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Messages - FloridaWindSUP

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Ok, thank you all, this is helpful. I've been thinking about getting a more sup / surf oriented board to mount the foil on and maybe try the upwind / downwind / gentle surf thing without the sail. If I had unlimited funds I might try it on this wind-sup board.

Foil SUP / Practicality / conditions thresholds for downwind foil sup
« on: April 10, 2019, 04:13:09 AM »
I've recently been playing with a Slingshot Hoverglide Fwind 2019 setup on my windsurf and really enjoying it. I think the foil is usuable for surf sup, too, though I might need a larger front wing (Infinity 84 instead of the Infinity 76 that I have).

What I would actually be most interested in doing though would be foil sup downwinding. I think I would need a different board for that because the shape of my windsurf is all wrong for paddling and catching waves (230 x 100 cm / 7'6 x 39" wide formula race board with the finbox all the way at the tail). Before I look at a new board purchase, I want to get some perspectives on if downwind foiling actually works for amateurs in real world conditions.

How much wind and what size bumps do you need to get up and stay up on the foil for a reasonable amount of time? Do you need, like, 25 knot Gorge / Maui conditions or can it work in 10-15 knots with less than waist high bumps?

Hmm, on further reflection I'm reminded of a time not too long ago where I couldn't even achieve 9 kph in difficult downwind conditions where I lacked stability. It was the beginning of the Key West classic race in 2017, I think. Trying to catch the bumps I was falling a lot and being passed by a female friend on a 12'6 who was just paddling along not even trying to catch the bumps. I should remember that and not to be such a snob. :)

Three thoughts:

1) I don't think it's unreasonable for brands to make some boards that are fast but tippy and best suited to flat water and/or expert paddlers, as long as the brands also make more accessible boards for rough water and amateur paddlers.

2) It does seem that we have hit or passed "peak sup racing," and the new boards coming out every year is excessive

3) A < 10 kph average speed on a downwinder is pretty lame, suggesting an inexperienced rider, a weak effort, or poor conditions / equipment. 

Downwind and Racing / First run with > 8 mph average!
« on: December 20, 2018, 11:53:58 AM »
I'm so pleased with myself that I just had to crow about this. We had great downwinding conditions today in SW Florida (20-30+ mph sideshore to slightly offshore) and I managed to do 13.14 kph / 8.16 mph over 16 km. I was on the 14x27.25 Fanatic Falcon. Prior to this my best average speed on a downwinder was 11.91 kph, so this feels like a big leap. I think more speed would be possible with a little better strategy and work on skills like ambidexterity with regards to goofy vs. regular take-offs and rides.

Downwind and Racing / 404 ltd 14x25.5 for downwinding
« on: December 14, 2018, 03:39:07 PM »
Today I borrowed my buddy's 404 ltd 14x25.5 for a downwinder. Conditions were sideshore / slightly offshore 15-20+ kts with relatively small bumps less than waist high.

The 404 ltd worked really nicely for downwinding, and I got my best ever average downwind speed on a SUP.

The board felt kind of intermediate between the ease of a big boofy downwind board like my 14x27.25 Fanatic and the quick but unforgiving 14x23 Riviera. Also, the 404 ltd was MUCH better in the rough water / downwind conditions than the older 404 v3 that I used to ride a few years ago. Big evolution.   

Technique / Re: Surfing Raceboards is FUN!
« on: December 06, 2018, 07:37:52 AM »
Wow! Amazing conditions at that beautiful spot.

Downwind and Racing / Stunning speeds of the pros
« on: November 05, 2018, 12:30:41 PM »
There were some big fish in my small river last Saturday for 6.44 km (4 mile) race downriver then back upriver. It was an interesting race format where teams of four were scored by their total times, but didn't necessarily have to finish together.

The winner, pro-level Eri Tenorio, did it in 37:54, with an incredible average pace of 10.21 kph. I wouldn't have believed that was possible if I hadn't seen it with my own eyes.

The next two guys, Florida's top two amateurs, did it in 39:12 (9.87 kph) working together in a draft pair.

They were all on 14x22 or 14x23 Flying Fish sups.

My fastest ever time on the same course was 40:40 (9.47 kph), but I was a lot slower than that Saturday because I'm de-trained and because I was going slower so my buddy could draft the whole way to improve our cumulative team time.

Downwind and Racing / Re: First downwinder attempt (weeee!)
« on: October 28, 2018, 06:44:42 AM »
Way to go SoFlo!

I reckon you'll start learning to move and brace pretty quick if you keep doing these. Sometimes when I can't get a real downwinder together I'll just take my board to the beach and do relatively short distance (a couple hundred meters at a time) upwind / downwind intervals. That helps a lot with practice. Works best when the wind is enough to make some chop, but less than 15 knots.


Downwind and Racing / Re: Surfing the Bayonet 14
« on: September 10, 2018, 10:44:49 AM »
Wow- those are some long rides! I wish I had a break like that where I live.

Wind Powered / Re: Can I get some advice?
« on: August 13, 2018, 07:24:11 PM »
Hi iDownwind,

The stuff you got (155 liter shortboard, and 7.7 msq sail) will be good for you in strong winds, but not in light winds. At your weight you'll need about 20 mph to get it planing nicely, and the short 155 liter board will be kind of like a bathtub until it starts planing.

In less than 20 mph you'll have more fun mounting the 7.7 to your F14.



Environment / Horrendous Red Tide and Bluegreen Algae Blooms in Florida
« on: August 05, 2018, 02:00:04 PM »
I'm not sure if this is making it to the national news yet, but we are in the midst of a colossal environmental disaster in South Florida, on the scale of last summer's hurricanes, or the Exxon Valdez or Deepwater Horizon oil spills, or the mega California wildfires.

Millions of fishes, hundreds of sea turtles and manatees, dolphins, and even giant whale sharks are dying and washing up on the shores of our lakes, rivers, estuaries, and beachfronts. The culprits are two types of toxic algae blooms of unprecedented size; freshwater bluegreen algae (a cyanobacteria; Microcystis aeruginosa) and saltwater red tide (a dinoflagellate; Karenia brevis). The culprit behind both deadly blooms seems to be excess nutrient input from various forms of pollution, due to decades of rampant reckless development concurrent with a systematic dismantling of the state's environmental regulatory capacity by the current corrupt governor, commissioner of agriculture, attorney general, etc. 

Though the red tide has been simmering since October, it really metastasized about a month ago, at the same time that the bluegreen algae bloom was exploding. A lot of it relates to botched "replumbing" of Lake Okeechobee, which is now drained through canals to the East and West coasts instead of flowing south and filtering through the Everglades. 

The consequences for SUP'ing have been serious. The beaches in SW Florida are almost all very badly afflicted, to the point where you start coughing and get headaches and itchy eyes as soon as you step out of the car, and the freshwater and estuarine areas with the bluegreen bloom are so putrid and toxic that no one would even dare put a board in. We've driven inland to a few blackwater rivers that flow out of unpolluted swamps and are still relatively safe. It's a bad, bad situation, though.

If you want to learn more, I wrote a blog about it.

Downwind and Racing / Re: Faster vs. Longer - how to train?
« on: August 05, 2018, 11:05:50 AM »
The "hull speed" of an 11'6 board is 5.23 mph, whereas for a 14' board it's 5.77 mph.
Just curious: how do you measure or estimate hull speed?

For a displacement vessel (like a SUP), hull speed in knots is equal to 1.34 time the square root of the waterline length in feet.

It's an approximation, but for SUPs it works pretty darn well for predicting the speed at which the "wave drag" of your vessel becomes very difficult to overcome.

Downwind and Racing / Re: Faster vs. Longer - how to train?
« on: August 04, 2018, 08:15:40 PM »
Hi Kevin-

You're doing well, especially for being on an 11'6 x 30 board. The "hull speed" of an 11'6 board is 5.23 mph, whereas for a 14' board it's 5.77 mph. It's extremely difficult to maintain hull speed for a race distance unless you're extremely fit and skilled. Board shape and width also play a role. A 30" wide surf-style board is going to be dramatically slower than a 25" wide pointy-nosed board, even if they're the same length. So I would say you miiiight eventually be able to maintain 5.0 mph for a race distance if you train really hard, but my guess is that it's not going to happen anytime soon unless you get a faster board.

As for training, you'll get the best results by training consistently (like every other day), and training HARD- like really going as fast as you possibly can for whatever the training time or distance is. Beyond that, I think time spent on short distance, high-intensity intervals is most effective. You want to bring your sprint speed up, and then your longer distance speed will come along with it. I'm talking really short, really hard sprints. Like a good workout would be: warmup, ten 30 second all-out sprints with 1 minute rests, cool down, done for the day. Other days you might do warmup, 1 mile as fast as you can, 2 minutes rest, 1 more mile as fast as you can, done. Only about once a week or so do you need to do a longer continuous paddle, and even then I think 30-60 minutes or so is plenty.

Enjoy figuring out what works for you. :)


SUP General / Re: Sitting (OC1, surfski) vs. Standing (SUP)
« on: July 31, 2018, 10:09:55 AM »
I have limited opportunities to try other surfskis, but I did get to do a ~9 km island rounding in rough conditions on a Stellar SR (19'2 x 18.9"), and found that to be delightfully easy and fun in comparison with my v12. It didn't hurt my butt as much, either. I don't know how much of that was due to the seat shape and how much was due to the stability reducing my "white knuckle" tendency to wedge myself against the back of the seat when feeling unstable.

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