Author Topic: This shit has to stop.  (Read 10653 times)

stoneaxe

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This shit has to stop.
« on: December 29, 2016, 11:52:00 AM »
I've had 3 people I know die from drug overdoses this year. All of them originally given oxy for pain after accidents. They all had issues that contributed but the easy access to opiates is ridiculous and the common thread.
I just don't understand...other than the big $$$ that pharma gives to campaigns...why the production of pain meds was allowed to increase in such dramatic fashion from the 90's to now. And to hear that the company that brought us Oxy also brought us drug advertising. I wonder how much it costs to take the stain of 1,000's of deaths out of your soul?
Bob

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surfshaver

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2016, 12:08:43 PM »
It's even worse than you think.  Purdue Pharma, the company that "created" Oxycontin, spent millions lobbying the FDA and Congress to get a cheap opiate approved for a 12-hour dosage cycle.  The problem was, it didn't work.  The drug doesn't relieve pain for 12 hours.  Because of Purdue's power and money, they convinced everyone in the health care system to prescribe the drug on a 12 hour use case.  They did this to claim the drug was "new" and could be sold at a premium. 

People started using the drug and found their pain came back after 6-8 hours, forcing them to either a: up their dosage or b: take the drug more often.  So essentially the lie that the drug would work for 12 hours set patients up for a cycle of addiction.  When the evidence of this became clear, Purdue just saw it as a benefit as patients needed more pills.  Purdue has made billions off of turning suffering people into opiate addicts -- on purpose.

The family that owns Purdue -- the Sackler family -- is worth over 20 billion.  They have many fine art museums named after them.  Including, I'm embarrassed to report, one at my university alma mater.

Oxycontin is truly the definition of evil.

SUPcheat

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2016, 12:16:32 PM »
Drug addiction is a periodic epidemic with built in generational amnesia, so the cycle repeats over and over.  Right now, the "liberal" attitude is to legalize everything because there is no such thing as addiction, drugs don't change you, personal recognizance is a blessed freedom, and you can use forever and it will always "work".

After huge waves of dysfunction, tragedy and mass death, the wheel turns again to backlash, and things go draconian for a time until the generational amnesia sets in again.

Also, our society, media, movies and TV are saturated with the lobbies that present alcohol, tobacco and drug use as funny, or the cure-all for every little upset without consequences. Consequences are only shown when they have some kind of limited dramatic intent.  The consequences shown are certainly entirely unrelated to the consequences that real people experience in real life.  Cigarettes are shown as a harmless, attractive, optional habit.  Silver screen scars toss off booze and wine like water but seldom get drunk and don't get particularly ugly either physically or behaviorally, or it's an emotionally "justified" binge. Mainstream media have become huge advertisement for these lobbies. They inject lots of money to keep the portrayals in the public eye.  I heard a few years ago that popular movie stars can get upwards of a million dollars just to allow their characters to smoke onscreen.

The sad fact is that as long as somebody can get rich from your misery and sell it to you, they will do so any way they can.  Also, the demand is so enormous and there so much money to be made, it is basically un-stoppable.  I attended a professional conference many years ago hosted by the DEA, and the agents basically painted a portrait of an impossible task.

 At that time, they also said that the "legitimate" Big Pharma companies were all setting up drug factories around the world to service the brown bag mail order drug trade at arm's length away from prosecution.

If you want to see an example of the "backlash" phase, just read what is currently going on in the Philippines.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2016, 12:45:39 PM by SUPcheat »
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Quickbeam

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2016, 12:39:45 PM »
The daughter of one of my best friends was involved in a car accident a couple of years ago (not the daughters’ fault). Her doctor prescribed her Oxycontin for the pain and thus the nightmare started. The daughter became an addict and they went through a very, very difficult time. I’m pleased to report that the daughter is now clean and living a fairly normal life. She still claims that if it wasn’t for the support of her Mother (my friend) she would be dead.
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Badger

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2016, 02:49:16 PM »

Alcohol and tobacco kill way more people than opiates. It amazes me how some people don't even consider them to be drugs.

One commonality I see among addicts is that they often don't have any hobbies or interests outside of always trying to feel good. Their whole world revolves around either drugs, sex or food.

One of the things I love about standup surfing is that you have to be healthy to succeed at it and progress. It can be a potentially healthy addiction. Good for the body, mind and soul.

« Last Edit: December 29, 2016, 03:02:47 PM by Badger »
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PonoBill

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2016, 04:09:16 PM »
Here's a little thread creep. If you're wondering why kids are spending their life staring at their phones, here's a partial answer--they get a little shot of dopamine when someone answers their text. social media is an addiction. You might think that's an exaggeration, or that it minimizes the nature of "real" addiction. Ten minutes of observing the actions of kids in a shopping mall should relieve you of that assumption.
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digger71

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2016, 04:15:20 PM »
I'm no Chris Christie fan, and certainly don't want to open a pro-life discussion, but this is a very interesting take on addiction and how society should deal with addicts.


surfcowboy

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2016, 05:54:47 PM »
As a person who's been surrounded by addicts for the last 50 years I can say that a hobby won't keep you clean and the disease model is a real thing (no matter how you choose to treat it.) Lack of hobbies is a symptom, not a cause. (Correlation not causation.)

Prescription opiates have taken a lot of my friends and while of course cigarettes and alcohol are all over and bad, they aren't prescribed by healthcare professionals who make money for recommending them. Don't forget that little distinction.

You're right, it's got to be stopped. I'm hoping medical MJ can have an impact. There a lot of housewives who are being destroyed by Benzos when an edible would treat them far more safely. Ironically down South, weed has a much worse stigma than Oxy among the upstanding citizens who are hooked (as opposed to street users.)

For the record, I don't use any of it and whole not an alcoholic I seldom even drink but I have addiction (thankfully treated and managed by 12 step recovery) in my family. So I know it well and often volunteer to support families of addicts and alcoholics. Reach out anytime if you need help or want to refer and friend.

End it now. Replace these drugs and restrict their application.

PonoBill

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2016, 06:49:02 PM »
Why is pseudoephedrine flowing in from Mexico? It comes from India. Could have been stopped when it was a little cold medicine that occasionally got abused, but now it's a multi-billion dollar product, and its use has very little to do with colds.

To fix any of these issues requires rational government, that isn't building agencies to increase political power and control jobs. In other words, it requires something very different from what we have.
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stoneaxe

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #9 on: December 29, 2016, 07:10:26 PM »
That truly is what angers me the most....how much more proof do we need that our government is corrupt than the fact that no tobacco execs were ever perp walked for the millions they've killed and that our government is now in the cigarette business? Why are medical costs skyrocketing....big pharma spending billions to advertise products that no lay person should be requesting...shit we have medicine for opiod induced constipation.....quite the racket...medicine for the medicine.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2016, 07:14:12 PM by stoneaxe »
Bob

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PonoBill

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2016, 07:26:35 PM »
We expect our government to be altruistic and honorable--two things we really don't consistently require of ourselves or the people around us. In fact altruism is so rare that we celebrate every example. How could we expect them to act differently than they do? I think part of the answer is to restructure government service enough to change the incentive structure. What that looks like I'm just not sure. It probably doesn't include people holding office for their entire lives.

The ONLY reason I hold some hope out for useful changes from the Trump presidency is that it will be very different from what we've experienced before.  The notion of corporate democrats is a strange one, though history should make me more comfortable contemplating that than I am. People might find Hillary appealing, but no one can pretend that voting for her would do anything but preserve the status quo. At least I don't think they can--there might be someone, somewhere...
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stoneaxe

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #11 on: December 29, 2016, 07:29:01 PM »
So random....good family, kids have had all the opportunities you could ask for with successful parents...the younger brother is best friend with my son-in-law and is a straight shooter...literally..Secret Service agent. I've known him and his brother most their lives.....his brother just got married, had a baby, life is good.....different paths.
Bob

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Ichabod Spoonbill

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #12 on: December 30, 2016, 03:54:01 AM »
In eighteen months I lost three former students to heroin overdoses.

I teach in a pretty wealthy community, but it's also very rural and isolated. Kids can't walk down the road to see their friends. Their parents have to drive them everywhere. There's little to do and no real community center, except at the school where I work. Kids need to get out and play. They need to go out and take risks with their friends, break a few bones, come home with stories. They also need to create their own worlds, not have it given to them by their parents and electronic devices.

Of course, that's not the whole story, but my location (Westchester/Putnam County, NY) has had more heroin overdoses than almost anywhere in the country. We also had the kid of a former neighbor overdose. That's four kids gone. So awful. I still had the younger sister of one of the kids who died. I did my best to care about her and accept her for her punkish self, something that stood out in my jockish school. I told her she was fine by me, and I liked her styles.
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lucabrasi

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #13 on: December 30, 2016, 06:17:01 AM »
John has had a horrible accident and is in pain. Pain is a funny thing.  I discovered that and gave it much thought after I had knee surgery quite a few years ago.  I don't dismiss another's pain as I may have once have. Anyway, what doctor out there wouldn't want their patients pain to stop? How do you remedy that part of the equation? Yes, I know every community has that doctor they can go to and get their fix but there are lots of examples for these drugs to be prescribed for the right reasons, at least to start with. That's been said here and is why the thread started. 
The fact it is prescribed from a doctor changes so much in many peoples minds. Makes it ok. A well respected teacher, head of the high school honor society, and devoted member of her church got to the point she was breaking into her neighbors house to take the pills there. Her prescription wasn't enough anymore. (we always wondered why her honor society speeches rambled willy nilly).  Plastered in the small community newspaper (which really pissed me off). 
How do you take physical pain away without making addicts?  Many of us are predisposed to addiction for whatever reason. Many may have it waiting in the wings and life's circumstances opens that door at that time.
Pharmaceutical companies really need to be more responsible but that really only is part of it I think tho I got no idea what the rest may be. Edibles and other forms should be seriously considered but still only a partial remedy.
Make a person's pain stop without potential for other consequences I guess is the question? Hell, surgery is still a new thing in the grand scope of things.
 

1tuberider

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Re: This shit has to stop.
« Reply #14 on: December 30, 2016, 07:34:41 AM »
I live with pain everyday. Sometimes its so bad, I have trouble walking. After surfing it gets worse.
I go home and bellyache and my wife says Quit your complaining and learn to deal with it.
That is enough medicine for me. Deal with it.
Came home from having two teeth extracted from an Oregon dentist. I get home and pain is intense,
so I go to Wal Mart to fill prescription. Pharmacist says he cannot fill prescription due to drug illegal in
California. I say I had two teeth pulled and I need pain relief. He says tough luck. I had to go home and
deal with it.
When I was ko'd and woke up in ER after a one wheel accident, doctor said after getting a major concussion and ten
staples to go home and deal with it. I really enjoy my one wheel. I now wear a helmet, motocross body armor, padded underwear, wrist guards and knee pads. Kids say I look like the terminator. At least I wear protection now and jump
up and go again after crazy hard crashes. Learned to deal with it.
Sure glad I do not have a drug addiction. I might have a pain addiction.
Grand father had cancer in his bones. He had a morphine prescription. He hated the drug so much he thew it
out and dealt with it.

More doctors should prescribe "Go home and deal with it". 
Pain is no friend but at least I know I am alive. Its better
than having a drug addiction that ruins your life and effects your family members.
Learn to deal with it. Simple fix.

 


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