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1

Classifieds / Sunova Flow for sale on Maui

« on: September 27, 2022, 05:16:12 PM »

Sunova Flow original model in like new condition. 8'7" x 30 Ό" @ 120.5 liters. Excellent condition with no dings. New in standard construction is $2099. This is in the special order Balsa construction which runs $2349 new. For sale for $950 with pickup on Maui. Includes Sunova quality fiberglass fins in perfect condition and a goretex vent plug in the board.
This was my favorite board but at 71 years old I just switched to a Sunova with a little more volume for easier balancing.

2

Gear Talk / New Sunova SP25 report

« on: September 25, 2022, 08:31:26 PM »

Today was the first day on my new Sunova 8’8” SP25. If you don’t like long reviews, just click out of this one and no worries.
Conditions today were perfect with glassy waist to just overhead surf over a shallow reef. No wind and just some rebound rollers off the beach with lots of cross-rollers on the inside to challenge balance.
The bottom line is that the board is perfect for me and is everything that I had hoped for. This is the seventh board I have purchased in the 8’6” to 9’ range and I will make a few comparisons. For background, I am 71 years old, 5’11”, 163 lbs (74 kilos), caught my first waves in 1958, and switched to SUP surfing about 10 years ago. I have taught high-performance windsurfing and wavesailing on Maui during the summers for the past 40 years.
Stability: This is one of the most important aspects I was hoping for in this board and I am delighted. The key for me is the difference between primary stability and secondary stability. Primary stability is the initial tippiness of a board and describes how quickly and easily it rocks from side to side. Secondary stability describes how much a board wants to keep tipping as one of the rails starts to get sucked under by something like a cross-roller. I was not looking for more primary stability which is why I went to a shorter length than my current 9-footer but I was looking for a lot more secondary stability from the rail profile than I have on my 8’7” Sunova Flow. My experience is that the total bottom surface area on the water controls primary stability and the rail profile controls secondary stability. Because the SP 25 is shorter than some of my other boards and has a much more pulled-in nose than any of them, when I first got to my feet I felt a little less primary stability than some of my other boards which was fine with me. As I slowly rocked the board from side to side I felt the great secondary stability kick in from the awesome rail profile which was one of my main goals with this board. The rail is more pinched than the original Flow near the bottom for carving penetration and then gradually slopes up over a few inches to the thick middle of the board where the center thickness provides the secondary stability; they nailed it.
Volume: There has been some concern from myself and others about the high volume in the 8’8” SP25. My last three boards were 120, 120.5, and 124 liters. Going up to 137.7 in the SP25 seemed pretty scary since that is near the volume of my very first SUP, a Fanatic AllWave 8’11” @ 140 liters with horribly boxy rails that I outgrew and sold in three weeks. Supthecreek was familiar with the old AllWaves and told me that the SP25 was nothing like that; I would completely agree. The SP25 feels closer to my 120-liter Flow than to anything else. The main place I feel the difference is in the secondary stability which is why I had to quit surfing the Flow. If I were blindfolded, I would guess the functional volume of this board for my weight to be around 125-127 liters. I (and Creek) were also concerned about the very pulled-in nose and how that would affect stability and fore/aft balance. I found it to be totally a non-issue and I love the pulled-in nose because of the reduced swing weight on the wave.
Paddling: The paddling speed is comparable to my 8’7” Flow which means not particularly fast and significantly slower than my 9-footers. I think the very round outline of the SP25 makes it a little slower than a narrower board with more parallel rails like my old 8’10” Speeed which was a very fast paddler.
Punching out through white water: I hate it when wide-nosed boards get the nose kicked up when trying to punch out through white water. The narrow nose of the SP25 punches right through and under the white water with very little resistance which worked great today.
Catching waves: Once the wave starts to push, the full-width single concave and wide tail with moderate rocker immediately create lift and the board starts to glide very early. I would say it is an easy wave catcher and will catch small sloping waves far better than most.
Speed on the wave: If you pump the curvy rails, fins, and concave bottom, this board can generate a lot of speed and I was making sections that I could not make on my other boards. If you just stand and trim along the wall, the speed is mediocre since this board was not meant to ever be surfed that way. That style of surfing is where the Speeed really shines with its long straight rail outline.
Bottom turns: Turning this board can range from mediocre to over-the-top spectacular depending on what skills you apply. If I got my rear foot right on the stomp pad, the board would accelerate back up vertically to the lip before I even had time to think about it. If my rear foot was ahead of the stomp pad by even a couple of inches, I could still get some smooth rolling turns down the line but I could not tap into the board's vertical potential. As a habit from windsurfing, I like to drop into a bottom turn in a wide stance with my rear foot on the stomp pad and my weight on my front foot up near the handle to engage the forward and midsection of the rail while the rear foot drives against the rear rail and fins. This board loves that approach. I found that if my rear foot was on the stomp pad and I weighted that foot without leaning forward to engage the front portion of the rail, the board would make a bouncy pivot around the wide tail rather than carving and accelerating off the whole rail. For me, this board requires a wide stance to unlock its potential. It wants to be surfed like a shortboard, not a longboard.
Off the top: This board loves to come off the lip or do a floater off the white water but you need to have a wide enough stance to have your front foot on or near the handle to weight the the nose and get it to drop back in. When I did, I was able to nail floaters off the white water that my other boards might have stalled on.
Roundhouses: The board pulled some amazingly tight roundhouses today but a number of them were too flat due to operator error that I need to work on. The tail is quite wide at 19 ⅜” which is wider than any board I have ridden (the 8’7” Flow is close at 19 ⅛”). This promotes early planing and carrying speed on slower parts of the wave but it means you have to be dialed in about how far you need to move your back foot from rail to rail. I would encourage people not to worry about the listed 137.7 liters of volume being too much but make sure you are okay with the advantages and disadvantages of a wide tail.

My goals with this board were to improve my vertical surfing with tighter lip hits, to generate more speed to make it around sections, and to improve on secondary stability to better deal with cross-rollers trying to suck the rails under. Paddling, wave-catching, and primary stability were not concerns and all happily worked out fine as bonuses.

3

Classifieds / Sunova Flow for sale on Maui

« on: September 02, 2021, 03:37:19 PM »

I am selling my beloved 8'7" Sunova Flow after turning 70 and suffering a head injury while surfing that has affected my balance requiring me to go to a larger board. The board is in like-new condition with no dings or marks and has always been kept inside when not on the water.
Specs are 8'7" X 30.25" X 4 ⅜" @121 liters. Comes with goretex vent plug and Liftsup handle which I like. Five fin boxes for thruster or quad, and includes the original three high-quality Sunova glass fins which are spotless.
This board is in the balsa wood and carbon construction which now costs an extra 15% above Sunova's standard wood sandwich construction. New today this board would cost $2180, not including any shipping.
Selling for $1175 firm on Maui. Would consider professional packing and shipping if arranged and paid for by buyer. Detailed photos if requested.

4

Downwind and Racing / Finally on the Bullet 2020

« on: July 16, 2021, 10:40:21 PM »

Covid, as well as shoulder rotator cuff surgery, has kept my wife and I away from our new custom 2020 Bullet 14s that have been sitting up in the Maui factory for the past 14 months. Now that we finally got the new boards wet, I wanted to share some observations and ask a few questions.
The first morning we took the boards out into small surf that we have ridden previously on our old F16s in. The difference was stunning. The Bullet is far more maneuverable on and off the wave. Setting the F16 up to surf a wave involved a huge arcing turn using the rudder. The 14' Bullet is easy to pivot, buoy turn, cross-bow turn, as well as making much sharper turns using the rudder making it much easier to position for the takeoff. The F16 caught tiny waves easier and further out, and rode them longer  after they flattened out, but turning on the wave felt slow and awkward. If you get right back on the tail, the Bullet bottom turned amazingly well , trimmed down the line feeling fairly loose, and would even do some slow motion cutbacks. Late takeoffs were tricky since the new Bullet has much less nose rocker than the F16. The Bullet is noticeably faster in flat water, and especially going into the wind which the F16 was poor at. My wife and I had a great time surfing the little 6" to 2' waves.
Today I did two short downwind runs with mixed success. I did a short test run inside the Kanaha reef in the morning when the wind was about 19. I have to say that it was pretty frustrating. I was not able to catch any glides on the tiny mixed up wind waves that were bouncing back and forth between the reef and the beach, but did manage to get some glides on the larger windswells that came in across the reef. The board felt very directionally unstable in all the mixed up water that Kanaha is famous for inside the reef. From past experience I would have to say that the F16 with its directional stability and extra length would have handled those conditions much better.
In the afternoon, we did a Kihei run with the wind averaging over 30 with gusts into the mid to high 40s. Lots of white smoke blowing off the tops of the white caps. The board was much more fun in these conditions with lots of glides, but we came away with a couple of questions.
1. When the nose of our F16s poked which it rarely did because of all the nose rocker, it usually meant trouble since the nose tended to bury enough to slow the board way down and pitch me off balance. Also, the board would often veer off course when the nose poked. The Bullet has a LOT less nose rocker, so poking was happening far more often, but with much less consequences since the high volume nose would always pop back up and was well.-behaved when underwater. The main problem was that in the steep short period waves, I was so gun-shy about the low rocker that I kept jumping back too soon or too much and ended up losing many of the steeper bumps. Open to suggestions. Note: I do hang out on the tiller when hunting for bumps, but hop back once gliding.
2. The F16s tended to track straight unless you told them otherwise. The Bullet almost has a mind of its own and was turning all over the place with me frantically trying to use the rudder to correct the boards radical turns in all directions. In fairness, the board often turned to align with a good bump, but would then continue turning so that I would end up cutting out of the bump like a surfer cutting out of a wave. I think a larger and more raked fin would help, but we need the rudder to make our 90 degree turn to get home through the shallow reefs. Open to suggestions (other than to put in a fixed fin which would mean not getting home through shallow reefs with a 30 mph crosswind). Has anyone been able to retrofit a larger fin into the FAST system, or should I just learn to love the high-spirited turning performance of the Bullet 14 with the standard rudder fin?
3. I was thinking about locking the fin for most of the run, and then unlocking it to get home. Thoughts?
Thanks for any input now that we are finally back on the water after 18 months.

5

Random / Book published on Amazon

« on: April 15, 2020, 03:43:59 PM »

Some of you might remember that back in October I published a 369 page eBook on Apple Books titled 'The Spirit of Icarus'. I had a lot of comments that I needed to release a print edition, so after a few months of reformatting the entire book for print, the book just released on Amazon this week.

I often describe the book as a Warren Miller film in book form; adventure stories, bits of sports history, with doses of humor and philosophy thrown in. About 2/3s of the book revolves around skiing, and about 100 pages are dedicated to ocean sports like surfing, windsurfing, downwinding, and sailing. There are over 310 photos in the book, including a few supplied by great SUP surfers like Robert Stehlik of Blue Planet Surf, and Australian Andrew Cassidy who you will know well if you spend any time on Seabreeze.

Here is a link to the Amazon print version:https://www.amazon.com/Spirit-Icarus-Tales-Flying-Close/dp/B086PNWNSZ/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=The+spirit+of+icarus&qid=1586875875&sr=8-1

I think that Zoners might enjoy the book as a fun reminder of the adventurous lives we normally lead when we are not cooped up at home from Covid19. For my wife and me, a big part of the current frustration is that we are locked up in a shut-down ski resort, while we have two brand new custom SIC downwind boards waiting for us on Maui. I guess anticipation is half the fun.

6

Downwind and Racing / 2020 SIC Bullet 14 X 30" questions.

« on: January 10, 2020, 01:43:31 PM »

I was just checking out the new 2020 SIC catalog, and am intrigued by the new Bullet 14 X 30" to possibly replace my F16 on Maui. I am wondering if anyone has had a chance to downwind on one of these?
I know that a lot of people will object to the 30" width, but here are my thoughts:
1. My wife and I are both turning 69 this year, and we hope to continue downwinding for many years to come. I still fall off a few times every run, and getting back to my feet in 30 mph winds is not getting any easier as we get older and get more surgeries and joints replaced. Robert Stehlik of Blue Planet has pointed out that a wider board can be faster for an average paddler if it means more stability for paddling power.
2. I read one opinion that the new v3 rocker is faster in dw than the v2. This might make up for some of the drag from the 30" width.
3. I wrote a post a few months ago where we discussed whether the forward rails on the F16 might be knocking me off sometimes. The nose area on the new boards is much more rounded on the bottom, which may help with this.
4. The new Bullet 14s appear to have more nose rocker than on the v2, which I like. We do the vast majority of our runs in front of our home in Kihei, where the swell period is shorter than on the North shore.
5. Our priority in downwinding is not in getting to the end of the run first, or I would be looking at 17 footers. What we love is zig-zagging back and forth connecting diagonal rides across the bumps. I am thinking that the 14 will be even better at this than our 16s because of the shorter length while having as much or more stability.
6. My very first downwinder was on a 2013 F14. It was super stable, but very heavy which made it hard to accelerate onto bumps. The new Bullet 30" is about 4-5 pounds lighter. The 2013 F14 had a very flat and wide nose, which really bogged down when it punched into the back of a swell. I am hoping that the nose rocker and rounded nose of the new one will be less of a problem.
7. I did demo a standard width Bullet 14. While it was fun, I really preferred the extra stability of the F16 due to its extra length, even though the width was about the same. I also caught more bumps on the F16.
8. Lastly is the controversial topic of wanting to keep a rudder, which I believe is now available on the Bullet 14s. In Kihei, the wind can often turn offshore, and many people have lots of scary stories. We often do short runs, that require us to turn towards shore and paddle half a mile directly across the wind to get home. We can do this by paddling on one side while adding some steerage from the rudder. We have been caught in some bad situations near reefs without a rudder, and want to avoid any more of those. Plus, in the small waves that we have at the start of our runs, they are fun to steer around in, but you need to stay near the middle of the board because the small waves do not generate enough speed to step back and steer from the tail. The rudder allows lots of quick turns from mid-board, which are difficult to duplicate with just paddle steering.

Those are my thoughts, but it's all just theory. I would love to hear from anyone who has downwinded on the 2020 Bullet 14s, of either width. Thanks.

7

Downwind and Racing / Need downwinding advice

« on: September 05, 2019, 08:53:49 PM »

I did not get nearly as many downwind runs in this summer as I had hoped, due to work, and also too many great south swell days. However, skills are still slowly improving, with good success at catching bumps, and getting better at making connections for long glides. My main problem is too many unnecessary falls.
I am riding an F16. I seldom fall even in high wind and rough seas when not on a glide. The two things that knock me down during a great glide are: 1. Having the nose or mid-section get hit from the side by a cross-roller, that suddenly veers the board off course, which throws me off in the opposite direction from the turn. 2. During a fast glide, having the downwind rail up near the front catch, causing the board to suddenly veer off course. Since I spend a lot of time SUP surfing, my bracing skills are pretty decent. If the fall happens to be towards the side that the paddle is already on, I have a good chance of saving it. If I need to try and reach the paddle around behind me to brace, odds are not so good.
I would love to finally get in some runs without falling, so I would welcome any advice. My current strategies are to anticipate the most likely side that the cross swells might hit me from, and have the paddle on that side ready to brace, and 2. When on a particularly fast glide, step back further on the tail to try to get those forward rails out of the water so that they do not catch and make the board suddenly veer.
Thanks for any help.

8

Gear Talk / Board weight reality check

« on: July 26, 2019, 03:24:01 PM »

Hi all. I am looking at a decision regarding board weights, and would love any insights you guys want to offer.
I bought a new Blue Planet All Good 8'8" a couple of weeks ago, and am loving the board. Since it was a total unknown to me before I bought it, and demoing was not an easy option, I was reluctant to pay the extra $500 for carbon construction, and the bamboo construction that I got saved me $500, but came in at around 22 pounds. I am liking the board enough that I am considering selling this current board, and paying the extra to get the same board in carbon, which is supposed to come in at around 18.4 lbs, almost 4 pounds lighter than my current board.
So here is my question; how much difference is there really going to be in performance. We all know that light is cool, and picking up and carrying a superlight board just feels good. But, how about performance on a wave. I have never had the chance to surf two identical shapes, of different weights; how about anyone else out there? For example, in windsurfing, a lightweight board is great for getting planing in light winds, and feels so much better in the air, but sometimes in high winds and chop, a heavier board can smooth things out a little, and can be easier to bury the rail at high speeds in choppy water. One of my goals with this board has been stability in chop; will a heavier board get knocked around less by chop?
My surfing style tends to be pretty active; I am either pumping the board down the line if the wave is fast, linking tight turns whenever there is time, and roundhouses whenever the wave gives me room, never really just trimming down the line. This is what makes me think that the weight difference might be a big deal for me, but on the other hand, I am loving the way the current board surfs.
The lightest board I ever owned was an 8'8" Starboard in their lightest construction, and it was also my least favorite board ever, and was sold after just a couple of months. One reason was that the board tended to be really bouncy in anything over shoulder high, but it was also a very wide board with a very wide tail. With my weight of 163 lbs, it did not feel like I could keep the rails of that wide, light board, buried in the water. My other current boards are Sunvovas that are between 19 and 20 pounds, which feels fine.
So before I sell a perfectly good board, and plop down an extra $500 to loose 4 pounds in board weight, I would love to hear your thoughts.
Thanks.

9

Gear Talk / New Blue Planet 'All Good'

« on: June 26, 2019, 02:27:51 PM »

WARNING!. This review is really long, so if you are not a nut about board design minutiae, stop here and move on to another post, or you will hate me.https://www.standupzone.com/forum/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif
I have been needing to fill a hole in my quiver between my 8’7” X 30.25” 120 L Sunova Flow which I love when it is glassy surf, and my 9’0” X 31.5” 145L Tabou which saves the day when it is rough and choppy. What I wanted was a board with the performance of the Flow, with a little bit more of the stability of the Tabou. I had narrowed my search down to looking for something around 8’8” X 31”. After considering every offering from every brand, I settled on the All Good from Blue Planet at exactly 8’8” by 31”, with the same volume as the Flow at 120L, which was achieved by the All Good being thinner by ½” which makes up for the volume added by the extra width. The  extra inch in length is negligible, due to the Flow being a squash tail, and the All Good being a round pin.

The All Good really ended up checking the boxes for me by gaining a little bit of stability while achieving great performance, though it does not quite replace my other boards at the extremes of my usage. I am very happy with the decision, and am really enjoying the new board.
Since the Flow and the All Good are both 120 liter boards, I thought that it would interesting to compare the very different approaches that the two great shapers took in designing a 120L board. Both are great boards, both having plus and minus tradeoffs in their design intents.

Outline: The two boards could not be more different. The Flow has a more pulled in nose, and then carries its width from the wide point all the way back to the rear fins and the squash tail. The All Good is Ύ” wider at the wide point, 3” wider at one foot off the nose, one inch narrower at one foot off the tail, and exactly the same width at the front fins where my rear foot usually surfs. This all results in: the Flow is the faster paddler, since the wide nose of the All Good pushes more water when it is not planing. The All Good planes sooner and longer, once there is enough speed for the wide nose to create lift. The Flow is more like a shortboard in that it likes you to plant your feet in surf stance back near the tail where the volume is, and stay there. The All Good is also happy to surf that way, but also encourages you walk up onto the wide nose if you are tempted. The narrower round pin tail creates a smoother rail to rail transition, as opposed to a squash tail which makes the rail changes more defined; both fun but a different feel. The stable wide nose on the All Good creates more swing weight and visual mass during tight turns; you know that volume is up there. The narrower nose of the Flow virtually disappears when surfing, which is a treat.

Thickness: The ½” narrower center thickness of the All Good was a good tradeoff for me in terms of volume. At my weight (163lbs), I did not need more volume than the Flow, just more width for stability when the water was rough. I think that the thinner profile which makes the standing area sit lower in the water, also helps with the stability. While the deck of the Flow is pretty flat, somehow the deck of the AG seems even flatter because the flat carries further up into the wide nose; both are good.

Rocker: The Flow has more rocker throughout, especially in the nose, and through the mid-section, which makes it fit well into steep hollow waves. The All Good is designed more for planing on slopier waves like Waikiki which is where this family of boards was designed, with a flatter entry and a flatter mid-section. This creates a couple of key differences on the wave. First of all, the flow never pearls, even on the steepest and hollowest drops. Twice in the first few days the AG pearled on a steep takeoff; hopefully I can learn to adjust. On the Flow, I really like to start the bottom turn on my front foot, burying the rail right up to the shoulders, and using that mid section rocker to help create the turn. With the All Good, I can still enter the turn on my front foot, but it likes me to use the extra curve in the rail outline of the rear half of the board for tight turns, which is aided by the accelerating V in the bottom shape. The Flow relies more on bottom rocker, and the All Good relies more on rail curve and bottom V. The rocker through the mid-section and more edgy rails makes the Flow love to be pumped down the line, while the flatter rocker and softer rails of the All Good are happy just to trim down the line more like a longer board, and does not respond as much to pumping at this point (still working on that).

Bottom shape: Once again, these boards have completely opposite approaches. The Flow is a single concave from nose to tail to create lift, bite, and drive. The All Good starts off flat as far as I can tell with a straight edge ruler, starts to show some V in the stance area, and then accelerates that V through the tail. The single concave gives the Flow more lift for paddling and planing, more initial stability, and more grip and drive on the wave face, with a definite black and white transition from rail to rail. The V of the All Good gives it a very smooth roll onto the rail, and very smooth and flowing rail to rail transitions. The Flow needs to be pushed from rail to rail creating drive, while the AG just wants to flow from rail to rail almost on its own. This bottom V is great for fluid surfing, but not for initial stability or speed; a reasonable tradeoff either way. The accelerating V is also a way of adding rocker to the rear rail lines, while keeping the center line rocker flatter for speed and planing  on mellow waves.

Rails: Again the two boards could not be more different. The Flow has the rails of a shortboard that has been blown up, and the All Good has more the rails of a long board that has been shrunk down. This is no surprise since the Flow is actually a short board design that was blown up for SUP, and the All Good is the shortest in their Fun Series of longer boards designed for smaller south shore waves at Waikiki. The rest of the boards in that line range from 9’ to 11’, which really fits for the longboard style egg rails with a higher rail apex. The Flow has much more volume in the rails through the mid section, minimal tuck through the length of the rail, with a bit of an edge coming up off the concave bottom almost all the way up to the nose. The Flow also carries more of the deck volume out into the rails, even though it does drop off some. All of this aids in speed and stability. The All Good has very thin rounded rails all the way back to the front fins, with no edge coming off the bottom, and more of an egg rail with a ton of top and bottom tuck resulting in a thinner, higher apex than the Flow, more like a classic longboard rail until you reach the forward fins, where a hard edge suddenly appears for a clean water release off the tail. This creates a very forgiving rail, with easy flow from rail to rail on mellow waves, at the expense of speed and stability. The rail tuck coming up off the bottom essentially makes the bottom of the board an inch narrower in terms of stability than its outline would indicate.
On the Flow, the rails start to drop from the flat deck just a few inches from the apex of the rails, while the rails on the All Good start to drop down quite a bit starting at 4 ½” from the apex of the rails, which along with the large amount of bottom tuck, creates a much more sloped and thinner rail profile. This early slope from the deck can cause the rails to get sucked down when a cross swell washes over them, but it does assure that a lighter person will have no trouble setting the rail on a larger wave with more speed. If you have ever seen a Joe Blair SUP, the rail profile is very similar. Performance wise, this makes the All Good slightly tippier initially, since the thinner rail with the rounder bottom shape going up to the rail apex, does not resist tipping as much as a fuller rail with less tuck (contrary to some rumors), but once the rail is fully submerged, the extra width of the board kicks in to keep me upright (unless a cross roller rolls over the sloping deck rail and tries to suck it under). Once on the wave, the higher volume mid-section rails of the Flow allow me to weight my front foot more during hard bottom turns, where the thinner rail of the All Good can penetrate too deep on a slower wave, encouraging me to turn a little more off the back foot, at least when at slower speeds. On bigger faster waves, being able to bury this thinner rail may become an asset.
Finish: Both boards have a great finish. The All Good has a much thicker and softer deck pad, which is a mixed blessing. It is much softer on the feet and body which is awesome for long sessions, but absorbs more water, adding weight when it is wet. Both boards use a wood sandwich, with the Sunova using carbon rails, and the Blue Planet using Kevlar rails, with a carbon deck patch on my bamboo model. BP also makes their boards in a more expensive full carbon construction, which is roughly 10% lighter, which would make the weight and price more comparable to the Flow.
Weight: I chose the heavier, less expensive construction on the All Good, just because I was buying without trying. This made it a great deal but pretty heavy. The Carbon option is supposed to come in at 18.4 lbs+/-. The bamboo construction I ordered is supposed to come in at around 20.2 lbs+/- which would have been very close to my other boards, but mine arrived at 22, so noticeably heavier than any of my other boards. The lighter carbon construction Blue Planet offers would make it more similar in weight and price to my other boards. I am rationalizing that the extra weight provides more inertia so that the board does not get knocked around as much by chop and wind, but would pay the extra for the lighter construction if I had it to do again, especially considering the weight my bamboo version came in at.

Performance:
Paddling: The Flow is the faster paddler with its narrower outline, especially in the entry area near the nose. The one time that I really notice this is when trying to sprint out to an outside set. The concave bottom also helps the Flow to get moving under paddle power. The AG tracks straighter with less yaw.
Stability: Very interesting. The thinner and more tapered egg rails, along with the V bottom of the All Good make it feel tippier initially than I was expecting based on the specs, but the extra width in the mid and nose area keep me dryer in the long run once the board tips far enough to kick in the secondary stability from the additional width. With the width focused up in the nose area, the All Good is super stable when climbing up onto the nose to claw into a wave, whereas the width in the tail and less slope in the deck rails makes the Flow more stable when doing pivot turns in front of a wave.
Wave catching. Both boards are amazing at catching anything, though the wider nose on the All Good does let me climb out further on the nose without catching a rail like the Flow can sometimes do because of the narrower shoulders. This morning I caught some knee high rollers on the All Good that never even broke, and rode them for 50 yards playing with turns on the unbroken face; not bad glide for an 8’8”, but something you might expect from a Waikiki inspired board.
Bottom turns. Both boards are outstanding, encouraging tight turns and vertical hooks back up to the lip. I love them both. For me, the Flow demands turning off the front foot to use the rail curve all the way up to the shoulders, and the All Good likes using the rounded outline and V in the rear half of the board. So far I have only been able to surf the AG in small waves, though the one decent head high wave I caught hinted that I might be able to drive the AG off the front foot when there is enough speed not to over-bury the thinner rails through the mid section.
Top turns and roundhouses: The concave bottom on the Flow gives more of a sense of creating drive off the top, while the soft rails and V of the All Good create a very easy flowing feeling.
Late hollow drops: I completely trust the rocker and nose kick of the Flow. The flatter nose rise and flatter mid rocker of the All Good concern me on late or steep drops over a shallow reef, since it looks and feels like it was designed for slopier waves.
Speed down the line: No question that the Flow is faster, due to how well it responds to pumping down the line with its harder rails, concave bottom, lighter weight, and more rocker. I am currently working on addressing this on the All Good by using larger thrusters so that I have more fin to pump against to make up for the softer rails and V bottom which both tend to release water off the rails rather than capturing the energy under the board.
Fin tuning:. I am currently playing with putting larger and stiffer fins on the All Good to increase speed and drive, which seems to be working well so far. Today I put on a set of Colin McPhilips fins, which I am hoping will be the perfect match for my weight on this board. The board is so nice and loose due to the curvy outline and V, that I am focusing on adding drive through the fins; whereas the Sunovas have been the opposite with the concave, channels, and harder rails creating drive, and me needing smaller fins to create looseness. May just be me, but so far I like quads to help channel the water down  the concave bottom on the Flow, and a thruster setup with the center fin working together with the V in the tail of the All Good.

The All Good has proven to be a great addition to my quiver, and makes for an easy transition back and forth with the Flow, depending on conditions, with the Tabou still in backup if conditions get really rough and windy. If I had it to do again, now that I know how much I like the board, I would go with the more expensive carbon option which is supposed to come in at 18.4 lbs+/-, almost 4 lbs, 20%, lighter than my current board, though this time I would ask the shop to weigh the board before shipping, just to make sure it is closer to the target weight.

10

Wingsurfing, Windfoiling, Wingfoiling, Wing SUP / First day on the Wing

« on: May 19, 2019, 12:08:38 AM »

With some inspiration from PonoBill's thread, I went out today for a first try at the Wing. Like Pono, I was smart enough to hire Alan Cadiz on Maui for some instruction. I would not say that controlling the Wing is difficult, but there are a few tricks Alan taught that were easy once you knew them, but would have made for a long miserable day if I had tried without his instruction. The lesson was certainly worth it, and I would highly recommend.
The wind was about 20 when we started, built to a steady 25+ by the time we were in the water, and we were using a 3 meter wing. Started off with land work to get the skills of controlling the Wing, both for when things were going right, and if things went wrong.
First day was on a beginner windsurf board (200 liters). We did two runs on our knees just to master handling the wing, being able to sail upwind, and making a tight clean jibe without having to worry about balance; smart progression, especially in high winds and very choppy water. Pretty easy to sail out, jibe, and by the second run come back to near where we started. For anyone with a windsurfing background, this part is pretty easy (once Alan told us the tricks). Both of us in the lesson were in our late 60s, so the hard part turned out to be getting to our feet. Imagine getting to your feet on a SUP in 25 mph crosswinds, with large confused wind chop, while holding both hands over your head, so no paddle to brace with. At least for us, the Wing did not provide any significant lift to help you up like a windsurfing sail or kite would. Not too bad if you are young and limber; trickier if you have old stiff joints. Happily, both of us old guys in the lesson got to our feet after two to four attempts. Once you are up, sailing around is fairly easy if you have any basic windsurfing skills, but we were moving pretty slow on the big board, even in the 25+mph winds. Jibing on the big board is not too challenging if you are experienced at switching your feet without rocking the board.
After this first day, I would agree with those who say that the key to the Wing's appeal would be in the next step of getting it on a foil. Without the underwater low-drag efficiency of a foil, the Wing does not have the power of a windsurfing sail or kite to power a board through the water. After the lesson, Alan and one of the other instructors went out and foiled around around with the Wing, and they were blasting around very impressively in the 25+mph winds, having a great time. Alan's skill with jibing and tacking the Wing/Foil combination is very impressive, never dropping out of flight.

11

Gear Talk / Naish Hokua 9'0" X 28.75

« on: August 20, 2017, 10:34:46 PM »

Hi all. We are off in a couple of days to Costa Rica for a ten day surf trip. One of the boards that I have the option of reserving is a Naish Hokua 9'0" X 28.75 @ 125 liters (I don't know the year, but I know that it has a concave deck).
My current favorite boards are an 8'10"X 29" Speeed @ 130 liters, and an 8'7" X 30" Flow @ 121 liters. Any feedback on how the Naish might compare, and whether it might be a good board for me to reserve for this trip? They do have some other options that are more similar to the Flow in terms of specs, but from an unknown South American brand. I am 163 lbs (74 kilos) and a moderately advanced rider, but 66 years old with bad hips and back which makes climbing back on a board a clumsy and very painful experience.
Thanks in advance for any help.

12

Travel, Trips, Destinations / Advice on Tamarindo Costa Rica?

« on: August 07, 2017, 10:49:57 AM »

Hi all. We are leaving in a couple of weeks for our first surf trip to Costa Rica. We are going to be staying in Tamarindo, and would appreciate any knowledge or advice on the area, both SUP surfing and anything else. We are hiring a local SUP guide (Marco) to drive us to different breaks each morning, and then will be on our own for afternoon and evening sessions. We are staying on the beach at the Hotel Diria (no car), and don't mind paddling a mile or so to find uncrowded waves.
Any thoughts on: best breaks to be sure to get to (particularly rights), tides, uncrowded waves to paddle to near town for afternoon or evening sessions, restaurants in the area (not fancy or expensive), whether or not to exchange money, tipping, anything culturally to be aware of when interacting with the locals, anything special to pack, etc.
Thanks for any advice.

13

Gear Talk / RS Pro paddle grip

« on: August 01, 2017, 10:35:40 AM »

I am wondering if any has tried this. I am thinking about using it on our downwind paddles, and then if we love it adding it to our surf paddles. I borrowed some friends race paddles that had windsurf boom grip on the shaft and found it to feel pretty nice, but that thick rubber material adds some weight, especially when wet.
I would love to hear from anyone who has any experience with this product. https://www.rspro.org/collections/paddle-accessories/products/paddle-grip-rspro-hexa

14

Downwind and Racing / Fin drive?

« on: July 26, 2017, 10:11:47 PM »

On the forum I have read comments about having enough fin area, or base, on a downwind board to generate "drive". Burchas made a comment along those lines regarding the new Naish board today.
I have a comfortable understanding of using lateral pressure against a fin to generate speed on a windsurfer, and clearly a larger fin can transfer more lateral pressure into forward drive at lower speeds. I have a vision of how lateral leg drive against the fin(s) on a surf board or surf SUP can generate forward drive and it is generally agreed that larger fins or fins with more base area can help in creating more forward drive through a turn. However, I don't have an image of how a fin on a downwind board would generate drive, since in my mind there is little to no lateral pressure that the fin can transfer into forward drive. Could someone give a good explanation of what is meant by "drive" from the fin on a downwind board?

15

Downwind and Racing / Starting to get it.

« on: July 23, 2017, 09:23:15 PM »

We (wife and I) had our best day yet of downwinding by far during a run in Kihei today on our F16s. Perfect conditions with the wind averaging 26-29 straight down the coast, with gust to 35. For the first time we spent more time surfing than paddling, which is what we have been shooting for. In case there are any other newbies out there like us trying to figure this sport out, here are some of the things that seemed to contribute to today's fun (I have to say that after talking to the other paddlers on Maui, including all of the great people on the Maliko shuttle, I would swear that we are the only people on the planet that are not already experts at this sport, very humbling):
1. I am getting a better sense that the steepest waves are not always the best to catch, but it is the ones right behind those with the more drawn out slope that are often the best glides, with of course less chance of pearling into the wave in front. (Though the steep ones are certainly the most exciting if I can manage to catch them and not pearl into the next one.)
2. Rather than just studying the bumps visually, I am starting to feel when the energy in the water is ready to accelerate the board. Before I would always paddle hard when it looked good, but this did not always result in a glide. This feeling through the board and my feet is proving to be a better indicator. This gave me a much better sense of when to paddle easily just to keep the ball spinning, and when to go into power mode to catch a glide.
3. I have figured out that, at least with the F16, it is almost always better to catch bigger bumps with an angle across the swell rather than straight down it. Just like surfing, it is a lot faster trimming along the face of a wave rather than just riding straight ahead on it.
4.In the past, once I was on a glide, I would steer the board where I thought it should go based on visually reading the water. I still do that to some degree, but I am also trying to feel the different cross energies during the glide, and let the board respond to those different cross pulses without over-controlling it. I think that many of my previous falls were from trying to force the issue with the rudder or rails, either trying to rail steer the board against where it wanted to go or trying to force it to stay flat. Today I focused on softening my ankles and allowing the board to harmonize with the cross rollers and cross pulses of energy. It sometimes surprised me where the board wanted to go, but it almost always worked out better than when I tried to force it to go where I thought was the best line.
5. I am getting better at moving my feet quickly and often to use the whole length of the board. Before I would take step back on a fast glide, but I am discovering that one step is often not enough. Today I was regularly going from the tiller all the way back to the fin, and every place in between. Credit this to studying all of the videos of Jeremy's footwork. He is often either on the tiller, or all the way back over the fin, with less time in between than I was previously spending.
6. I finally tried a coiled leash today, rather than the big thick 12 footer that I have been using. Either it made a big difference, or my technique improved more than what seems reasonable. I was able to generate more speed to catch bigger bumps than I could never catch directly before, and maintain more speed longer which allowed connection after connection.
7. When I am right back over the fin, I am working on more of a "soul arch" stance, and less bent forward. Once again, credit to Jeremy.
8. In the beginning I was underestimating the power needed in those critical strokes to catch bumps, especially larger and faster ones. I was paddling more like I would if I was paddling back out through the surf, instead of how I would if I was paddling to catch and surf a big fast moving wave.
9. One of the biggest differences today was in the direction that I was riding. Kihei always has larger swells coming from the right, and smaller bumps coming from the left, and almost nothing going straight down the coast. Up until today, I would usually need to catch the smaller bumps coming from the left, and then hope to connect to the bigger ones coming from the right. I spent 90% of my time riding right. Today I was able to easily catch the larger bumps coming from the right, and spent 90% of my time riding left usually resulting in longer glides and more connections. This was a 180 degree change for me, and I attribute it to a combination of all the above factors.
Many thanks to everyone on this forum for sharing their advice, and for their patience with my newbie questions. One thing for sure, even after today, I have many downwind days ahead of being humbled and tumbled, but today did feel like a huge step in the right direction.