Author Topic: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board  (Read 2060 times)

APPST_Paddle

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Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« on: October 28, 2016, 08:40:03 AM »
Ok, so I know this one has been beat to death, but I wanted to check a few things I'm noticing. I'm on a 8'8 Naish Hokua X32 and a 10'1 JL B&B. After watching video of myself, I've noticed I can easily pivot turn the B&B, but when it comes to getting my foot back far enough on the Hokua, I'm failing.

I ride with a staggered stance, and laterally my foot placement looks solid, front foot in the middle of the stringer, back foot on a rail. The issue is that my back foot is probably a few inches above my front fins (quad setup) and my front foot is in front of the handle.

So, here are my questions:

1. For the people who are getting their foot back to the stomp pad - where are you feet as you start to paddle for the wave. Is your front foot above, even, or behind the handle?
2. Can you get your foot all the way back in slow, sluggish waves or do you need a certain amount of power to get going?
3. Does dropping down in volume and maybe going from a slowish/stable board (my 8'8" hokua X32) to something a bit quicker and less volume help with this process?
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Bean

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2016, 08:48:33 AM »
It depends on the pitch of the wave and wind speed and direction.

For instance, on a mushy wave with strong offshore winds, I take off with my lead foot weighted and way ahead of the handle while on a steep wave I will take off a little back with my weight more centered.

stoneaxe

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2016, 10:40:26 AM »
What Bean said...every wave can be different. Also depends on how you want to surf. My Foote can be surfed more like a longboard or more like a shortboard, just depends on mood. On one wave I might never get near the stomp the next I might ride most of the wave from there. I'm less likely to get to the tail in slow mushy waves unless I'm goofing around, stalling and restarting, or stalling and then heading to the nose. For most of the waves around here I takeoff in surf stance in the center of the board with the front foot weighted to get things moving, once on it depends on what I want to do.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2016, 10:43:02 AM by stoneaxe »
Bob

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RATbeachrider

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2016, 02:31:21 PM »
What is the measurement from the front of the front fins to the front of the handle of the Hokua and how tall are you?

supthecreek

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2016, 03:19:47 PM »
APPST
I almost never get back to the Stomper on any board I ride.... with the exception being my Longboard SUPs... I stomp them, when I want to whip it around!

I just looked a a lot of pictures and videos on different boards... most of my driving turns are done with the same basic foot positioning.
I walk around a lot... but the feet end up here:
Front foot on or just behind the handle
Back foot above the side bite, on the turnside rail

Same on my 8'10 Speeed or 9'4 Acid... or smaller boards.
I think this is because I don't have the leg strength anymore, to push the tail out in a slider.... so I stick to more carving turns.

Pics and vid are on my 9'4 Acid, so bigger than your board.... still no need to get on the stomper.
Note in the pics... my feet are in the exact same spot when turning.... even though the vid will show you I run all over the place.



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supthecreek

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2016, 03:23:27 PM »
Note..... the handle is the RED thingy.... the thin black slot in front of my foot is the mast track for windSUPing
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stoneaxe

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2016, 03:54:43 PM »
I was thinking about this as I was working on my Foote tonight. I don't actually have a stomp back there, the NSI proto tail handle looks like the back of a stomp but in front of that I added black diamonds, pad over existing pad. The two rows in front and the middle of the 3rd have come off and need replacing, the rear are still there, tells me clearly how far back I'm getting. I think how much I can move around on this board and change how I ride it is why I love it so much, last time out was in great conditions here on the south shore....I had steep drops and turns that had me almost on the tail handle and I had both feet on the logo for one long smooth one.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2016, 04:01:41 PM by stoneaxe »
Bob

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nalu-sup

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2016, 04:00:12 PM »
When paddling for the wave my front can be anywhere from just behind the handle to up on the nose forward of the deck pad, depending on how steep and hollow the wave, and how early or late the takeoff. Then as the board starts to drop in, I move my front foot a few inches behind the handle and reach back with my back foot to a place on the rail over the fins; in my case usually more over the front fins for the bottom turn, and more over the rear fin(s) for the cutback. The key for me in learning this process was figuring out that it is not so much about stepping your body back, but more of a feeling of stretching your back foot well back behind you. Often as I am dropping in and first setting the rail, my body is still forward and up over my front foot, then the back foot drives the rail and fins though the turn. Having the rear foot reaching back on the board is different than moving your body and weight back which I think creates more of a pivot turn and less of a carve, and can tend to stall your speed.
To your question, slow mushy waves often mean having your weight forward to keep speed up, and you can do this either by standing more forward, or keeping most of your weight on the front foot while the rear foot is reaching back behind you. Of course if you are not turning and are just trimming for speed, then you do not need that rear foot back there, and can move both feet up towards the center or up to the nose.
I am not sure about lower volume being helpful, but shorter length certainly is. As someone pointed out, the distance from the handle back to the fins is relevant. If you need to keep your front foot weighted up near the handle, a longer board can be a long stretch back to the fins, and especially if you are trying to reach the stomp pad. My wife's 7'11" is 6" less of a reach back than my 8'10". One stylish solution you will see on longer boards is the drop knee turn which allows the toes of the rear foot to reach much further back than a normal surfing stance would allow.
Bottom line; I think that the biggest challenge in getting the rear foot back far enough is that many of us make the mistake while we are learning of shifting our body weight back which stalls the board and makes it turn off the tail instead of the rail. Instead, keep your head and body weight up over the front foot, and stretch your back foot far behind you to control the rail and drive off of the fins.
Hope some of that makes sense.
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APPST_Paddle

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2016, 07:49:43 PM »
APPST
I almost never get back to the Stomper on any board I ride.... with the exception being my Longboard SUPs... I stomp them, when I want to whip it around!

I just looked a a lot of pictures and videos on different boards... most of my driving turns are done with the same basic foot positioning.
I walk around a lot... but the feet end up here:
Front foot on or just behind the handle
Back foot above the side bite, on the turnside rail

Same on my 8'10 Speeed or 9'4 Acid... or smaller boards.
I think this is because I don't have the leg strength anymore, to push the tail out in a slider.... so I stick to more carving turns.

Pics and vid are on my 9'4 Acid, so bigger than your board.... still no need to get on the stomper.
Note in the pics... my feet are in the exact same spot when turning.... even though the vid will show you I run all over the place.




Yeah, so I've watched Soloshot and Drone videos of myself surfing, and with my 10'1 JL B&B, no problem getting way back and pivot turning, generally on smaller, slower waves, so that makes sense. When I see myself on the Hokua X32 in decent waves, I'm making small carves up and down the wave, but I need to get further back to really crank bottom turns.
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manta

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #9 on: October 28, 2016, 11:48:10 PM »
I have an 8.3 Hokua also 32 inch. For me to be stable I need to stand just in front of the handle.
The board is a challenge because it is so wide for the length and the nose and tail are very pulled in.
To catch waves I need to get quite forward to drop in effectively. Once on I move back but have also been steering the board more from the rail than the tail. I've found right back on the tail the board stalls easier so moving the foot to the rail on the side you want to turn is very effective.
For a true cut back you need to be on the tail but that is reserved for the larger faster waves.
The x32 is a very forgiving performance board but not in the same league as its narrower brethren.
HTH.

APPST_Paddle

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2016, 09:19:12 AM »
I have an 8.3 Hokua also 32 inch. For me to be stable I need to stand just in front of the handle.
The board is a challenge because it is so wide for the length and the nose and tail are very pulled in.
To catch waves I need to get quite forward to drop in effectively. Once on I move back but have also been steering the board more from the rail than the tail. I've found right back on the tail the board stalls easier so moving the foot to the rail on the side you want to turn is very effective.
For a true cut back you need to be on the tail but that is reserved for the larger faster waves.
The x32 is a very forgiving performance board but not in the same league as its narrower brethren.
HTH.

Manta - this is spot on. I was in pretty consistent waist to chest waves with some decent push this morning, and really worked on getting back, again it was much easier on my backside, but I definitely lose speed and the board becomes sluggish when I try and get way back near the stomp. It's happy spot seems to be right around the front fins on the quad setup.

So, this is pushing me more towards moving to a lower volume board with thinner rails and a bit more speed.
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robcasey

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2016, 01:36:43 PM »
2 thoughts - One, when doing your pivot, don't remove the blade from the water. Skim the blade flat over the surface (sweeping brace) on your recovery (or slide vertically through the water on recovery) these tips will keep you more stable in bumps and/or pivots.  Get low when turning so your paddle while on the water is fully extended (squat means more paddle extension) like an outrigger.  Keep the blade moving. Stalling looking for balance usually means a swim. 

When I see some folks doing pivots, their feet are to far apart and in surf stance. Keep the feet a bit closer and maybe your rear foot pointed towards the nose. Make sure you have one foot on either side of the center.
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Billekrub

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2016, 06:49:05 PM »
. . .Bottom line; I think that the biggest challenge in getting the rear foot back far enough is that many of us make the mistake while we are learning of shifting our body weight back which stalls the board and makes it turn off the tail instead of the rail. Instead, keep your head and body weight up over the front foot, and stretch your back foot far behind you to control the rail and drive off of the fins.
Hope some of that makes sense.

Yes, makes sense, thanks for confirming this.

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Re: Foot Placement - Getting back on the board
« Reply #13 on: November 14, 2016, 10:07:14 PM »
Sounds like you're worrying about the wrong thing, it's not foot placement that will help your turns, it's how you move on the board. An 8'8" and a 10'1" are pretty big boards, you shouldn't be surfing them like a shortboard, with your feet locked in place. On boards that size, where your feet are depends on where you are in the wave and what you're doing--and what you want to do. If you want to turn from the rail, then it sounds like you're there, if you are looking to tighten up your turn, then you need both feet further back--you won't gain control in a stinkbug position, with your feet too far apart, you can't shift your weight from foot to foot. Getting back to the kick pad is an easy step. Shift most of your weight to your back foot. Bring your front foot back almost to your back foot along the stringer with your remaining weight equal on heel and toe. Transfer weight to the front foot and step back to the pad. I see people trying the opposite, stepping back with their back foot into a stinkbug, and then trying to get their front foot back--clumsy and not likely to keep the board flat.

Even though the move is simple, it's a little counterintuitive, so you should practice it at home.
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