Author Topic: Product reviews - Zone style  (Read 17042 times)

Chan

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2007, 06:43:01 PM »
Frequent paddler
115 lbs
Kazuma 9'1" x 26"x 4" custom epoxy
I am not typically inclined to flights of fancy, but you must excuse me, because I am in love with my new board. Clearly, it was designed for me— just for me. It can handle any turn and is ultra responsive, and forgiving.  Great for late drops, top to bottom style surfing, and —wow— this board accelerates when you pump the rail. The drawbacks: Not great for all around cruising, and definitely not the right choice for riders much larger than myself. I feel like I am pushing the small side of the envelope on this one.  The low volume and aggressive rocker line require steeper drops, and therefore, some of the advantage of easy entry is lost, but this is more than an adequate trade off for what is gained in overall performance. There are no production boards like this yet for riders of my size.  I highly recommend a custom board like this to all small riders looking for a high performance short board style ripper (but you will have to order your own, this one is mine). 

A few notes on the shape that I requested: 7 Inch wide squash tail (3/4 thick), 16 inches at a foot from the tail, 20 at a foot from the nose.  Flat bottom with Vee at the tail only.  3 fin shortboard thruster setup (no longboard style fin box).  I went with a flatter rocker in the paddle zone with a more rocker in the nose and tail than on most Stand Up boards.  Low volume rails were a priority. 

« Last Edit: July 31, 2007, 06:46:45 PM by CHAN »

gjbstandup

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #16 on: August 05, 2007, 01:36:04 PM »
        I have the JL. 11'    I'm 5'-10'', 185 #'s and its pleanty board for me. I have had some of my buds ride the board and a few with  weight  of 250 #'s and 6'-3'' in height. They seem to have had no problem w/ float or paddling the J-Lewis 11'   I'm a back foot surfer so I have no promlems turning the board in waist high or better surf. But in knee to thigh high gutless surf on Hilton Head its tough. I do try to use the paddle for leverage but their is no power to our "rollie waves" and is difficult at times. I did discover that a the stock JL 13" fin is too large so I tried several fins untill I found that a 9 & 3/4'' G&S speedfin shaped fin worked the best moved forward on the box.
The Laird board I have not tried yet nor seen anyone on one but on other forum sites, responses seem to say the board is great to learn on but lacks performance on waves, so I've read. I'm also looking for a performance SUP to surf larger waves and use the JL for small and flat water paddles. There are several great SUP boards on the market but I think the Jimmy Lewis 11' is a great choice and recomend that board for anyone's first SUP board . Good luck and I know all will be hooked as I was on their first paddle.   Doing it every chance I get,.... Mahalo ......GJBSUP

« Last Edit: August 05, 2007, 02:09:14 PM by Admin »
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shapeshifter

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2007, 02:56:58 PM »
these are just a few of my personal observations of infinity's ottertail paddle design.



the ottertail paddle is different from other paddles in that its blade is nothing more than a flat, two dimensional piece of carbon fibre shaped almost like an oval attached to a tube that is cut at an angle. the blade's face is almost like an elongated egg which comes to a blunt point with the broadest width about three quarters up from the tip, toward the shaft. the circumference of the blade is surrounded by a more resilient clear edging strip to prevent damage for those occasional times it makes contact with the board. this strip also gives the paddle a little bit of a concave but this is only very slight. so slight in fact the blade's outward flex while under tension negates this as the upper (wider) part of the blade bends back into a slight dihedral.

from what i've come to understand, a dihedral is the convex shape of the paddle's blade face (more pronounced at the neck) which would seem counterintuitive to how a blade should be. one would expect that a concave blade would offer a better surface to "grab" the water but apparently this concept is in error. a slight convex in the paddle's blade surface would instead release the water in a controlled manner allowing the paddle to travel through the water on a linear pat with more control, otherwise it would have a tendency try to stray or turn sideways (flutter) along the way as it tries to find the path of least resistance. likewise with the back of the paddle where the parted water would form a vortex crashing back on itself creating ventilation as evidence by bubbles which may appear. in the infinity ottertail's case, the tapered beam where the shaft blends into the blade redirects this water back outward (though not as seamlessly as i would prefer).

infinity's own reason for the design is to give the paddler a low-end and high-end "gearing" as momentum changes while getting under way. i understand this concept but still have yet to employ this efficiently for myself. where i do find this paddle working for me is throughout the whole stroke cycle itself. first off, there isn't as much resistance at the beginning otherwise known as the catch when mostly pulling. second, the broad face engages during the power phase, when one arm is pulling and the other one pushing. then third, and finally on exit when the paddle reaches just past vertical. it is pulled up out of the water releasing its "grip" as it begins its return to the catch position.

this translates to a different approach to paddling when compared to the standard "squarish" blade shapes which i've had the opportunity to experience. the ottertail provides for a more consistent stroke cycle. i suppose other paddles counteract this with some flex of the shaft or otherwise one could attempt to vary the energy expended for a more consistent amount of resistance from the paddle as it progresses through the water. it seems as if the ottertail blade's shape graduates that initial "slamming effect" through it's shape.

i feel that there are also other advantages by having a long drawn out surface for steering. this type of template can be good for planing in outrigger mode though the slimness of the blade may catch in some situations (ie: improvement possibilities here). carbon fibre paddles can seem a bit too light as i also want to experiment with putting a little counter weight out near the neck so that there would have some heft to these paddles. i really could foresee a paddles lightness as being a drawback on those windier days. i feel that this paddle should be measured longer as the blade shape dictates a different paradigm.

i have an 8" ottertail with the heavy duty (blue) shaft. it is a custom split-apart in carbon... and i love it!
« Last Edit: August 07, 2007, 03:34:35 PM by shapeshifter »
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Chan

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #18 on: August 08, 2007, 07:02:13 AM »

 the circumference of the blade is surrounded by a more resilient clear edging strip to prevent damage for those occasional times it makes contact with the board. this strip also gives the paddle a little bit of a concave but this is only very slight. so slight in fact the blade's outward flex while under tension negates this as the upper (wider) part of the blade bends back into a slight dihedral.

 

It seems that you are putting your new gear through the paces.  I love the picture, it feels so serene. How far off shore were you when you took this shot?  You must get some interesting reactions from the Chicago locals when you take her out for a ride.   Must be a great to just hop on and paddle far away from the hustle whenever you feel like it.   Thanks for the informative and interesting paddle review.  I enjoyed reading it, and learned a great deal.  Is the edging a stock feature on all of the ottertail paddles?
« Last Edit: August 08, 2007, 07:03:50 AM by CHAN »

shapeshifter

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2007, 10:15:49 AM »
hi chan,

i really appreciate your comments on the post... i've been getting an hour or two on the sunrise sessions almost every day since i received my board last saturday. think i may have been about a mile out last saturday 8/4/07 (ooops... just now realized that was my b-day) when i took that picture. at that point i'm pretty sure that i'm in the shipping lanes. the winds picked up an hour after that shot and built up during the course of the day so there was some wave action to be had. had my short board out until the lifeguards asked me to bring back the stand-up so they could give it a go. i brought it back out and at least 10 of them had a ball with it for a few hours. we ended the day with a cookout at the beach with prone surfers, skimboarders, and the paddleboard trading rides and banging on a makeshift drum. sunday brought more of the same, had so much fun that i took monday off as well!

we've had a couple days of small board surf during the month of july but we'll usually do the dawn patrol paddle sesh to stay in shape for when it gets big in the fall and winter (drysuit weather). right now i must be quite a novelty because from time to time you'll find groups of people gawking or coming down from their highrise perch to converse about this new activity. comments range from "...you got that whole native thing going on." to "...that's so neat to see you riding up the sun beam!" and "...are you really jousting with the bouys out there?"  then there are those who don't really get it, but it's just a matter of time...

sometimes a bunch of us would scour the beach to gather trash. quite a few people chose to swim on those early morning hours when the beaches are empty though the lifeguards aren't on duty yet. i let them know that i'm watching out and they seem more relaxed about letting their children stray a bit. one of the kids took a ride on the nose of my board as i did my paddle workout. most of the time ten-year-old thomas was sitting cross legged paddling with his arms, a couple times he stood up and we both struggled to coordinate our movements. it threw me for a loop how much momentum his little hands developed when he paddled, it made me realize just how easily my board moved through the water.

the trim material is similar to what you can get at auto accessory retailers and comes stock with infinity's ottertail paddles, though they also offer it for application on other production paddles. mcmaster carr has a similar type of black rubber trim but i really like the clear stuff that came with my ottertail.

all the best,
alan
« Last Edit: August 08, 2007, 10:24:06 AM by shapeshifter »
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MST

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2007, 10:01:47 AM »
I bought a JL 11'7"  in June that I learned  to paddle on.  I bought it before I did all the research and If I had, I probably would have bought the 11'.  However, I am glad I did get the 11'7.  It was definitely hard to learn on but I am really getting used to it and enjoying the challenge and the workout.  I tried a 11' last weekend and it was like standing on a boat compared to the 11'7 - very easy.  I let the guy try the 11'7 and he could not get up on it (I am sure he would have in time).  I do feel that I can paddle just about anything else after learning on my board.  I live on the GA coast and do not have great surfing opportunities but what I have surfed so far, the 11'7 is fast and also glides much easier than the 11'.  The board is tippy so you really have to focus on staying up on the board which makes it difficult to wait  and get into position for the right waves.  It was definitely more relaxing on the 11'.  I just put a 10" Wingnut Cutaway fin on by Rainbow Fin Co. and the 11'7 is more responsive in turning.  I am looking forward to the new Southpoint SUP.  It is supposed to be more stable than the 11'7 and faster than the 11' and also less expensive. If I can justify an additional board I will let you know how it is.  This is just my take - hope it helps.

Admin

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2007, 10:18:05 AM »
Great review MST,

Please provide your height, weight and level (new paddler, infrequent paddler, frequent paddler), and I willl add your post to reviews. 

Thanks to all of you who have begun to add reviews!  Please keep them coming. 

Admin

MST

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2007, 11:02:35 AM »
Sorry,

Frequent Paddler - H - 6', W - 190 lbs


gjbstandup

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #23 on: August 10, 2007, 11:28:26 AM »
MST,
Where on the Ga. coast are you Savannah area?   
      I have the JL  11 and love it.  I too also thought that if I went to a narrow SUP would I be able to ride it, balance and paddle like the 11' JL.  This morning  I was able to try the surftech  11 foot  Micky Munoz  wood vaneer' model  at 26.5 inches wide my  big (265 #'s)surf buddy uses as a surfboard. I was really surprised  with it being  so narrow and  a rolled "V"  on the bottom it was some what stable to paddle. I would not want to have this board as my everyday SUP but it worked.  I do feel now after 3 months on a SUP and many sessions behind me I can paddle a smaller board. Have a epoxy blank and ready to shape a SUP. Have no idea what shape but will continue to research before I mow or draw on the foam. 
    Great 8 mile paddle today taking almost 2 hours - 10 min with and against tide and wind at times. Ocean was too sloppy to paddle today.
 Waiting for a little swell here to surf w/ the SUP ... Enjoy all..    Glen
   
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MST

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2007, 05:07:09 PM »
Glen-
I am on Tybee  Island and yes it is pretty sloppy out there.  I wish I had the time for a 2 hr paddle today - I should get some time in tomorrow.  So far I have seen about 5 or 6 of us over here. Happy paddling.

gjbstandup

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2007, 06:41:25 PM »
MST,
 I'm an hour away. I just may have to come over and paddle with you and the others.   Now that there are more of you paddling, I will make the trip over for sure now. Keep you posted   Glen
 
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Dwight (DW)

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #26 on: August 14, 2007, 10:25:06 AM »
Lets get this party started with a JL 10 footer review.

My review is short. Could not ride it. Wow, was it tippy. Stunned by the skill required.

My lard butt 200 lbs and 6'2 height was no match for this board. Being 53 years old doesn't help either.

I did enjoy watching my 155 lb 5'2" younger paddling buddy attempting to ride it. He struggled at first, then switched back to the JL 11 footer and said ahhhh. Much better. Then he took another shot at the 10 footer. Then another. By the end of the session he was tearing up the surf on the 10 footer. It was so cool to see that board rip the waves up in the hands of someone capable. Very impressed. Too bad I have no chance to make it work for me. Jimmy, make a board between the 11 and 10 footer. It seems like a huge gap once you try them back to back.


jd

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #27 on: August 14, 2007, 10:44:37 AM »
this translates to a different approach to paddling when compared to the standard "squarish" blade shapes which i've had the opportunity to experience. the ottertail provides for a more consistent stroke cycle. i suppose other paddles counteract this with some flex of the shaft or otherwise one could attempt to vary the energy expended for a more consistent amount of resistance from the paddle as it progresses through the water. it seems as if the ottertail blade's shape graduates that initial "slamming effect" through it's shape.


I tried out a 7" ottertail blade, which is supposed to be the specialized "surf blade."  I don't know if the 7" is too small to push a 12 foot board, but I found that it lack the ability to propel the board.  Supposedly the smaller blade should lead to less fatigue, however, I found just the opposite occurred.

I even did a side by side comparison one day with my QB Kanaha.  The Infinity blade felt like I was paddle through wet cement compared to the Kanaha.  Once I switched to the Kanaha, I could tell a major difference in the speed that my board was traveling while paddling.

Just my two cents.  The larger Infinity blades might make a difference, but I found the 7" to be too small for me.  Too expensive to keep experimenting though.

shapeshifter

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #28 on: August 14, 2007, 11:46:25 AM »
apparently the smaller ottertail blade widths are designed for the shorter sup boards. the  reason i had hoped to get a 9" was because i would be pushing an 11'6" through fresh water most of the time. turns out the 8" they sent me works alright. probably won't be winning any races though but you never know. hmmmm... come to think of it i may just attach an "expansion" blade for the race this weekend (it wouldn't be difficult to do).

according to steve at infinity, he's noticed that certain people of different body types also seem to prefer one shape of blade over another. the longer leaner individuals want the slimmer blades while the broader stouter people like me lean more toward the wider shapes. this kind of makes sense in a way if you consider the ergonomics involved.
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Rand

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Re: Product reviews - Zone style
« Reply #29 on: August 14, 2007, 01:29:18 PM »
Just my two cents.  The larger Infinity blades might make a difference, but I found the 7" to be too small for me.  Too expensive to keep experimenting though.

Thanks for the reviews guys.  THESE ARE GREATLY APPRECIATED! 

JD:  Please provide you height and weight and I wil add your review.

DW:  There is a pretty big second learning curve when switching to a board that is on the smaller side for you.  I noticed two frustrating weeks until it started to feel natural.  I would suggest completely quitting your stable board during this period (if you choose to go that route at all).  Going back and forth was just confusing to my weak mind.  Good luck!

 


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