Author Topic: Boom to non boom wing comparison  (Read 11483 times)

deja vu

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deja vu

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #46 on: June 19, 2021, 05:58:44 PM »
The issue I have with attaching a "boom" to the handles is that you still have side to side flex (and some forward and back flex) through the handles because they have some "give". You can try and minimize this but you can't completely eliminate it -- it's the nature of the beast.  Booms that form part of the wing, since they are "locked-in" to the strut (Echo, Slick, etc.), have a solid feel and if you move the boom forwards or back or twist the boom up or down with your hands the response or feedback from the wing is immediate, direct and firm -- there is no "extra" or additional twist or movement or delay as there is through relatively soft handles. This makes the wing much more responsive to rider input (in my opinion).
« Last Edit: June 19, 2021, 06:08:55 PM by deja vu »

Hilly

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #47 on: June 19, 2021, 09:01:49 PM »
One is not better than the other, it is what suits you. Wing ding is a new discipline which I hope does not go down the path of windsurfing and get specialised to a point it priced itself out of the market with you needing so much kit a van was full, then all the gear was out of date next season. I love the fact I can fit my wing in one bag with the pump and that is all I need, or a paddle if the wind drops off. Handles work well for me, no need for extra stuff. Keep it simple s....  ;D
He who is having the most fun wins. ;)

FedorBOS

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #48 on: August 29, 2021, 09:11:00 AM »
Bringing this one back. To each their own, but for anyone who has not tried a wing with a 'real' boom I strongly encourage you to do so.

I finally got the 6M Slick I ordered in May, and took it out yesterday, and it is a brave new world of control and power. The wind was a bit too light and gusty, but with the boom I could absolutely hammer pumps whenever a puff came along to get up on foil. When it was supper light and I was just slogging, I used one hand in the middle of the boom and saved energy while I waited for the next puff. While the aluminum boom is a bit heavy (carbon still not available) the benefits, at least for light wind riding, are 100% worth it.

If you are usually riding in 20+ knots so there is always adequate pressure on the wing, maybe it is less important, but I'm a convert. I went in with high expectations (usually a recipe for disappointment) and the experience actually exceeded my highest hopes for how a boomed wing would perform. If they were actually available, and the next model year was not so close, I would buy a full quiver of Slicks today.

PonoBill

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #49 on: August 29, 2021, 10:42:13 AM »
Bringing this one back. To each their own, but for anyone who has not tried a wing with a 'real' boom I strongly encourage you to do so.

I finally got the 6M Slick I ordered in May, and took it out yesterday, and it is a brave new world of control and power. The wind was a bit too light and gusty, but with the boom I could absolutely hammer pumps whenever a puff came along to get up on foil. When it was supper light and I was just slogging, I used one hand in the middle of the boom and saved energy while I waited for the next puff. While the aluminum boom is a bit heavy (carbon still not available) the benefits, at least for light wind riding, are 100% worth it.

If you are usually riding in 20+ knots so there is always adequate pressure on the wing, maybe it is less important, but I'm a convert. I went in with high expectations (usually a recipe for disappointment) and the experience actually exceeded my highest hopes for how a boomed wing would perform. If they were actually available, and the next model year was not so close, I would buy a full quiver of Slicks today.

Making a carbon boom out of the aluminum one is literally five minutes work. I've done several for TJ at Big Winds using the Black Project silver-colored paddle shaft, and they're gorgeous. But I could make one out of almost any shaft, though the extreme taper Quickblade versions on their newest paddles might be a challenge.

I don't find side-to-side flex to be an issue with fake booms the way I make them, with two velcro straps for each of the furthest front and furthest back handles, even for the new F-one Strike, which has longer and more floppy handles than the Swing. The two straps stretch the handle out and reduce the effect of increasing distance from the strut that grabbing the handle in the middle or using a single attachment causes. That's one reason why I find the short bridging "boom" offered by some wing manufacturers so pointless. They allow more options for hand placement during transitions, but they don't make the handles less floppy--they flop even more.

Even a locked-in boom, like those on any Duotone other than the echo, has side-to-side movement. I inflated my 7M Duotone echo and my 6M Slick with the fake boom to see how much difference there is. The answer is--not much. If I pull the boom side to side close to the leading edge on the echo, it is substantially stiffer than the Slick, but even at the midpoint there's hardly a difference at all, and further back the fake boom actually looks stiffer. That makes sense, the fake boom is anchored to the strut, the duotone is just connected to the canopy.  If I wasn't so lazy I'd do it again and shoot video, but you can wiggle stuff for yourself.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2021, 10:58:26 AM by PonoBill »
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Caribsurf

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #50 on: August 29, 2021, 03:03:00 PM »
Bringing this one back. To each their own, but for anyone who has not tried a wing with a 'real' boom I strongly encourage you to do so.

I finally got the 6M Slick I ordered in May, and took it out yesterday, and it is a brave new world of control and power. The wind was a bit too light and gusty, but with the boom I could absolutely hammer pumps whenever a puff came along to get up on foil. When it was supper light and I was just slogging, I used one hand in the middle of the boom and saved energy while I waited for the next puff. While the aluminum boom is a bit heavy (carbon still not available) the benefits, at least for light wind riding, are 100% worth it.

If you are usually riding in 20+ knots so there is always adequate pressure on the wing, maybe it is less important, but I'm a convert. I went in with high expectations (usually a recipe for disappointment) and the experience actually exceeded my highest hopes for how a boomed wing would perform. If they were actually available, and the next model year was not so close, I would buy a full quiver of Slicks today.


Making a carbon boom out of the aluminum one is literally five minutes work. I've done several for TJ at Big Winds using the Black Project silver-colored paddle shaft, and they're gorgeous. But I could make one out of almost any shaft, though the extreme taper Quickblade versions on their newest paddles might be a challenge.

I don't find side-to-side flex to be an issue with fake booms the way I make them, with two velcro straps for each of the furthest front and furthest back handles, even for the new F-one Strike, which has longer and more floppy handles than the Swing. The two straps stretch the handle out and reduce the effect of increasing distance from the strut that grabbing the handle in the middle or using a single attachment causes. That's one reason why I find the short bridging "boom" offered by some wing manufacturers so pointless. They allow more options for hand placement during transitions, but they don't make the handles less floppy--they flop even more.

Even a locked-in boom, like those on any Duotone other than the echo, has side-to-side movement. I inflated my 7M Duotone echo and my 6M Slick with the fake boom to see how much difference there is. The answer is--not much. If I pull the boom side to side close to the leading edge on the echo, it is substantially stiffer than the Slick, but even at the midpoint there's hardly a difference at all, and further back the fake boom actually looks stiffer. That makes sense, the fake boom is anchored to the strut, the duotone is just connected to the canopy.  If I wasn't so lazy I'd do it again and shoot video, but you can wiggle stuff for yourself.

I totally agree with you on pumping and wing response with the boom. The Duotone with boom feels much more responsive with a solid feel and quick reaction, while my non boom wings feel a little bouncy and are slower to capture the wind when pumping....
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SurfIC

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #51 on: August 30, 2021, 01:33:28 AM »
I think wings are a very personal choice. Since starting I've owned Slingwing v2, Fone v1, Takoon, Gong and Slick. I've also tested Fone Strike, Rrd, Echo and a few others. Theres no doubt the Slick is a great wing but I'm going back to handles. In light wind it drops easily when managing the board and wing when climbing on the board. The extra boom weight (non carbon) is significant. I find it a bit unruly when taking it for a walk or holding it in neutral and the boom takes up alot of space out of the water. Truly great for transitions though.

If people get the opportunity to test its well worth it. When the Strike came out I was convinced by marketing, reviews and the local shop riding them that this was my next wing. I tried it and really disliked it. I have settled on my wing choice knowing my criteria - lightweight, small wingspan, no windows, small pack up, minimal fuss wing.
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Dontsink

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #52 on: August 30, 2021, 02:55:55 AM »
I have two carbon tubes ready to try as booms.But the Takoon wings i am using right now are so lightweight and nice to maneuver with that i am not motivated to experiment at all.
I am used to the handles anyway,adding any weight is a big turnoff right now.

FedorBOS

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #53 on: August 30, 2021, 05:52:32 AM »


Making a carbon boom out of the aluminum one is literally five minutes work. I've done several for TJ at Big Winds using the Black Project silver-colored paddle shaft, and they're gorgeous. But I could make one out of almost any shaft, though the extreme taper Quickblade versions on their newest paddles might be a challenge.
[/quote]

I have an old carbon SUP paddle I plan to convert. The Slick boom is oblong, and the paddle shaft is round, so not sure the ends will pop on, but I expect I could trim and shove a bit and make it work. I may just shape them out of foam and carbon glass them as another poster did. Takes a little longer, but then I still have my original boom if all goes south.

I'm sure a well built bolt on boom has the same outcome - I simply meant that duct taping a broom stick to the handles was not the same thing. I also expect the boom attachment methodology will evolve / improve quickly - the Slick system is meh at present, but serviceable.

It will remain a matter of taste, and I'm still very much a noob so even I take my opinion with a grain of salt. That said, the difference in low wind control and pumping efficiency between my Ozon Wasp and the Slick was night and day. When slogging the Wasp required active management to make sure no tip dips etc., the Slick was incredibly easy. I'm sure if I were better at this sport the difference would be negligible, but I'm always looking for ways to substitute technology for skill, so definitely a game changer as of now.

Now I'm going to go wiggle stuff for myself.

deja vu

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #54 on: September 09, 2021, 10:39:12 AM »
This wing will also be available with a carbon boom in a few months -- something I'm interested in:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_fWL4mzxDE

PonoBill

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #55 on: September 09, 2021, 05:03:45 PM »
I have an old carbon SUP paddle I plan to convert. The Slick boom is oblong, and the paddle shaft is round, so not sure the ends will pop on, but I expect I could trim and shove a bit and make it work. I may just shape them out of foam and carbon glass them as another poster did. Takes a little longer, but then I still have my original boom if all goes south.

Yes, but the conversion to round carbon is easy. When you take the ends off you'll see the ends are fairly thin. They are under compression so you don't need a lot of strength. I slit the front plastic ferrule, and I think I just forced the much smaller back one into place. Then just drill holes and rivet. It's reasonably obvious.
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deja vu

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #56 on: September 11, 2021, 07:28:31 AM »
Duotone has a new light wing for 2022 to compete with the Ocean Rodeo.  It has two solid handles that bolt onto the wing (the standard Unit will also have the two solid handles).  Take a look at the 5:52 mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCYgWPR6sB8&t=5s
« Last Edit: September 11, 2021, 07:34:01 AM by deja vu »

PonoBill

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #57 on: September 11, 2021, 10:46:33 AM »
That Duotone Alula wing was in the water pretty much any time there was wind at the AWSI show.
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radair

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #58 on: September 15, 2021, 02:46:13 PM »
Duotone has a new light wing for 2022 to compete with the Ocean Rodeo.  It has two solid handles that bolt onto the wing (the standard Unit will also have the two solid handles).  Take a look at the 5:52 mark...
Check the 3:30 mark for another look. Those are good looking handles (if the diameter is right)!

EastBayFoiler

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Re: Boom to non boom wing comparison
« Reply #59 on: September 25, 2021, 04:54:53 PM »
So I thought I'd throw this in here. I got my first SUP lesson today. I was talking with the guys at the shop and when they start people on wings they paddle upwind, inflate the wings on the water, strap their paddles to handles, and just have a nice easy down winder. I thought this was kinda neat. It seems like this would be harder on wing with a boom.
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