Author Topic: You could have this or you could have that  (Read 10201 times)

Lobes

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #15 on: December 29, 2010, 10:11:07 PM »
Racing surf ski is a magnitude more difficult to balance on than a outrigger so I tend to agree with jonathan and rpmoore it's a better x-trainer and will work different muscles etc.

However Daves advice is probably right about the extra incentive in an OC-6 to work harder because of the team environment. But that means all your training sessions rely on 5 other people. Not much room for spontaneity. If I was you I'd be getting a 14' racing sup. It's totally different to your current board will be like moving from a bmx to racing bike to further the cycling analogy.

LaPerouseBay

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #16 on: December 29, 2010, 11:04:08 PM »
I've been very happy in the oc-1 for 8 months, it's done wonders for my stroke.  

Cheating on the ama is starting to get a lot of my attention.  I try to bring as much discipline as possible to staying balanced, keeping the ama light.  But it's like having training wheels on a bike.  Particularly when things get tough.    

I'd love to try a ski.  I've heard they can tax your aerobic capacity more than a canoe.  Probably due in large part to the fact that there is no cheating.  It may look like they are going easy, but I'm guessing there is a lot going on just to keep from going over.  The balance and speed remind me a bit of speed skating.   Looks easy - until you try it!  
 



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ericspin

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #17 on: December 30, 2010, 03:02:10 AM »
If I was you I'd be getting a 14' racing sup. It's totally different to your current board will be like moving from a bmx to racing bike to further the cycling analogy.


Yeah, I certainly haven't given up on the 14' race board idea.  Speaking of that one of the boards on my short list has been the Coreban Alpha Race 14.  Anyone else but me notice that it has mysteriously been removed from their website lineup?  I have received some reports of way less than stellar performance from this board from some recent events outside the US.  Disappointing because the Coreban folks that I have dealt with have been really cool people and super stoked about their product.  Anyone?  BTW, not hatin' here just an observation.

I remain really drawn to the OC-1 and will get my first go in one next Monday.  Cannot wait.  One of the things I like about the OC is the versatility.  I can go out on flat days and hammer.  I can go out on crappy days and play in the rough water.  Or I can go out and cruise with the wife on her sit on top kayak.  That's appealing.  While the ski would be a great training tool especially in the primarily flat waters of the west coast of FL, it seems to me to be more specialized in what I can do with it.  Or at least it seems that way to me.  What do I know.  That's why I asked for all of you guys opinions.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2010, 03:03:55 AM by ericspin »

rpmooreii

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #18 on: December 30, 2010, 01:46:08 PM »
The surfski is exponentially harder to learn than an OC-1 which is why so many people opt for the outrigger (of course an elite OC-1 paddler flies the ama continuously which is even harder than a ski).  That said anybody that can balance well on a SUP in waves/rough water should be able to paddle at least a novice ski pretty quickly.

I believe (and my personal experience has shown) that surfski as a cross training tool is BETTER than OC-1 at least for those who compete at a high level in OC-6.   The biggest reason is that the ski teaches one how to get a big shoulder turn (twist) while staying balanced... that is not true in an OC-1... and it translates to a super well balanced OC-6.  If you think flying the ama on an OC-1 is hard, try it in an OC-6 with 5 other guys all of whom are moving.  The OC-1 allows one to cheat on the ama which allows a lunging style stroke that will never be good. 

Getting that well balanced shoulder turn and conjunction w/ the great tempo that comes from a two sided paddle is a great asset to SUP paddlers who do not have a background in other (unstable) paddlecraft.

Lastly, if you learn to paddle a ski well you will not believe how many open water swells you can catch.  In a recent Molokai crossing the King of Surfski (Oscar Chulupsky) AVERAGED 13mph for over 30 miles!!! Nobody will ever come close to that on an OC-1 or SUP.

...Roger

ericspin

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #19 on: December 30, 2010, 03:03:01 PM »
Roger, thanks for all your information.  As I mentioned in my previous post one of the things that I like about the idea of the OC-1 is the option to hang at a leisurely pace with my wife while she is on her sit on top kayak.  In the grand scheme it's not something I would do all the time but I bet I would want to do that about once a week.  I know that it would seem more appropriate to SUP with my wife while she kayaks but there is a disconnect that happens with me standing and her sitting.  I don't want to focus on this too much but it is a goal of mine with this new purchase.  If I had to place percentages on this I would say that 70% of this paddling is alone in a fitness/training mode and 30% with the wife.  I have a long history in sea kayaks so the mechanics of the ski are not unfamiliar.  As a result of all my SUP paddling I have really become disinterested in the idea of sitting "in" a boat while paddling.  One of the aspects of the OC that I like.  I feel very trapped when I paddle the yak these days.  Damned shame as I recently purchased a QCC Q700x which is a great boat but just not for me anymore.    Of course, the ski would give me the same freedom.  So what are your thoughts regarding a boat like an Epic V8 or V10 Sport.  Too tame?  Good place to start?  Handle a bit of racing?      

Bald Brother

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #20 on: December 30, 2010, 03:16:18 PM »
Eric

I have a friend who had a real similar evolution: became very proficient on the kayak and once he tried SUP...bam...he's been hooked. If you want to stand up, a 14 footer is ideal. I have a 12'1 and it is not enough glide for me, though it surfs fairly well. I faced your dilemma and found a beautiful 19 ft Bark (still for sale I think in the Tampa area), a Naish (owned by Ian Balding), and loved the look of the SIC (but emailed and no one ever got back to me). In the end, after talking with Ian, I opted to get an Ian Balding 14 foot custom race board and the price was very fair.

Good luck w/ your decision.

rpmooreii

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #21 on: December 30, 2010, 03:58:56 PM »
The V10 Sport or Fenn Mako XT are good intermediate skis and they can definitely still be raced.  In fact, until one becomes very good at surfski most people are MUCH faster in the "slower" boats because they can focus on stroke mechanics and not be forced to brace all the time.  I always recommend that a new ski paddler pick up a cheap, stable used boat (say an old Valhalla)... you can learn the stroke and balance and sell it for the same price you paid.  Then, step up to a better boat like a XT or V10Sport or if you are really committed (4-5days/week) go for a Mako Elite or V10.

FWIW, I had a ski and a OC-1 at the same time and the OC-1 just sat on the rack once I was good enough to stay upright on the ski.  The other aspect of the OC-1 that I hated was all the parts... the ama, the iakos, the seat.  Invariably I would forget something and have to go home to get it.  Add on all the time to put together and disassemble and strap the parts to my roof rack... and the OC-1 ended up in someone else's garage :o)

Good luck however you choose to proceed and happy new year!

...Roger

ericspin

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2011, 08:50:17 AM »
Looks like I have made up my mind to go with the 14' race board.  I am really leaning pretty hard toward the Starboard Race 14.  I tend to over think this shiite.  My mind keeps telling me that as soon as I make a decision a cooler board will come on the market.  Jeez, I'm acting like Brett Favre.  As fast as these race boards are evolving I guess there is no way to avoid that.  Hey maybe if I go with the SB Race I could get them to photoshop me into the next catalog.  Well, on second thought maybe not.  I don't think I could rip the surf on a 14 race board.

I really appreciate all the responses in this thread.


surf monkey

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2011, 09:15:04 AM »
Sounds like a good choice, seems like the top race boards are about the same in speed the main thing is you have a board that keeps you in the game. Your wife should be able to paddle it on the calm days and you can paddle the old board.

I would love to have that board

good luck

ericspin

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2011, 02:10:55 PM »
I knew I wasn't gonna be able to resist.....


Took her out for a quick one hour paddle. Now I see what you guys mean when you talk about gliiiiide. Very nice. Shakedown cruise tomorrow.

JonathanC

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2011, 02:44:48 PM »
Nice !!!!!! ;D

rpmooreii

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2011, 06:17:41 PM »
Looks great congrats.  But you still need to try a surfski if you really want to go fast :o)

...R

ericspin

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #27 on: January 03, 2011, 06:55:43 PM »
Roger, I really fretted over this decision and would love to have had enough extra cash to spring for both.  In the end a big part of my decision is that the SUP community is really growing and strengthening in my area.  As I mentioned earlier in this thread I was an avid road cyclist for years (until I started SUP) and I have missed the social aspect of the cycling community.  I see that type of community growing amongst the SUPrs in my area and I want to be a part of it.  The stoke I receive from my paddling and the community is important to me.  I love hanging with crowd.  The OC/surfski community is very small here which doesn't make sense to me but that's the way it is.  I am fortunate to have a brand new sea kayak (QCC Q700X) if I can just get over the "sit inside" part of it.  The Q700 hull is very similar to the Epic 18X hull and is aggressive for a sea kayak.  Guess I will have to start the next paddling fund for the OC/surfski purchase.  Thanks for all of your input in this thread.    

Linus

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #28 on: January 04, 2011, 05:28:30 PM »
If I was you I'd be getting a 14' racing sup. It's totally different to your current board will be like moving from a bmx to racing bike to further the cycling analogy.


Yeah, I certainly haven't given up on the 14' race board idea.  Speaking of that one of the boards on my short list has been the Coreban Alpha Race 14.  Anyone else but me notice that it has mysteriously been removed from their website lineup?  I have received some reports of way less than stellar performance from this board from some recent events outside the US.  Disappointing because the Coreban folks that I have dealt with have been really cool people and super stoked about their product.  Anyone?  BTW, not hatin' here just an observation.


Strange info.  The Alpha's have a solid presence on the website are are killing it in the water.  Just wanted to clarify for the masses  :)  We're looking forward to all the races this spring in the U.S.!  Enjoy the ride,

-L


Tecpartner

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Re: You could have this or you could have that
« Reply #29 on: January 04, 2011, 06:37:33 PM »
There's room for both in my garage. 

I love my V10S surfski.  It took a while until I could handle it in any kind of rough ocean conditions, but if you catch a downwinder on a surfski, you'd never for get it.

Now Epic introduced the V8, which I expect will be an awesome introductory ski, with a shorter learning curve. 

Of course, now, a year into SUP, I'm looking for my 14' race board....


 


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