Author Topic: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:  (Read 2990 times)

water, man

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To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« on: December 17, 2022, 08:37:20 AM »
Howdy Forum, 

My wife has progressed beyond the starter wing foil kit that I picked out for her.  I was just about to post it for sale when I had the thought that maybe it will work for me to paddle the surf.  And I wondered what you thought, if it is likely to work for me, I will keep it, or is it better to pass it on to someone for winging?

I donít get to the surf often, but if it will work, I will keep the kit for that purpose.  88 Liter Armstrong. 72 cm mast. V1 1550/300 tail on 60 fuse.

I am 175lb 56 yo.  I wing on a 60l with HA wings and I have kite foiled well for many years. I used to enjoy SUP surf on 123l L41, but never anything smaller.  This was on the bumpy OR coast, and any attempts I give at foil surf will be Baja SUR

Whatcha think, should the kit stay or go?

Mahalo for your response.

Califoilia

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2022, 09:00:38 AM »
The 88L (5'5"x23") board will definitely be a challenge to stand and paddle, especially in lumpy bumpy conditions (another 10L would have been nice), but the Armstrong V1 1550 setup listed was one a lot a number of guys in my area learned on back in the day. Don't see a lot of them now, but as a "take it out occasionally" setup, it'll be fine for you IMO.
Me: 6'1"/185...(2) 5'1" Kings Foil/Wing Boards...7'10 Kings DW Board...9'6" Bob Pearson "Laird Noserider"...14' Lahui Kai "Manta"...8'0" WaveStorm if/when the proning urges still hit.

PonoBill

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #2 on: December 17, 2022, 09:48:37 AM »
Like Cali said, the board would be a bitch to stand on, but you could use it prone. Or replace just the board and keep the foil setup. At 80kg you probably want something like 100L to start SUP foil surfing. The 88L will barely show above the surface. If you have the balance of a cat that's actually preferable, but for beginners, it will just be frustrating.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

radair

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2022, 07:39:39 AM »
The 88L (5'5"x23") board will definitely be a challenge to stand and paddle...
The 88L FG board is 27" wide. I think it would be lousy as a prone board, it's just so hard to paddle a board that wide. I tried my 75L FG wing board (26" width) when I left my prone board home one day and it didn't work well for me.

Califoilia

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #4 on: December 20, 2022, 10:45:50 AM »
The 88L FG board is 27" wide. I think it would be lousy as a prone board, it's just so hard to paddle a board that wide. I tried my 75L FG wing board (26" width) when I left my prone board home one day and it didn't work well for me.
You are correct wrt the width, don't know what I was looking at.  :o

But yeah, either way, 88L for a sup foil board under a 175lb rider is too little, and 88L and 26" wide is too much as a prone foil board as you found out.
Me: 6'1"/185...(2) 5'1" Kings Foil/Wing Boards...7'10 Kings DW Board...9'6" Bob Pearson "Laird Noserider"...14' Lahui Kai "Manta"...8'0" WaveStorm if/when the proning urges still hit.

surfcowboy

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #5 on: December 20, 2022, 07:59:10 PM »
Don't bother. It'll just make you frustrated.

Sell it and buy a bigger board.

water, man

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #6 on: December 20, 2022, 08:00:26 PM »
Really appreciate the responses.  Thank you all.  I found someone who might be up for a trade of their 99L fg for my 88l when they get a bit more time learning to wing. I wonder with foil attached, will that be suitable to paddle?  The 99 FG is two inches less wide than my 7í10 Simsup but appears to have a thicker deck.

Prone is really in my past. (Knees and neck with high mileage) But now I am starting to get stoked about paddle foil.  Again thanks for the help.  I will post a session report when I give it a go. Swell forecasted for Thursday and Friday

PonoBill

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #7 on: December 20, 2022, 08:24:47 PM »
There's no way I will ever be able to prone foil unless I magically become more flexible. Here in Maui, Jim Bones, who is 78--two years older than me--does it beautifully. But I suspect he's in the 65KG category and probably does Yoga or something. Wide boards can be prone paddled, but it ain't pretty. I've had to paddle my 29" wide foil board after I lost my wing a half mile out in Ma'alea bay. I probably looked like a slow penguin--short little flippers. About every emergency service possible was on the beach when I finally hit the sand, including an EMT lady who wanted to listen to my heart. I'm nice to EMTs because my daughter is one and she'd smack me if I wasn't, but I was fairly offended that the lifeguards, EMT, Fire department, and Police watched me paddle in from the horizon and then wanted to render aid and fill out reports once I'd staggered to the beach.

Anyway, at 75kg you'd be okay on a 88l board, but it's marginal, and the entire dick-measuring contest of who can foil the shortest board is blessedly over. It's a lot easier to foil on a bigger board, especially a longer one. On Maui, some of the tiny little cool kids are on 7-foot+ boards. Get a board you're comfortable paddling on. I just ordered a 7' X 25" 125l board from Mark Raaphorst. I'll probably see it in time for my 77th birthday, but I dropped by his shop today to shoot the shit and he showed me his new take on a Kalama-style board. I've successfully resisted the long, skinny displacement hull trend to date, but looking at the thing just shoved me straight off the edge.  OMG, it was just beautiful.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

Dontsink

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2022, 01:29:16 AM »
My experience with SUP Foiling has been humbling.
SUP can be totally frustrating unless you already have experience.Lots of people here have been SUP surfing and DWnding or racing for many years.They can ride anything and make it look easy.Mast stability helps but does not cure all.
If you don't have experience go 120l.
Or at least give a 100l board a test before buying.
Even the slightest chop will make you flail and drop noisily in the drink to the delight of beachstanders and other surfers.
And when you screw up a lot in a line up you become non-existent as far as priorities go...

BTW i have prone paddled a Naish Hover S25 85l (26in width) many times without much problem.And i am not big.
It felt awfully corky when dealing with foamies on the paddle out but worked fine in general.

Badger

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2022, 10:07:26 AM »
I'm 65 years old and weigh 165. I've been SUP surfing for almost ten years on boards as small as 7'6. I tried SUP foiling my 5'10 x 29" 110L Naish Hover for the first time a couple of weeks ago and it was a lot of work just trying to stand and paddle in a straight line. Catching waves seemed impossible. I could probably do it on a longer board but not on a 5'10. I think I'll stick to wing foiling. It's way easier.
Kalama E3 6'1 x 23" 105L
Axis HPS 980/440 - BSC 1060/400
Sunova Flow  8'10 X 31"  119L
Me - 6'0" - 165lbs - 65yo

juandesooka

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2023, 09:21:17 PM »
I'm 65 years old and weigh 165. I've been SUP surfing for almost ten years on boards as small as 7'6. I tried SUP foiling my 5'10 x 29" 110L Naish Hover for the first time a couple of weeks ago and it was a lot of work just trying to stand and paddle in a straight line. Catching waves seemed impossible. I could probably do it on a longer board but not on a 5'10. I think I'll stick to wing foiling. It's way easier.

Stick with it, like everything there's a bit of learning curve, but if you can sup surf a 7.6, you should get it fast.  Though a bigger board will help at start. For perspective, I began with a DIY install on my 9.3, then another diy on a 7.6 door, then 6' and 5'11". Experiments below that  I found the loss of paddling ability and stability due not justify the performance gains.  I wing a 5.3 95L and can almost just barely sup foil it. 

Badger

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2023, 05:07:32 AM »
I'm 65 years old and weigh 165. I've been SUP surfing for almost ten years on boards as small as 7'6. I tried SUP foiling my 5'10 x 29" 110L Naish Hover for the first time a couple of weeks ago and it was a lot of work just trying to stand and paddle in a straight line. Catching waves seemed impossible. I could probably do it on a longer board but not on a 5'10. I think I'll stick to wing foiling. It's way easier.

Stick with it, like everything there's a bit of learning curve, but if you can sup surf a 7.6, you should get it fast.  Though a bigger board will help at start. For perspective, I began with a DIY install on my 9.3, then another diy on a 7.6 door, then 6' and 5'11". Experiments below that  I found the loss of paddling ability and stability due not justify the performance gains.  I wing a 5.3 95L and can almost just barely sup foil it.

Thanks, I'm sure I'll try it a few more times. I need to pick a day with super clean waves and maybe do some flatwater to get the paddling technique down.

Kalama E3 6'1 x 23" 105L
Axis HPS 980/440 - BSC 1060/400
Sunova Flow  8'10 X 31"  119L
Me - 6'0" - 165lbs - 65yo

B-Walnut

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #12 on: January 28, 2023, 05:47:09 PM »
I regret the sup foil board I ended up with. I went with the shop recommendation but often find they are a bit optimistic in selling me stuff haha!

My first day sup foiling was on an 8' takuma windfoil board and I loved it. I caught every wave that came through and had so much fun. Day two was on my kalama e3 5'10" and it's been so brutal that I've mostly given up on sup foiling, especially since I love traditional sup so much anyway. I largely consider foiling just for winging now. That being said, if I could get my hands on a larger board I'd love to give it another crack.

pafoil

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #13 on: January 28, 2023, 09:47:09 PM »
SUP foil is not easy, but it is way more fun than regular sup; you just need to put the time and select the right equipments. Why people (some) go to schools for every other sport other than SUPfoil?

APPST_Paddle

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Re: To those who have paid their dues on foil in the surf:
« Reply #14 on: January 29, 2023, 03:47:23 AM »
SUP Foil is basically all I do now. This is coming from someone who SUP surfed probably 150 days a year. I'm 42, 175 lbs, and SUP surf wise I ride around a 100L board (8'2 x 27.5").

1. Learn to foil initially with something that doesn't involve you powering it up. I learned to foil with a kite, having time on foil and understanding the mechanics is key before trying to do it with a SUP.

2. Learn somewhere with crumbly waves, this is the hard part, I didn't see where you live, but you need crappy, mushy, barely breaking waves. Luckily, where I live those are available a bulk of the time. Something in the knee to waist range, barely breaking.

3. Board wise, definitely go for more volume (not length) and just suck up that you will progress and need a smaller board. It's better to have a bit more volume to learn with so you don't become aggravated, yes, you could attempt a 90L board, but I wouldn't advise it. Paddle wise if you aren't already, head length, it's crucial to not have too long of a paddle. Foil wise, you are good to go with the 1550.

Board progression, here's mine:
1. JL Flying-V 6'5" 115L - great board to learn on.
2. I tried to progress too quickly in dropping volume, Naish Hover 95L, great when I could catch a wave, too much of a pain.
3. 5'8" 105L Kings, great board to progress, except it delam'ed after 6 months.
4. 5'2" 105L Kalama E3 - current board, I have no desire to go any smaller, blows the Kings out of the water on initial catch (even as a smaller board).


All of them are in the 28.5" range on width, width is key for stability.
7'6" JL Super Frank Lean
8'2" JL SuperTech 
10'1" JL Black and Blue
14' BIC WS Tracer
6'5" JL Flying-V/GoFoil Maliko 200
Kenalu Ho'oloa 95, Werner Rip Stick 79

 


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