Author Topic: Light Wind Setup - Need Help  (Read 6453 times)

lakemichiganwingfoiler

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Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« on: May 29, 2021, 06:09:26 PM »
Hi All,
Looking for some advice on my next purchase. I am 85kilo's with full wetsuit, booties, and gloves, currently ride a naish s25 75 ltr board, gofoil m200, and naish s26 6.0 meter wing, this setup is perfect for anything above 13 to 15 knots, but the board gets stuck in the water under 13 knots. I am looking for the best option to get going in that 10 knot range. I have a limited budget so I want to get something that gives me the most bang for my buck.

Would a higher volume board say 100 ltrs be the best, the gofoil gl240 foil, a more powerful wing, or inflatable board?

Also, I am winging in fresh water, with decent size wind generated waves.

Thanks!
naish s25 hover 75ltr
Cabrinha mantis v2 6.0 wing
cabrinha mantis 4.0
gofoil gt1400 rs1150 FTL 20

PonoBill

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2021, 11:36:48 PM »
The gofoil 240 is great if you have enough wind to overcome its drag. I find in flat water with light wind I need to get going fairly fast and come up off the water in a gentle curve instead of trying to pump the foil up and then stall. The best setup I've found for light wind is the Axis 1150/390 with the short fuse. I can get up and fly in 8-10.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

lakemichiganwingfoiler

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2021, 07:50:27 AM »
Are you on a sinker board?

Are you kind of saying that you can either go with a board that can get up to enough speed for the foil or a foil that requires a lot less speed?
naish s25 hover 75ltr
Cabrinha mantis v2 6.0 wing
cabrinha mantis 4.0
gofoil gt1400 rs1150 FTL 20

PonoBill

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2021, 10:59:15 PM »
No sinker's for me. I'm 74. If I get much wobblier I'll need a walker frame on my board. Basically, yes, you can use a low aspect, thick wing and try to keep it flying once it pops up (not easy) or get a high aspect, thin wing and get it moving as fast as the wind allows. I haven't seen anyone using a sinker board for light wind--you need to be up and moving, getting all the push you can get from the wind. An efficient board and a low drag foil are the best combination I've found. You can build speed, taking advantage of every gust, and then pump yourself off the surface. Since you already have speed with the high aspect setup you can turn upwind, pick up some apparent wind, and off you go.

With a low aspect, high lift, high drag wing you'll be moving much slower when you clear the surface, and most likely you'll pop up, losing speed rapidly as you rise. If the wind helps a little you might be able to build speed from there, but a lot of people just sag back to the surface.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

surfcowboy

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2021, 02:18:02 AM »
I can say to stay with a big wing. I’m not sure how an HA would work at this end low wind speeds, personally. I’ve simply not gotten to try it.

I found that my smaller board (5’2” vs 6’4”) lifted off faster. No idea why but I can say that most foils lift far before your board planes. This is backed up by almost everyone.

Be sure you’ve learned all you can as far as technique before you switch gear. That m200 should be the low speed take off king. (With drag once you get up but there are trades offs.) are you having issues taking off or staying on foil? If it’s take off, with that wing I’d say to check your technique. If it’s staying on foil then yes, maybe less drag?

I’m switching to a big but thinner profile foil. Not HA but faster. And then there are just limits of when you do some other sport.

Phils

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2021, 04:43:05 AM »
I would say a larger volume board will dramatically help your low end.

pafoil

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2021, 05:15:24 AM »
I can go with a gl240 and a duotone echo 7m in very light conditions. 8 to 10 knt depending on the board.
On a 4,8 (90 litres I need 10 knots).
On a kalama 125 litres, I can go easily in 8 knots (maybe less), or as soon as there is some air moving.

https://youtu.be/eHRrbamd86s

lakemichiganwingfoiler

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #7 on: May 31, 2021, 05:28:42 AM »
@surfcowboy - I have no issues staying on plane once up and going even if the wind drops to 0, just that light wind that I can't seem to get it up on foil. Once I get that locked in feeling in the wing, do some pumping of the board and wing I'm up and running, but that usually happens when the wind is around 14 knots or better. But I definitely need to work on technique more!

What is the volume of your 5'2" and your weight? 

I've been a windsurfer for years and I could go with a larger volume board and much smaller sail and pump my way onto plane. With the wing I though may be you could cheat the volume aspect since you have more upward force of the wing pulling you up and out of the water and with board pumping the foil would also lift you up.
naish s25 hover 75ltr
Cabrinha mantis v2 6.0 wing
cabrinha mantis 4.0
gofoil gt1400 rs1150 FTL 20

surfcowboy

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #8 on: May 31, 2021, 08:03:43 AM »
Lake, yes. I think my foil, at my weight is reducing drag at low speed, just like a prone surfboard does. I can paddle a 5’ surfboard into a wave but a 5’ prone board is doable due to the extra lift.

I’m 140lbs (63kg?) and my 5’2” is 26” wide and 5” thick. I’m guessing in the 90-something liter range. I ride in a 3/2 wetsuit a lot.

It’s good you consider weight. As 30-40 lbs makes a huge difference in how the board drag works for sure.

Since you’re able to stay on foil I’ll bet it’s technique and maybe board. After 6 months I was suddenly able to use 1m smaller wings than I thought I would. Lots of people reporting this now. Good luck and keep updating. We are all still figuring this out.

flkiter

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #9 on: May 31, 2021, 08:21:52 AM »
Try a different wind wing. 6 meter swing, 5.2 ensis, airush, they are great in the lighter winds to get you up.

lakemichiganwingfoiler

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #10 on: July 09, 2021, 06:22:44 AM »
So, I purchased the Fanatic Sky Wing 5'4", which is 95 its. I have had it out a couple times mostly in light wind, which is what I got it for. I can't say it really helps getting up on foil earlier than my Naish 75 ltr. I don't have a wind meter so it's hard to say what kind of wind I am out in, we do have a light house on the water, but the wind meter is on the top, so it may not be the most accurate, but it seems like the same kind of wind I would be getting up on, on the 75 ltr board. It also seems to have to be pumped differently than the 75 ltr board, it may be more of a push type pump, but I am still experimenting on that.

Up in the air the 75ltr board seems much easier for doing almost everything than the 95 ltr board. The 95 seems like there is so much deck and you kind of have to walk around it to find the sweet spot for each thing you are doing such as turning and pumping.

On the plus side for the 95 ltr board, when the wind drops it is definitely easier to stand on since it doesn't sink under my weight. It also seems to be much better balanced for my GoFoils, I can have much more balanced stance than on the 75 ltr where I have to have a fair amount of front foot pressure, but that is because the mast track, in my opinion on the naish is to far forward, so I can't move my foil far enough back.

At this point, I don't think my purchase really helped getting up in lighter wind. I am leaning now toward a bigger more powerful wing to generate enough speed to get the board up and out of the water would have been the better option.
naish s25 hover 75ltr
Cabrinha mantis v2 6.0 wing
cabrinha mantis 4.0
gofoil gt1400 rs1150 FTL 20

surfcowboy

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #11 on: July 09, 2021, 07:29:12 AM »
I was shocked to find my shorter board got on foil faster.

The bigger board for me was good for shlogging off foil and standing/kneeling easier. But I think whatever you can kneel on and start is best. Maybe less drag or weight?

Now sinkers are different. Then anything is better in light wind than those. But I’m not sure the bigger board goes better in light, it’s just easier to deal with.

daswusup

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #12 on: July 09, 2021, 08:23:19 AM »
Its you, not the gear. I and every other winger I know that doesn't live in Maui or the Gorge goes through this "I need more power" phase. The typical outcome is you will buy some giant pig of a Hand wing and use it a couple of times and hate pumping it up and dealing with it. Then you will progress and your newfound skills will have you getting up on foil in the exact same conditions with the same size gear that you couldn't make work 3 weeks ago. The right gear certainly helps but by far,(yours seems fine) the most important thing is time on the water working through all of the little nuances of becoming proficient. I did a whole maui trip 2 years ago, winging everyday and never got up on foil. I came home and changed my foil configuration and was up and flying immediately. Now I can get up and go in almost nothing while others wait for bigger puffs. I never use more than a 5M. Keep at it and spend your budget on foils not bigger wings. I would also suggest moving the mast as far forward in the tracks for max lift on low aspect foils. Good luck and welcome to the Frother's Club!

SUPeter

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #13 on: July 09, 2021, 09:01:18 AM »
After using a straight tailed board(ie. no tail bevel) the least expensive improvement to low wind foiling might be filling in that bevel with high density minicell foam.   The bevel introduces a considerable amount of drag when trying to increase forward speed .  The increase in board speed can at times be enough to lift you up on foil with little or no pumping.  If the foam were faired out with filler and glassed on the surface, much of this drag could be eliminated. 
« Last Edit: July 09, 2021, 09:04:12 AM by SUPeter »

Dontsink

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Re: Light Wind Setup - Need Help
« Reply #14 on: July 09, 2021, 09:20:37 AM »
After using a straight tailed board(ie. no tail bevel) the least expensive improvement to low wind foiling might be filling in that bevel with high density minicell foam.   The bevel introduces a considerable amount of drag when trying to increase forward speed .  The increase in board speed can at times be enough to lift you up on foil with little or no pumping.  If the foam were faired out with filler and glassed on the surface, much of this drag could be eliminated.
Or EVA foam, it works great.

 


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