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Author Topic: Pandemic Project  (Read 1887 times)

808sup

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Pandemic Project
« on: April 26, 2021, 09:05:29 PM »
Well, it began a few months ago...
I have watched as others have made boards for themselves and of course thought about making one too. Procrastination and uncertainty kept me from trying for months but I finally took the leap. Inspired by many of you who have jumped in and completed their builds with success gave me the push to give it a shot. A bit of background first. Avid Downwind paddler for years but when I first saw Kai on the foil I declared to my wife (and myself) that I was all in. Been hooked ever since. Learned to foil kiting so sup foiling came pretty easy for me. Downwinders on a foil sup was one of The hardest things I have learned to do. I did my first attempts at 59 and it was brutal and humbling at first. I had no ski or friend with one but once you learn the technique of getting up on foil you progress quickly. 3 years later and still learning new things.
Anyways, back to the board. Been riding my 6í8 X 26Ē Flying Dutchman since the start but wanted a smaller board like many others have here that are downwinding. I liked the look of kalama boards that he has been riding but couldnít spend that kind of money. (Too cheap😉)  Didnít measure or pull any template from one but I see them under other peoples feet on some of my runs.
Here was the start. I went with a stringered 1.5lb blank because I didnít feel confident in keeping anything symmetric without a stringer and also figuring that my glassing abilities would be subpar and further weaken the board.

surfcowboy

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2021, 07:16:52 AM »
Love it man. Keep us posted. Itís super rewarding and great for those days when you just canít get on the water.

808sup

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2021, 10:41:04 PM »
Cowboy. You were one of those whoís builds gave me inspiration to give it a go. Thanks for that!
So after reading about everything concerning installing tracks I made the decision to install them similarly to how DW does his. I started with chinook boxes as per others suggestions. I had some divinycell leftovers from kiteboard builds. I gorilla glued it to the boxes. I know DW does this and then bags carbon around the whole assembly but I chickened out of that as I donít feel comfortable enough vacuum bagging.
I wasnít quite sure how to cut through the 5Ē of foam to make room for slipping them in but as you can see I made it happen. The goal was to connect the tracks to the top AND bottom of the board to give strength. I used gorilla glue to set them in. (This glue is amazing!) I donít know why all my photos upload 90deg.different but you get the picture I hope.
« Last Edit: April 27, 2021, 10:43:55 PM by 808sup »

PonoBill

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #3 on: April 28, 2021, 11:35:20 AM »
Well, that might work, and you'll know soon enough, but it's a lot stronger if you skink the tracks into a block considerably wider than the track, preferably wide enough to hold both tracks and deep enough to reach top to bottom. If you're using what you had, then it's a noble experiment, if they were wider and you cut them to the width of the track, then it probably qualifies as a fuck up. I recognize that because most of my work is a catalog of fuck ups. It won't be any worse than the first tracked board I used, which had tracks sunk directly into EPS and glassed over. That barely works for fins, much less foils. It's no surprise that the first time I got worked the foil parted company from the board. I was livid when I saw how the boxes were installed.

That method undoubtedly solves the strength issue for torque fore and aft, which is the biggest issue, but it will not do a great deal for sideways and rotational torque, which is probably the primary way that the tracks can delam or crack the glass on the bottom of the board, and probably most of the reason DW bags on carbon. Without a carbon sleeve you don't have anything to resist either twisting or force from the side other than whatever glass/carbon is on the bottom of the board--and the wimpy EPS. It looks like you're doing a great job, which means you're putting a lot of time and effort into the project. I'd be certain to get the track box right.

The big benefit of two individual tracks is you don't need to cut the stringer. That's nice, but you're probably going to put a patch of carbon over the top and bottom anyway. That surely makes up for the missing stringer.

If you can stand to do a little redo before you glass the board, I'd STRONGLY suggest a Blue Planet Strong Box. Yes, it costs $149, but that is not a huge amount more than a block of PVC that size. I like the handle as well--and for sure put it on the bottom. And read the installation instructions on the website, and watch the video. https://www.blueplanetsurf.com/foil-strongbox.html

I did a fairly crappy job of installing one of these into my old Kalama board ( https://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,37177.msg427946.html#msg427946 ) and when that board is finally dead, dead, dead I'll cut the box out and put it in another board--this time it will be one I build for myself.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2021, 12:07:11 PM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

surfcowboy

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #4 on: April 28, 2021, 06:40:29 PM »
808, thx man. Interestingly, those boxes wouldn't be hard to bag. Small stuff is good to learn on. So if you want to try, an aquarium pump works perfectly. (I just bagged my whole 5'2" wing board with it!!) Let me know and I'd be happy to coach you a bit on it. You can start out really down and dirty with minimal gear. Even if you just glassed or carbon wrapped them it would help and then the top to bottom connection would have better side to side strength.

Pono's right, do the boxes well, that's the worst (hardest) part and will mess up your board which looks like it's going to be pretty dope. I'm doing a prone board soon, I'll try to get my bagging/lam partner to shoot more video this time and share that. Watching the pros is hard as they have all the cool gear. Although I watched a flying Dutchman video recently and he was using simple poly bags with the ends tied off in knots. Made me happy to see that.

PonoBill

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2021, 08:24:37 PM »
Mark told me he uses a bunch of Costco paper towels as a bleeder. Really, any plastic bag will work, but it's easier to use the stuff that stretches a lot. Some guys don't use peel ply--just plastic sheet. You don't wind up with that nice texture, and you don't eliminate the excess resin, but you also don't have to throw away a mound of bleeder and peel ply.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

808sup

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2021, 10:59:56 PM »
Well that was disappointing. I guess I didnít think about needing more high density foam. Thatís all I had at the time and thought the carbon top and bottom would suffice. Live and learn. I have already finished this board. Took it on itís maiden voyage last Sunday at Maliko. Told the wife to be ready for a early pickup at Baldwin Beach in case I couldnít get it flying but flew it all the way to the harbor. It was like driving a sports car compared to my 6í8Ē. Totally pleased with the results so far but time will tell if the choices I made in the build were inadequate.
I used the Jimmy Lewis poor man bagging method and was pleased with how it came out. Definitely not as easy as he makes it look but heís a professional and I get that. All in all I canít wait to use it again and learned so much building it that I already have ideas of making a prone too. ( the one I have now is 29l and itís good in the air but work in the water)

PonoBill

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #7 on: April 29, 2021, 07:38:26 AM »
Looks great. The bottom especially looks fabulous, you did a stellar job on the mast track slots and the finish.

There's no reason for disappointment, as I said, if that's what you had, it's a noble experiment. It might work perfectly and you may well have found the minimal effective approach to setting tracks in a foil board. Absent some sophisticated modeling there isn't any way to find out until you try it. Given how well you did with the lamination I don't quite understand why you didn't do the full DW approach. You wouldn't add much significant weight and you have two "tubes" of carbon connecting the top to the bottom. But I don't know that it's necessary, it's just a guess.

My Kalama board weighs a ton--mostly because of extensive delam repairs. But the choice of cutting the stringer and using a full box contributes to the weight and could be gross overbuilding.

So far, that looks great. Keep a close eye on the edges of the tracks. I'll be very interested to see if this works.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2021, 07:51:53 AM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

tarquin

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2021, 11:17:15 AM »
Wow that was quick. Nice work. Is that your first time glassing?

PonoBill

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2021, 02:17:29 PM »
Take a look at my mast slots then look at yours. You don't need advice from me.

Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

808sup

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2021, 12:02:14 AM »
Wow that was quick. Nice work. Is that your first time glassing?
I successfully made a midrange longboard about 20years ago. Blank was already as far as rocker. I just had to thin it out to preference. I remember having glassed on fins because I was to scared to put fcs plugs in and found out later there was a jig for laying them out. 😬I watched many vids on YouTube that gave me courage to try making a sup with eps. Didnít use a Hotwire even though I watched many a vid on how to make one. I have a hitachi surfboard planer that I used but didnít feel comfortable using when dimensions  got close to where I wanted them. Took longer but I felt more comfortable with a sure form.
Bill, l filled the tracks with scraps of foam and then laminated right over them. Took measurements before I laminated and when done I drilled a hole big enough to use a router bit to finish the work. Pretty stoked how they turned out.
I learned a lot while doing this board. Hopefully it will hold together long enough for lots of downwinders. ( this weekend looks good) 🤞

PonoBill

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2021, 12:55:35 AM »
I did the same, just a bit more sloppy. I tend to go for quick over good.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

808sup

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2021, 09:05:39 PM »
Got a chance to try the board I made this weekend. My wife took a short clip of me with her phone as I finished my maliko on Saturday. It was pretty windy (maybe 22mpg and gusty) and I had a hard time standing up on the board outside of maliko. My old Flying Dutchman was 6'8" about 21' nose and tail and 26 5/8.  With it being so wide and stable I could paddle with feet in parallel stance until I felt the push and then switch to surf stance. This board is 6' with a 18 3/4 nose and a 15 3/4 tail by 23 5/8 so I'm learning to stand and paddle in surf stance almost immediately to get control. The board popped up surprisingly quick for 6ft. I had to drop off foil 1/4 mile short of the harbor as the tugboat was bringing in a barge. It was tougher getting going again as there was all kinds of chop and backwash as everywhere but I persevered and made it to the ramp once I got going. Rough clip but you get the idea. http://youtu.be/1sPRQQKaY1E

PonoBill

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #13 on: May 02, 2021, 09:12:12 PM »
I saw the barge lining up to get into the harbor in the wicked, gusty wind and thought "I'm glad I'm not doing a Maliko run, that barge is gonna have some problems." I did a few more runs out to the mouth, managed a few half-assed foiling jibes, and called it a day.

Your wind estimate is a bit off. iWindsurf showed 25 to 35 at Kanaha about the time you came in. I was overpowered on a 4.2 in the harbor. The smaller folks were on 2.0 to 3.0. The chop, bounce, and wave energy coming in the mouth was nutty but fun with a wing. My wicked little Flying Dutchman 5'11" X 30 is a handful in that chop, but so much fun.

« Last Edit: May 02, 2021, 09:42:12 PM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

808sup

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Re: Pandemic Project
« Reply #14 on: May 03, 2021, 08:46:25 PM »
Saturday was windier than I thought. Sunday was a lot less near the top of the run but I still got going. There must have been 8 wingers launching just before I arrived at Maliko. One poor soul was still struggling to get going as I paddled out but he finally got it going just as I was about to stand up. He was getting pretty close to the rocks😰. Surprised to not see anybody except two oc-1 paddlers on my way to the harbor. Normally the wingers in the harbor are plentiful but it was oddly sparse when I arrived. So much so that I wondered if there had been a shark sighting or something.

 


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