Author Topic: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!  (Read 5017 times)

FOIL STOKE

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My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« on: October 07, 2022, 11:03:04 AM »
Hello SUZ! ;D

I am stoked beyond measure to have the chance to ramp up in this crazy beautiful sport. I am curious about a number of things and thus I had to reach out to you all. A little about me first. I am a surfer, mountain biker, snowboarder, kiter, TwinTip, Surfboard and kitefoiler etc etc. Ive been an athlete all my life. Two years ago I picked up a carbon surfski (Huki S1-X Special) and learned over the pandemic. At the beginning of my surfski ramp up, (all though having some decent paddle experience) I literally couldn't sit in the boat, fell everywhere and was lucky to have 100m paddled before climbing out of the sea, knackered and seriously humbled. Now I can crush any boat wake, tidal swell or wind swell, in 20kilometer chunks. Surfing the ski has been an amazing experience, being on the water is, as we all know, straight medicine. I mention it because this experience mirrors my SUP FOIL intro to the T. I am 210pounds 43 years old, pretty fit these days. My SUP Foil set up is the 6'3" Fanatic SKY SUP with a 2140 Naish front wing and 310 stab. QuickBlade Paddle UV88. I have two SUP Foil sessions under my belt and I knew this was going to hard but Holy s*&@ did I underestimate the difficulty - which is amazing. If I've learned anything in my 43 years is that the harder a thing is, the sweeter the victory. I felt like a bear trying to balance on a ball in the circus. I looked hilarious and was jeered at from the beach. lol. All amazing. After two - hour long sessions though I went from barely being able to stand on the board to getting four or five paddles in before bailing. Crawling out of the water both times, crushed and very happy. Ive broken in enough boards to know what I am going through is partly getting to know the balance signature -finding the sweet spot -> strengthening core muscles groups in order to achieve a natural balance point & getting use to the foil counterbalance point all while managing the paddle. Not to mention the paddle and its hydro dynamic signature. Its just different. Ive checked out the youtube universe (Jeremy Riggs in particular) and have my goals set out for the next few sessions. Drills like the sea saw drill, squat and forward thrust etc. 

Im curious though for those of you who have already done this ramp up what would you do differently? Any advice for me? Its intimidating to see legit watermen struggle, but when I look closely I see them persevere, breakthrough and then say its the hardest thing they've done to date followed closely by it was worth every single ounce of effort.  Im curious to know what is your experience?

I am also curious about the kind of swell that is fun to play in. What  I mean is I live by the sea (all though its sheltered from direct pacific swell) we have tidal swell, wind swell and boat wakes to play in. While on my surfski I often revel in immense amount of power in just tidal movements which on the surface can be uber micro but when you have a reference point beneath the water you can see how fast the water is moving against the sand. On super small days this is what I usually surf on my ski. The slower I go the harder it is, which is super fun. My thesis is this: Ill train to get on foil - without any waves or swell.. essentially flat water foil training. Im really curious about the possibilities in micro tidal swell, boat wakes, and micro downwind runs. When things get windy Im getting on my kites. I know what 8 knots looks like locally and this is perfect for the what Im thinking on my foil. At my local spot there is a re-bound wave that runs eastward off a pier which carries a lot of power. In days that have a westward wind I can run out on the ski and catch this hidden wave going east and then run back using the wind swept swell. Im wondering if this makes sense to anyone, what can I expect from the perspective of the foil?

In any case a this new challenge is just simply awesome. I love throwing myself into the deep end and wow have I found the pinnacle of difficult ramp ups. I suspect (and sincerely hope) Im on track for some serious fun. Love to hear from you guys.  8)

Cheers, DP
« Last Edit: October 07, 2022, 11:14:18 AM by SLINGSHOT »

jondrums

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2022, 06:01:17 AM »
I think you're going to be in for a tough time if you are planning to learn by doing flatwater or weak swell starts.  What you really want to learn with are slow rolling mushy waves that are just crumbling at the top.  If you can't find that, then go for steeper waves but try to find a spot that comes through on the slower side so its easier to catch.  I think even boat wake will be very difficult to catch while you are learning - you will want some power to learn how to get going and bring the board out of the water slowly.  To catch the small stuff you have to get the board out of the water quickly and just at the right moment.  You want something with more time so you can catch the wave with the board "surfing" in the water and feel the foil engage.  Then little by little let the board lift off the water just a little bit until you have the feel of the foil. 

I would suggest you commit to getting in the water a dozen times no matter what.  You will likely not start feeling like this will be fun until around that many sessions.

Hdip

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2022, 09:14:23 AM »
All kinds of swell are fun to play in. You just have to match your foil to the swell.

If you really have no breaking waves with no white water, you will need a very large foil. You will also need a board that is long and narrow to build board speed and get off the water.

Gear that works. Dave Kalama Barracuda. One of the huge GoFoil foils. One of the huge AXIS foils (1310 maybe). Ono Ava paddle. Go watch "Jeremy Riggs" instagram and youtube stuff. Learn all you can about proper SUP paddle technique. It'll all be paddle technique in those kinds of conditions.

FOIL STOKE

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2022, 09:24:17 AM »
Thanks guys yes. I agreed the conditions I have locally are really challenging. I was out yesterday on my kitefoil for 2.5 hours.. Iím really starting to get my foil confidence up. Hip angles.. adapting while foiling.. being able to relax and sink back into foil.. pumping while powering the kite up etc.. Iím less worried about the foil on my SuP setup and more focused on my take off. @jondrums youíre bang on what Iím starting is really putting my paddle strength to the test. But in 3 short sessions Iíve come a long way. Itís a different ball game but I did get the foil to start rising enough to feel the power of my foil start to kick in on axis wind section. Iím s baby steps for me at the moment. I just need to up my paddle power which is slowly coming. A dozen paddles is a great goal. Iím happy with my 2140 naish wing and SUP sky setup. Just need more paddle power! Haha Thanks for the reply guys!

FOIL STOKE

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2022, 02:12:00 PM »
One thing I have noticed is that the stock strap setup for my front foot is too far back for the forward setting of my foil. I read somewhere that in setting up a SUP FOIL board you mount the foil up towards the nose. If I were to mount the foil on the board then pick it up by the front wing, the board will sit level. That has put the sweet spot (center) of the board further up and it has make it so that the foil acts as a brake when my foot is in the strap. Good for resistance/paddle training, bad for trying to get on foil. Ive removed the strap to let my front foot find its equilibrium. I think I should be setting everything up for max glide.. including no tail wing shim. Am I close to right?

I am going to be out on the water today so we will see how that goes.

FOIL STOKE

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2022, 12:34:32 PM »
Just thought I would touch base guys.. I'm 7 sessions in and wow.. SUPFOIL paddling is no joke. I have leveled up my power output several times and see now I have lots of room to go. I am astonished at how difficult this is but I am loving the steep ramp up. I'm up to half the time on my feet, half either paddling surf style or on my knees. I had one run on my feet last session that was my longest - about 100 seconds... starting to get the paddle power up to the point where I can bounce the board and foil together and was starting to feel the foil lift. All though my weight distribution is too far back. The timing is tricky and I feel like a fish out of water with everything going on. The various tidal movements/and boat wakes are giving me something to paddle into/with but I'm really just learning the positioning of the foil in the water related to the movement of the water. The counterbalancing is slowly coming.. Im just starting to be able to lean into the board and foil when its getting powered up. Most of all I'm just physically getting ramped up. My shoulders are on fire and my core is getting a blast like no other. I've taught myself how to kite (don't recommend), surf, kitefoil, & surfski but this takes the cake. SO rad. Ive had 3 people stop and ask me if I ok post session,. lol. AM I doing it right!? haha Im going to keep at it as I can see 6 months down the road physically being able to pull myself into sections of water/waves and being to put it together so that I can get on foil with regularity. We shall see:)

I'm currently thinking about mast positioning.. I played around with it being mid or closer to the front and what I've found is that the mid point has a longer slower foil initiation. When the mast is towards the front of the board I can get the nose up earlier in my paddle stroke. Ill keep at it and report back. @jondrums - I think you were bang on about the dozen sessions I can see now the work/fun ratio improving slowly.

jondrums

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2022, 03:13:34 PM »
Is this on your 6'3" fanatic board?  Congratulations on getting that board out of the water on boat wake and paddle power alone.  That's a huge accomplishment, and I'm pretty sure I couldn't do it.

FOIL STOKE

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2022, 04:13:13 PM »
@jondrums Im just starting to feel the board lift with paddle power. Im not on foil yet. Added with the swell or wave energy, thats where Im getting the most lift. I did ping someone today who is mostly focused on flat water starts and he said its critical that the mast is placed at the back of the track. I have been mounting forward so I will see how that goes. It makes a lot of sense to me that you would want to trim for the least drag. I feel as though I was plowing a field paddling in the water having it trimmed like it was.

FOIL STOKE

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2022, 01:06:30 PM »
Hey guys.. Just thought I post a video showing session 14. My timing is still off. (love to know if you guys have any advice on the pump timing). I think Im not putting enough front foot pressure down on my sprints. The oscillation required to gain lift on the foil is not happening ... Im too worried about the nose being buried. Anyways having waaay more fun now. Im starting to feel the power of the foil 8)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4PXN1i0xCk


jondrums

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2022, 02:57:18 PM »
I'm no expert  From what I see, I think you are giving up / backing off too early.  It can take a lot more paddling strokes to get fully up to speed - it seems like you are just getting going when you quit.  See if you can get twice as many strokes even if you don't feel it happening yet.  I can't see your stance, but bend your legs and get them involved - you want to be scooching the board forward with each stroke.  That little extra board speed may be all you need. 

FOIL STOKE

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2022, 04:03:00 PM »
@jondrums thank you mate. That makes total sense to me. I will make those adjustments!

Hdip

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2022, 04:45:35 PM »
Are you trying to paddle up in bumps? Looks like you're trying to time the little bumps What foil are you using? It'll have to be pretty big as those bumps seem quite small. I do realize the GoPro angle makes them look smaller.

I don't do that sport, but I'll repeat what I've heard smarter people than me say. Try to get your catch further forward if possible. Get your paddle in the water at or in front of the nose of your board. Get the paddle out of the water by your front foot and for sure out before it get's to your back foot.

I'll agree with Jondrums. Take double the amount of strokes. More slow ones first to build speed, then build speed even more, then start using your legs.

Sounds like you're progressing though and will get there pretty soon though. Nice job.

pafoil

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2022, 10:40:27 PM »
Hey guys.. Just thought I post a video showing session 14. My timing is still off. (love to know if you guys have any advice on the pump timing). I think Im not putting enough front foot pressure down on my sprints. The oscillation required to gain lift on the foil is not happening ... Im too worried about the nose being buried. Anyways having waaay more fun now. Im starting to feel the power of the foil 8)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4PXN1i0xCk

What you are trying is possible but hard. The equipment selection is not ideal for flat starts or catching small bumps. The board is heavy and the foil, perhaps small for your weight. I believe it has been said that you should go first to look for some small rolling waves.
I you still want to catch the waves saw in the video, then I would suggest a longer, lighter and narrower board; a bigger foil and a bigger paddle. 

This is the speed feeling you get per stroke on a narrow board (board 6,9 by 20 , foil GT2200 for 175 lb weight, paddle vdrive 101)

https://www.instagram.com/p/Chwpy06obJu/



FOIL STOKE

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2022, 09:22:16 AM »
Thanks for the comments guys much appreciated.

@Hdip The foil Im running is the Naish 2140 Jet HA with 310 stab. Just last night Ive trimmed up the rear stab for more lift. Even though Im 210lbs I do think Im able to get the paddle power needed. The 106litres is just buoyant enough for me, all though I have to say the learning curve was STEEEEP, lol. Just staying on the board in any swell is a rad workout. What Im telling myself is that with some small adjustments in my technique (more weight forward during catch, more paddles strokes & timing of the bounce and unweighting of the board etc) I should be able to get up. Ive just started to subscribe to Casey and the modules he has is helping - massive.

I believe with very little to zero foil oscillation Ive been able to get the board up to speed and been able to feel the stability of the foil. Especially when I time the unweighting of the board. My aim is to be more accurate with the paddle pump/driving of the front foot and unweighting so I can get the board & foil to start that sine wave. Im hoping with some small timing and technique adjustments, Ill be off and foiling - Hopefully:).

@pafoil Possible but hard - seriously just what I needed to hear! Possible is what I was looking for! I surf/kitefoil as well and I know with the help of a wave it would be much easier. I dont have that locally, just the wind and tidal/wake swell you see in the videos. Thanks for the insta link. The board looks stellar. The more I think about it the game is to start of the board oscillation/pumping in small wavelengths to build up the power and speed without burying the nose and killing the speed. You are bang on with a board that is longer narrower I would be able to do that easier. Ill give it a go on my current setup for now.. but thanks for the heads up as I think you are bang on.

Thank you again for the comments! Cheers!

pafoil

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Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2022, 09:51:22 AM »
Thanks for the comments guys much appreciated.

@Hdip The foil Im running is the Naish 2140 Jet HA with 310 stab. Just last night Ive trimmed up the rear stab for more lift. Even though Im 210lbs I do think Im able to get the paddle power needed. The 106litres is just buoyant enough for me, all though I have to say the learning curve was STEEEEP, lol. Just staying on the board in any swell is a rad workout. What Im telling myself is that with some small adjustments in my technique (more weight forward during catch, more paddles strokes & timing of the bounce and unweighting of the board etc) I should be able to get up. Ive just started to subscribe to Casey and the modules he has is helping - massive.

I believe with very little to zero foil oscillation Ive been able to get the board up to speed and been able to feel the stability of the foil. Especially when I time the unweighting of the board. My aim is to be more accurate with the paddle pump/driving of the front foot and unweighting so I can get the board & foil to start that sine wave. Im hoping with some small timing and technique adjustments, Ill be off and foiling - Hopefully:).

@pafoil Possible but hard - seriously just what I needed to hear! Possible is what I was looking for! I surf/kitefoil as well and I know with the help of a wave it would be much easier. I dont have that locally, just the wind and tidal/wake swell you see in the videos. Thanks for the insta link. The board looks stellar. The more I think about it the game is to start of the board oscillation/pumping in small wavelengths to build up the power and speed without burying the nose and killing the speed. You are bang on with a board that is longer narrower I would be able to do that easier. Ill give it a go on my current setup for now.. but thanks for the heads up as I think you are bang on.

Thank you again for the comments! Cheers!

I started with the same board. Good luck!

 


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