"Whitepaper" on paddle length

[caRRera]

Hi all,

Since I was not happy with the legnth of my paddle, I started to investigate differente methods, and started to ask pros, and surfing the net on research of good info. I analysed all the methods I found, and at the end arrived at the conclussion, that Bill's Kenalu method is the best one, basically because it takes into account, or better said, gets out of the equation, the paddle length, that mainly all the other methods do not take into account, and I found it's BASIC.

You have to take into account the blade lengths vary from 16" to 20" and even more extreme mesures.

I sumed it up in two posts if you want more info:

http://www.carlescarrera.com/2010/04/definitive-guide-for-choosing-your-sup.html
http://www.carlescarrera.com/2010/04/definitive-guide-for-choosing-your-sup_08.html

And arrived at another more "polemic" conclussion. For the majority of us, weekend warriors, our touring, cruising or even racing paddle shouldn't be different from our surf paddle. There far more important technique issues to develop that having two different paddles.

What do you think?

[Pureadrenalin]

There is no way around it you need one short paddle for surf and a longer paddle for distance. Unless an adjustable will work for some but not all. Try using a 12" over paddle in the surf and get caught in the inside. You can't you will get your butt kicked. Just my opinion but very realistic.

[Hoffenator]

Carrera, I have to agree that paddle length has always puzzled me; especially, since I do not spend enough time on the water to develop good skills and strong opinion about what is right or wrong.  I'm about 3 inches taller than you and currently use a paddle length of 82 inches.  Sometimes this feels a bit too long and never feels too short.  I've thought about shortening the paddle length by a couple of inches to help with faster transition paddles while surfing.  I bought an adjustable paddle late last year to experiment with different lengths, but did not get a chance yet to see if shorter length feels better.  BTW, I think  I agree with your conclusion that the average sup'er probably does well with a one length (may be a little short rather than long) for most uses and better to work on technique; the one exception may be long flat water paddles where a longer is probably better.  BTW, what was your decision on final length?

[caRRera]

Carrera, I have to agree that paddle length has always puzzled me; especially, since I do not spend enough time on the water to develop good skills and strong opinion about what is right or wrong.  I'm about 3 inches taller than you and currently use a paddle length of 82 inches.  Sometimes this feels a bit too long and never feels too short.  I've thought about shortening the paddle length by a couple of inches to help with faster transition paddles while surfing.  I bought an adjustable paddle late last year to experiment with different lengths, but did not get a chance yet to see if shorter length feels better.  BTW, I think  I agree with your conclusion that the average sup'er probably does well with a one length (may be a little short rather than long) for most uses and better to work on technique; the one exception may be long flat water paddles where a longer is probably better.  BTW, what was your decision on final length?

My final length will be 78 or 79 at max

[PonoBill]

I'm flattered, but like everything else I do, I stole that idea. Don't remember where. I'd like to reproduce your article on Ke Nalu if you don't mind. I'll probably add some pictures to illustrate the measuring method.

I have recently extended my paddle two inches. I thought it was because there was something wrong with the measuring method, so I propped my board up and checked again, standing on the board. I found the reason was that my reach has increased, and so I need a little more shaft to get the blade under the edge of the board. Happy news.

[stoneaxe]

I still think a surf paddle should be shorter than a distance paddle...reason....much more likely to be in a staggered or complete surf stance...effectively shortening your height by at least a few inches....my distance board also has more volume than my surf boards...again loweringr your height above water when your surfing. I think the difference for me is about 5 inches total.

[PonoBill]

That's pretty much the sum total of the difference, that plus the likelihood that you'll be working hard to increase your reach on a distance board. Most folks who fiddle around with different paddles for their distance and surf boards using a cut and try approach wind up with a difference equal to the thickness or ride height difference of their boards.

Paddlers who like even longer paddles generally do so because they do a better job of stacking their shoulders and get their paddle very straight (in other words, one hand over the other so the paddle isn't winged outwards and applying turning force). When they do that their upper hand is usually over their head instead of just at shoulder height or slightly above. They need longer paddles too.

[Takeo]

This is such great information.  There is so much misleading information out there about paddle length which is probably why this topic comes up time and time again.  Perhaps this article along with Bill's Ke Nalu article will help clarify things. 

I was having the exact situation that Bill described.  I've been reading Dave Kalama's blog on the Tahitian stroke, gave it a try, and realized my paddle is too short.  It's hard to stack shoulder with too short a paddle. 

Thanks guys!

[Pureadrenalin]

This is such great information.  There is so much misleading information out there about paddle length which is probably why this topic comes up time and time again.  Perhaps this article along with Bill's Ke Nalu article will help clarify things. 

I was having the exact situation that Bill described.  I've been reading Dave Kalama's blog on the Tahitian stroke, gave it a try, and realized my paddle is too short.  It's hard to stack shoulder with too short a paddle. 

Thanks guys!

That is my point. Once you start to get better with technique you will find that one paddle versus the SUB you are using on that given day not always fits the ticket. I am using a a 13" overhead paddle= 78" with a 6" thick Bark compared to a surfing SUB that is 3" 7/8 thick with a 72" long blade. So how would that equal using one paddle or even having one paddle?

[IslandRob]

Good stuff.  I agree that that there should be a different length for surf and distance/race although I currently use the exact same paddle for both (about 9" overhead).  Weight/board thickness/salt or fresh water and squatting vs. standing tall all factor in, but I wonder how (if at all) arm length, flexibility, strength and paddling-style factor into the equation.  In the end, the best equation can only give you a starting point and the only way to really dial it in is to experiment and see what gets the job done best.

Who wants to write the white paper on blade size (length/width), angle, scoop or no scoop, and dihedral or hype?

Carrera - I too would like to use your paper on my site (currently under development). Do you mind if I clean it up a bit and add some diagrams/pictures?

-Rob

[Takeo]

Here's another question that maybe some of the downwinders can answer.  Does the paddle length change with 2 foot swells versus 10 ft+ swells?  Or do you go long enough to accommodate both conditions? I'm guessing on really large downwind swells, a longer paddle is advantageous? 

[Dwight (DW)]

I've been reading Dave Kalama's blog on the Tahitian stroke, gave it a try, and realized my paddle is too short. 

I felt the same way after reading it. I went to the local shop and picked up the demo QB adjustable paddle and did two downwinders with it. Wow, what a difference that made. I was catching runners easier and that paddle made it super easy to feel the pros and cons of different lengths on the fly.

By the way, very impressed with that QB adjustable paddle. The best adjustable I've tried. An adjustable paddle you could actually use everyday and enjoy it!

I bought a new QB Elite and recut my old one for the wife. Her paddle was also too short.

[Surfingsen]

Great writing / topic - I have been having the same thoughts - but we (as well as the manufacturers) should actually only discuss paddle shaft length, as that is basically what matters as the blade size varies at lot as mentioned as well.

I agree on the measuring method, that the shaft length should be measured with basis from the shoulder, as that is basically what decides the length (we all vary in neck length, headsize etc) and then with a length adding depending on boardtype, surf or distance, paddling style etc.

The "length adding" formula I will leave to the more experienced  and I hope Bob or others will do this to help us who don't get to log as many hours on the water as you do, and as we would like to.......

So now it's just finding out (or discussing) how much length to add....

Therefore to help the consumer the manufacturers should give two measurements on their paddles - the shaft length and the total length (or blade length)

[caRRera]

Bill, as always teaching us something: http://www.kenalu.com/2010/04/18/measure-twice-cut-once/

He "stretched" my orginal article with good ideas and photos on paddle length selection. Now I truly understand why I arrived at the conclussion that my surf paddle will be the same legnth as my touring paddle: I only do touring on the SUP board for fitness purposes, not for racing, so I use the same board I use for surfing ... so here it is why I feel my "racing" paddle should be as short or as long as my surfing one.

For weekend SUPers like me, the KISS rule is the king. Keep It Simple Stupid!.

[sylvano]

hola CaRReRa,


in my opinion, paddle lenght is a very personal question.

i am used to a long shaft (i would say it's a compromise between distance and surf
), because with short shaft, I have to bend my back too much and i have strong back pain.
I don't do a lot of cruising, so my orientation is to reduce a bit the shaft for a surf use.
I managed to shorten a bit  (2" to 3") the shaft on a wood paddle we made, but in that case, my blade is also much smaller.
I think the shaft lengh has to see with the area and depth of the blade and with the thikness and lenght of the board.

have some good surf.