you can give them the $50 to use toward food and whatever else.'
 
She thought that over for a few seconds, then she looked me straight in
the eye and asked, 'Why don't the unemployed guys come over and do the
work, and you can just pay them the $50?'
 
I said, 'Welcome to the Republican Party.'
 
Her parents still aren't speaking to me.

[PonoBill]

This ought to fire people up....

As a business guy, I can tell you it's STILL very hard to hire qualified people who will work hard. But that's in my business and my company which I understand is pretty unique. I know there are hard working, smart folks who trained hard for a career, and are now either underemployed or unemployed because the world changed underneath them. I empathize with them, and wish them well.

But seriously, isn't anyone else amazed that the unemployment rate is only 10 percent? What percentage of people you know have a real skill--of any kind, never mind marketable. What percentage have the kind of work ethic you would demand if you were paying them. How many people do you encounter that are doing the job they have at eighty percent of what's needed, never mind the 110 percent that it really takes to be valuable to a company.

At the risk of sounding smug, I'll tell you that somewhere along the line I learned how to really work. Didn't start out that way--lots of the bullshit jobs I had didn't demand effort and I didn't volunteer any. But somehow I found the personal satisfaction of giving a job much more than anyone asks for--any job. I was a crappy nuclear reactor operator, but I was a damned good motorcycle mechanic, a really good PR guy, and an even better software entrepreneur and marketer.

As far as I can see there's perhaps 20 percent of the population that works their ass off at something, and puts in the thousands of hours it takes to learn a real skill skill and excel at it. And then there's everyone else. The spectrum from pretty good to worthless. Ten percent unemployed? A miracle if you ask me.

I think you could be a great Home Depot drone, and really learn things that benefit you while they make you inordinately valuable to the people you work for. I absolutely KNOW you can be a spectacular waiter or waitress, a great house painter, a great store clerk. It's not a guarantee of success, but it's a better path.

Anything that increases the number of people that head down that path (meaning personal responsibility, a work ethic, and a hunger for knowledge and skills) is good for the country and the economy. Anything that doesn't is bad.

As far as I can see, Asia is simply going to eat our lunch. China has a larger middle class than the US has population (350 million). Both India and China graduate more engineers than the US graduates college students. If real intelligence is a bell curve (and it is) and both India and China are aggressively educating their populations (and they are) then where do you suppose the US will rank with our failing school systems and entitled work force?

[Admin]

But seriously, isn't anyone else amazed that the unemployment rate is only 10 percent?

Not aimed at your point, but ff you include those who have fallen aff the unemployment radar and the underemployed, I think it is nationally closer to 18% with pockets over 20%.  60 Minutes had a segment with the stats recently. 

[PonoBill]

i think so too, in fact I suspect it's higher than that considering the relatively large number of people who could work, but never showed up on any employment statistic. Doesn't really change the situation. I suspect there will still be jobs for people who place assembly A into slot B, but it's not a growth area, and it probably never will be again.

My guess is that we're looking at the start of systemic unemployment for at least the next fine years and maybe a lot longer. The economy is recovering without main street and factory jobs because it doesn't need them. It is a world economy, like it or not, and unemployment insurance or a dole system is not going to make people more competitive in it.

[Tom]

The U S economy can not be built on people who place assembly A into slot B; if they compete with the guy in the following video, they'd lose. And I don't think that is where we want to be anyway. The U S needs to compete in an arena where it can win, and that requires people with an education that can engineer, research, discover, or manage something. The US economy grew to the strongest in the world after World War II because its general popular was better educated than the rest on the world. Sadly, I don't think we will ever see that again

[Chan]

This slightly long winded inspired speech from an unusually serious Stewart eloquently expresses my current sentiments.

[Johnny Mac]

The U S economy can not be built on people who place assembly A into slot B; if they compete with the guy in the following video, they'd lose. And I don't think that is where we want to be anyway. The U S needs to compete in an arena where it can win, and that requires people with an education that can engineer, research, discover, or manage something. The US economy grew to the strongest in the world after World War II because its general popular was better educated than the rest on the world. Sadly, I don't think we will ever see that again