Author Topic: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced  (Read 10881 times)

B-Walnut

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #15 on: September 14, 2023, 08:25:35 AM »
Been noticing folks showing up with long narrow downwind boards to learn winging at my local spot.. 

After seeing them struggle to balance in flat water, I've recommend they borrow a slower wide SUP board and paddle around.  Usually it takes one/two session with the paddle to sort things out - like being deliberate in movement, counter balancing, knowing the max buoyant point on the board, etc...   After building confidence standing on the board, I then tell them to start with a wing.  Many have said the rush to get the latest gear didn't serve their needs, and would have been better to ask local folks what to start with.  In my observations, downwind boards make it harder for most beginners to lean the sport.   

It's interesting seeing the different balance points of beginners. I see some who are on 120l boards, 34" wide with all those added foam things, and they still can't balance. Others, specifically women (in the small sample I have) really excel with narrow boards. I've seen plenty who just can't get on foil with those big boards but you give them a DW board and they are instantly up and riding.

It's all different teaching methods too. I, personally, would never tell someone to practice standing on a board without a wing. That seems to be a thing people have started teaching recently and it makes no sense to me. I saw someone religiously do that because they were told to and they spent 6 months trying to balance on their board without a wing.

In the end, better mentorship and teaching methods are needed. I've only met one kite instructor over the years that seemed to be a good instructor. I see tons of people just sitting on jetskis watching beginners flail and get paid for it. One piece of gear can have a big impact, but the right guidance is needed.

Dontsink

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #16 on: September 15, 2023, 01:50:15 PM »
I think beginners would progress easier with a cockroach start from day one, it just makes winging in stronger wind,choppier water and smaller boards a lot easier.
A big advantage of narrower board designs is that they allow for a very painless cowboy to stinkbug (sit astride like a surfer and go to knees).
I wear a big kneebrace and have some hip arthrosis but on my 6' x18" i can cowboy start with no problem or pain.

Chevrus

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #17 on: September 27, 2023, 10:29:14 AM »
Well after many an attempt, I have finally registered!
This thread is of particular interest to me as I have yet buy a proper foil board. I have been educating myself on the evolution of the gear as I make attempts to use the wind on my 12' SUP with SUP-Winder attached. So far I have gotten a feel for the wing, subjected myself to very adverse conditions and managed to get upwind.

My foray into the recent hurricane leftovers here in the Atlantic NorthEast showed me a few things, that's for sure. I regard to getting a downwind board for my first one, I'm thinking yeah. I do not have a problem with balance, having attempted to wing on my SUP in the ocean in swell, chop and sub par wind conditions. Furthermore, given my location I will not get high winds often and it would be great to have more and shorter sessions in lighter winds. I'm also not what would be considered young, although in decent shape.

Something like a Naish Hover DW 125-L seems like a decent idea to me... I realize it will be tipper than the more rectangular boards meant for dedicated winging, but I'm willing to hike up that learning curve because I think the rewards will be worth it.
Open to critique on this...

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #18 on: September 27, 2023, 05:04:55 PM »
Well after many an attempt, I have finally registered!
This thread is of particular interest to me as I have yet buy a proper foil board. I have been educating myself on the evolution of the gear as I make attempts to use the wind on my 12' SUP with SUP-Winder attached. So far I have gotten a feel for the wing, subjected myself to very adverse conditions and managed to get upwind.

My foray into the recent hurricane leftovers here in the Atlantic NorthEast showed me a few things, that's for sure. I regard to getting a downwind board for my first one, I'm thinking yeah. I do not have a problem with balance, having attempted to wing on my SUP in the ocean in swell, chop and sub par wind conditions. Furthermore, given my location I will not get high winds often and it would be great to have more and shorter sessions in lighter winds. I'm also not what would be considered young, although in decent shape.

Something like a Naish Hover DW 125-L seems like a decent idea to me... I realize it will be tipper than the more rectangular boards meant for dedicated winging, but I'm willing to hike up that learning curve because I think the rewards will be worth it.
Open to critique on this...

You don’t mention your weight.

It won’t be more tippy than regular wing boards. It should work great.


Chevrus

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #19 on: September 27, 2023, 08:01:33 PM »
Oh right …. Checking in at 175
I suppose in the dead of winter I might find a deal….

Badger

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #20 on: September 28, 2023, 04:54:57 AM »
The 7'4 x 25" 125L Naish will be super stable to learn on but may feel somewhat big for 175 lbs once you get past the beginner stage. You could probably learn on the 7'1 x 23" 105L at your weight but it will be a little more challenging, especially in choppy water.

The bigger board will definitely speed up the learning process if you don't mind the possibility of moving on to another board in a year or so. A lot depends on your balance, how often you go, and how fast a learner you are.
Kalama E3 6'1 x 23" 105L
Axis HPS 980 / PNG 1300
Sunova Flow  8'10 X 31"  119L
Me - 6'0" - 165lbs - 66yo

B-Walnut

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #21 on: September 28, 2023, 03:16:44 PM »
Oh right …. Checking in at 175
I suppose in the dead of winter I might find a deal….

Yep, the hover 125 should be a breeze to learn on. I've seen small riders learn on the 105 for sure, so that's not off the table and you could have fun for a long time on the 105.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #22 on: September 28, 2023, 04:03:26 PM »
I’ve been screwing around with board sizes. Decided I want the smallest downwind board for winging light wind. I’m not keen on doing flat water pop ups. Too old. Am doing Foildrive instead of SUP these days.

So with that in mind, this was today’s stability test of a 6’8 x 21.5 x 110 liter with a paddle. No wind to test winging yet. Had to get in wet. Finished sanding it this morning.

It should be easy winging in super light wind. 185 lbs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQtVb138WeM
« Last Edit: September 28, 2023, 04:05:58 PM by Dwight (DW) »

Chevrus

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #23 on: September 29, 2023, 08:34:21 AM »
That’s fantastic! Just enough to stay afloat.
Did you shape that one yourself?

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #24 on: September 29, 2023, 02:43:36 PM »
Yes, shaped it myself.

Todays winging test.


https://www.youtube.com/shorts/n4-7WHrsr3Y
« Last Edit: September 29, 2023, 02:54:48 PM by Dwight (DW) »

jondrums

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #25 on: September 29, 2023, 05:52:05 PM »
Looks like it gets out of the water in wind that can barely keep the foil in the air without pumping.    To me that's the threshold, I'm not sure why anyone would need a board any better than that.

Badger

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #26 on: September 30, 2023, 04:01:32 AM »
Dwight's board looks similar to the Kalama E3 which I've been super happy with. Wing size and choice of foil determines how light a wind you can foil.

Guessing wind speeds, I can get up with the 7m CWC and Axis PNG 1300 in as little as 6 mph. The BSC 1060 can get up in 7 mph, and the HPS 980 around 9 mph. Someone with good wing-pumping technique might be able to push the limit even further.

When the wind is very inconsistent/5 to 15 mph, I often run the PNG 1300. It allows me to get up earlier and glide right through the lulls.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2023, 05:00:57 AM by Badger »
Kalama E3 6'1 x 23" 105L
Axis HPS 980 / PNG 1300
Sunova Flow  8'10 X 31"  119L
Me - 6'0" - 165lbs - 66yo

gneve_foil

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Re: Narrow vs Wide Boards: Beginners to Advanced
« Reply #27 on: October 03, 2023, 02:03:09 PM »
The BSC1060 is a light wind weapon that still turns. That foil allowed me to progress quite rapidly. I have it for sale but tempted to keep it to push the low wind envelope or for the days when I just want to hit the easy button.

 


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