Author Topic: Foil Madness  (Read 3252 times)

JohnnyTsunami

  • Rincon Status
  • ***
  • Posts: 106
    • View Profile
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #30 on: November 21, 2022, 12:01:01 AM »
The master…

Pono, get one of these systems.


https://youtu.be/nyYcomX7Lus

Admin

  • Administrator
  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 6120
    • View Profile
    • StandUpZone
    • Email
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #31 on: November 21, 2022, 01:22:29 AM »
If/when I get rid of a bunch of motorcycles and move the rest to either one of my containers or another part of the shop I could devote the front wall of my shop to this kind of fabrication stuff. The shop has wiring in place to power massive stone-cutting and polishing machinery. It will take a little time to set up, but having 3D printing, laser cutting, prepreg freezer, and oven all in one place sounds like a nice setup to me.

That sounds great!  I have a spot for the printer, vac/oven/pump assembly and a freezer and my work bench.  I have 220 there.  It is all ordered, so, it should be here when you get back.

I did some snowboard binding highbacks just now in Gravity Sketch that will fit on three of our existing models. That one would require a mold and that unidirectional prepreg but we have that covered.  I figured out a way to do really clean molds in GS, so it all rides on our filiment holding up in the oven.  We'll see:)  This stuff has my mind spinning...and I love it. 
« Last Edit: November 21, 2022, 01:33:38 AM by Admin »

Admin

  • Administrator
  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 6120
    • View Profile
    • StandUpZone
    • Email
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #32 on: November 22, 2022, 06:22:34 AM »
Wow, what a satisfying way to design.  The control and precision that this environment allows  is the stuff of dreams.  Check this out. 

Here is a new wing section.  This time I scaled it first to a baseline of 7.5 inches chord length.  My length goal was a ten four (1040 mm) because ten four is fun to say.

Gravity sketch allows you to mount an image to any axis plane and has measuring tools which will snap to any axis.  I then traced in the section.  (green).
« Last Edit: November 22, 2022, 06:26:22 AM by Admin »

Admin

  • Administrator
  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 6120
    • View Profile
    • StandUpZone
    • Email
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #33 on: November 22, 2022, 06:29:36 AM »
Then I brought in some resources to shape in the fuselage attachment.  The photos images are just for shape reference.  Software allows you to bring in any reference material and place it in the scene.  I can't show you because the headset will not record video of passthrough mode, but with that enabled you can hold the actual object alongside (or inside) your virtual model.  Trippy.  I have measurements of the fuselage head from my micrometer.  That is really the best way to go (aside from a 3D scan).  Then I downloaded a protractor image (tested its accuracy) and imported it.  I snapped that to the plane .  This allows me to set a base for the flat bottomed fuselage head.  That angle will determine incidence.  I drew a (yellow) line on the plane at - 2.5 degrees in relation to the foils chord line.  The foil images are all set with their chord line at 0 degrees, which is awesome.  If you are careful not to touch that angle, the foil stays at 0 degrees as you build.  Setting a negative base plane will lead to positive incidence.  Plus 2.5 degrees for the front wing is very common for performance wings.  With that we have all the info we need to place the head.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2022, 08:45:06 AM by Admin »

Admin

  • Administrator
  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 6120
    • View Profile
    • StandUpZone
    • Email
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #34 on: November 22, 2022, 06:45:38 AM »
Then I pulled the wing to 520 mm (Later I will mirror this half to get to a symmetrical ten four).  The fuse head dimensions will not fit inside the confines of this section at this aspect.  You see this on a lot of foils.  You can also see why the black fuses came along.  So we have to get creative. Symmetrically expanding the existing section at the center only is one way.  I did that first.  This makes enough room and it could certainly be tweaked but it looks awkward to me.  The last image shows me replacing the original section with a very similar (beefier) section from the same series.   That is really cool because the software smoothly morphs from one section to the other in a nice organic curve.  Math!!!  This will also create a nice little base rib.  I was just getting started refining this when I got my low battery warning.  It needs a little upwards nudge but...More soon...
« Last Edit: November 22, 2022, 07:16:11 AM by Admin »

jondrums

  • Peahi Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 811
    • View Profile
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #35 on: November 22, 2022, 09:26:44 AM »
Most front wings have a little bit of twist (washout) as you go from the root to the tips.  About 2deg is what I am seeing on wings I've measured. 

Admin

  • Administrator
  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 6120
    • View Profile
    • StandUpZone
    • Email
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #36 on: November 22, 2022, 12:12:06 PM »
Most front wings have a little bit of twist (washout) as you go from the root to the tips.  About 2deg is what I am seeing on wings I've measured.

Yeah Jon! You have to work to get that measurement in reality-reality.

I have been playing with that and finally have control over it with the addition of the protractor.  At 2.5 degrees of flare or washout that would essentially flatten the chord line at the tip to back to zero degrees (on this example foil).  I think they are just adding the washout at the last few inches rather than the whole span.  We can put a control loop anywhere on the span and twist from there only.  That leaves our desired angle for most of the foil.  We can also graduate the twist amount as we move outward. 

I am finding it best to work from the eventual centerline outwards and do frequent "save as" to stay non-destructive.  GS has I think 50 history steps but you can exceed that pretty quickly :)


jondrums

  • Peahi Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 811
    • View Profile
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #37 on: November 22, 2022, 02:26:12 PM »
super cool!
I agree its the last third of the wing that has gradual introduction of washout peaking at or near the wingtip

Admin

  • Administrator
  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 6120
    • View Profile
    • StandUpZone
    • Email
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #38 on: November 23, 2022, 04:55:15 AM »
I palyed around a bit more and ended up doing this.  I took the section I had used for the foil and inverted it.  Once lined up I used the bottom half to shape the middle loop only as a symmetrical section. The first two images are the before and after.   That created a nice little base rib.  I pulled that out a bit to add some real estate for our fuse head.  In the last shot I placed my incidence line.  Ready now to shape in the head well.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2022, 05:05:45 AM by Admin »

Admin

  • Administrator
  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 6120
    • View Profile
    • StandUpZone
    • Email
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #39 on: November 23, 2022, 04:57:43 AM »
I started by pulling down the surface by edge loops.  The software snaps each point to the yellow incidence line and the hand controller gives a little haptic "well done, lad".  So cool! Then I refined the well a bit with additional control points that helped box it up a bit.  Checked the size, and we are looking good.  We have extra room to pack some prepreg inside and  I will shape and print a solid dummy head that we can slather with release agent and bag and bake in our well when we do the wing (or we could use an actual aluminum head, which would probably be best.  Once we do some test cooks and see what we are getting.  we can really take some time and refine this so all the surround contours match up perfectly.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2022, 05:24:09 AM by Admin »

jondrums

  • Peahi Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 811
    • View Profile
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #40 on: November 23, 2022, 01:23:40 PM »
honestly, this all looks pretty much like any of the many high end 3D surfacing/modelling CAD software that's available today.   I suppose a lot of the draw here is that you can see it with the 3D goggles?

Admin

  • Administrator
  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 6120
    • View Profile
    • StandUpZone
    • Email
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #41 on: November 23, 2022, 01:42:01 PM »
honestly, this all looks pretty much like any of the many high end 3D surfacing/modelling CAD software that's available today.   I suppose a lot of the draw here is that you can see it with the 3D goggles?

Yes, I don't want sound Steve Jobsy, but it is really a case of a new technology stimulating creativity.  I am mad-posting this stuff (full apologies) because I have never been more stoked and invigorated by a new mode.  It makes it so you can walk around the model and assets and see it like you had the actual product with you.  That part is impossible to convey with 2D images or video.  It makes visualization and manipulation so natural.  There is nothing that you could do with this that could not also be accomplished in a 2D program, but the visibility and intimacy is light years ahead.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2022, 03:19:20 AM by Admin »

tarquin

  • Sunset Status
  • ****
  • Posts: 320
    • View Profile
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #42 on: November 24, 2022, 03:41:21 AM »
https://youtu.be/Pi-2pPDWC1w
 Self pumping foil?

PonoBill

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 25446
    • View Profile
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #43 on: November 24, 2022, 07:46:30 AM »
If that doesn't simultaneously amaze and freak you out then you need more caffeine to get your brain engaged.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

tarquin

  • Sunset Status
  • ****
  • Posts: 320
    • View Profile
Re: Foil Madness
« Reply #44 on: Today at 12:55:42 PM »
Faster than? So short people are faster than tall people?

 


SimplePortal 2.3.7 © 2008-2022, SimplePortal