Author Topic: Thruster vs Quad test on new board  (Read 7151 times)

StarboardSUPMan

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Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« on: February 07, 2021, 06:31:54 PM »
I just bought another board and it came with a 5 fin setup.  I've been wanting to do a thruster vs quad test on the same day, same conditions, same board for a while.
Today was the day.  I got the GoPro ready and brought my fins down to the beach.  Tried to show the differences.  Day was light offshore winds with knee high sets.  Had a blast on both setups and enjoyed both of their qualities.  Here is the video that I made.
https://youtu.be/TFdTsdfJniM

Here is a link with pictures to both of the setups and measurements on the fins (quads & thruster) future fin boxes.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/dJ57hALBxqpA4LNJ9

Here are some of the notes I wrote down after the session.

A bit about my surfing style.  I am heavy back foot, prefer surfing top to bottom and really hitting the lip.  I mostly surf thruster setup on all my boards I have struggled in the past with quads.  I have ridden quads on my wide tail boards (L41 SimSup) but don't seem to enjoy them on my other boards.

Board specs.  8' x 28.25" x 3.5" - 95 Liter SurfTech Superfly
I had to run larger than normal thruster and quad fins to prevent the tail from slipping.  Possibly due to wide tail 18.25" wide at 12" up from the tail?

My biggest gripe about quads going into this is the lack of standardization.  It seems every board I own had a different spot on the tail for quads.  Most being right on the edges of the rail.  This board has the rear fins closer to the center like a Mckee setup I've heard so much about.  I hope this becomes more of a standard since I enjoyed the quads in this board, but quads in my other boards just did not work for me.  Thrusters seem to all follow the same template making them my go to for confidence and consistency.


Quads
Wider board is gonna like quads more.  You get more fin area where you need it.  Maybe 18” and wider at 12” off the tail needs quads?
It seems like I need to surf bigger quads than thrusters.  Bigger fronts and big rears which is more total fin area compared to thruster.
McKee fin setup with rear fins closer to the center of the board works much better for me rather than having them on the rails which makes them too loose for me.

Pros
Faster down the line
On a cutback you can push with your rear leg, blow the fins out and throw some spray.
Keep speed in a hard turn.   

Cons
I’ve had issues sliding out on hard bottom turns on bigger waves.  Bigger fins and McKee setup could help?
Has a tendency to lock up on me when I’m not on rail (when all 4 fins are engaged tracking straight)
Can’t pump the board for speed.

Thrusters
I mostly surf thrusters.  Standard g5 template has worked for me on most boards.  This board need a bit bigger fin setup.  I move the center fin up about an 1” for smaller days.  Makes turning in a small pocket easier.

Pros
Can pump the board.  Love compressing and decompressing to build speed
Very accurate and quick turns.  Top to bottom surfing.
Easy to put the board on rail and hit the lip.  Never get that locked up feeling
No slipping out on hard turns
Can confidently commit to your turns in bigger days

Cons
Can’t blow out the fins nearly as easy (fun on small days)
Lose significant speed in turns.  Hurts you on small waves.
Feels stiff if you’ve been surfing quads (I felt this right away when I switched)
Doesn’t work as well on wide tail boards

Overall the quads felt like they had more speed and flow on the smaller knee high waves.  The turns were smoother and carried the speed back into the pocket.  With the thruster I could really whip the board around, at the cost of speed.  Quads let me play around more and throw some spray.  I look forward to doing this test again on waist-chest high waves to see the difference.

I can see a benefit to quads on days where the waves are fatter and more crumbly where you have more time to do turns with more flow and arc.  And also on days where the waves are hollow and barrelling where you just want that speed and there is no time to pump the board.  Just drop in and go.  For barrelling waves I've also noticed with thrusters it's harder to hold into the face of wave when it starts to get really steep.  Having 2 big fins engaged will probably help with that.  I play on testing this in the future and get out of my comfort zone.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2021, 06:36:19 PM by StarboardSUPMan »

TallDude

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2021, 10:23:30 PM »
Good comparison. I would agree completely with your comments. When it's really big and fast, I like the locked in thruster feel. Where as the Quads in that situation can get squirrelly. With the conditions I typically surf in, for me the looser Quads are more.
It's not overhead to me!
8'8" L-41 ST and a whole pile of boards I rarely use.

justsomeguy

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2021, 09:17:34 AM »
Great comparison and video!

But what about the twin setup? ... seems like that would be worth a look too. Not talking about just using 2 of your thruster or quad fins, but an appropriately sized set of twin fins. Especially in the softer waves we get in FL, would be interesting to see how the speed, top-bottom maneuverability, and fin blow out characteristics compare. Expect the wider boards would again benefit the most.
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StarboardSUPMan

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2021, 12:13:15 PM »
Thank you!  Twin fins would be fun to test.  Unfortunately most of my fins are FCS so I'll have to keep an eye out for futures twin setups.

Fin setups have always been a mystery to me.  No one can ever give a definitive answer because it always depends on your local waves and how they break your skill level and of course the board you are riding.  That's what drove me to do this test and hopefully more.  To get some understanding of what changes when you switch fins around on the same day.

Caribsurf

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2021, 02:07:00 PM »
Thank you SBSUPman..finally an in-depth report on thruster vs quad.  I have been trying to find good feedback on this that wasn’t generic or scripted.  Your findings are really interesting. 

I ride both set ups but on entirely different boards
8’10” x 28” 118 ltr Hobie Raw (Thruster)
8’7” x 29” 115 liter Jimmy Lewis Kwad (Quad)

Obviously two entirely different shapes, and hard to compare, but I find the Hobie thruster incredibly loose and fast and exciting, while the Jimmy Lewis not so much.  I have had some fun sessions on the JL Kwad Quad, but can’t figure it out and whether I Like the board or not.  I do like the stability and eases it catches waves, but once on the wave its sluggish compared to the Hobie.  Maybe its me not the board, but it’s definitely y not as fast as the Hobie Raw.   

I’d like to ride the same board as a thruster and then as a Kwad like you did to see if I notice anything.  Unfortunately Hobie is Thruster or twin/single fin only and Jimmy Lewis only set up as Quad.    I rode Fish twin fins as a kid for years. Probably just because that’s what was popular . I never noticed anything truthfully.

Hobie Raw 8'10"
Jimmy Lewis Kwad 8'7"
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surlygringo

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2021, 03:28:27 PM »
I am a bit of a fin junkie, so I enjoy a good test as much as the next guy, but I think testing primarily shows you which fins you like on the board you are testing. I wouldn’t use it to extrapolate about thrusters or quads in general. Most shapers that I have talked to design their boards around a certain fin cluster and usually their boards go best with that set up. However, people need to sell boards so everybody throws in 5 boxes now. I ride both thrusters and quads in sups and shortboards, but I can’t really think of a board where I switch back and forth. I find if the board works best as a quad it does everything better with quads and visa versa. It could also be a lack of expertise, but I find a good board goes okay no matter what crappy set of mismatched fins I throw on there. And the reverse is true. A board I find slow and awkward doesn’t become magic with better fins.

StarboardSUPMan

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2021, 04:47:15 PM »
Caribsurf - Thanks I have been waiting a while to do this just never found the time.  I am like you a lot of my boards like my L41 SimSup didn't offer a 5 fin setup and probably wouldn't have worked well with it.  My Lokahi custom pro is only thruster.  So once I had this board with the 5 fin setup I had to do it.  I'm not sure I'd recommend it, but I have installed center fin boxes on a board for my friend and he liked it better.  So that's always an option.

surlygringo - Agreed the size/shape of the fins have a lot to play.  I'm not quite sure what this board was mean to be setup with, I guess thrusters?  I just wanted to see with all other factors the same what did changing the fins actually do.  All factors the same and only the fins the swapped what did it change.  Controlling as many variables as possible.  To some it's obvious but I was surprised at the results.

sflinux

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2021, 12:11:37 PM »
Thats cool that you found a board that works with both quads and thruster.  Most of the boards I've tried work better at one.
Looks like for the quads you settled on the equivalent of the PSH quad set (Pancho Sullivan front/ Controller Rear).  This has a combined surface area of 59.14.
For the thruster, you have the Pancho Sullivan front and GL2 center giving a combined surface area of 51.67.
Some Quad e.x. references:
The Controller quad 60.6.
GL2 quad 57.7
Stretch Quad 53.8
Some Thruster e.x references:
Pancho thruster 52.5
Colin Mcphillips thruster 49.9
Let's assume you are on a steep wave and the outside fin is out of the water, and only account of the area of the inside fin for quad (and center for thruster):
Your Pancho + Controller quad has an area = 29.57
Your Pancho + GL2 = 34.16.
Some Quad e.x. references:
The Controller quad 30.3
GL2 quad  28.9
Stretch Quad 26.91
Some Thruster e.x. references:
Pancho thruster 35.02
Colin Mcphillips thruster 32.92
When I play with fin sets I like to monitor the total area, maybe give you a clue of what to expect.   
Quiver Shaped by: Joe Blair, Blane Chambers, Jimmy Lewis, Kirk McGinty, and Bob Pearson.
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StarboardSUPMan

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2021, 12:24:52 PM »
sflinux - thats a very scientific approach to fins, it I like it.  That could explain my issues with my smaller quads sliding out in hard turns or steep waves.  I will make sure to keep my eye on the surface area from now on.  I usually just look at the fin and classify it as big/medium/small (not very technical at all haha!).

TallDude

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2021, 12:31:10 PM »
You know that Single Fins rule and are way... cooler. Rusty beat up old truck, a big beard, local IPA's, long boards and single fins. You're missing the whole surf thing! ;D
It's not overhead to me!
8'8" L-41 ST and a whole pile of boards I rarely use.

sflinux

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2021, 12:57:09 PM »
The Hobie CMLB Raw rips as a thruster.  But I really dig riding it with a 8.5" single fin on small days.  The 12' PSH Gun is also fun as a single fin.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2021, 01:15:59 PM by sflinux »
Quiver Shaped by: Joe Blair, Blane Chambers, Jimmy Lewis, Kirk McGinty, and Bob Pearson.
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Caribsurf

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2021, 02:39:16 PM »
Hmmmm never thought of going single fin with my Hobie Raw, might have to give it a go....
Hobie Raw 8'10"
Jimmy Lewis Kwad 8'7"
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Beasho

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2021, 04:49:14 PM »
The Hobie CMLB Raw rips as a thruster.  But I really dig riding it with a 8.5" single fin on small days.  The 12' PSH Gun is also fun as a single fin.

Funny - I have ridden my PSH 12' as a single fin for almost 10 years.  The reason - It is faster.  I don't care about turning so much. 

As a quad it was a DOG!  I pretty much use the 12' PSH when it is guaranteed 12 to 15' faces and UP, UP and Away.   

justsomeguy

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2021, 05:37:12 PM »
Oh! ... did somebody say single fin?

I just happen to have a single fin 4-sale in the zone's classifieds right now   ;)

https://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,36992.0.html
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StarboardSUPMan

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Re: Thruster vs Quad test on new board
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2021, 04:44:19 PM »
I got out on another session with the thruster.  Moved the center fin forward another half an inch.  Seemed to loosen it up a little bit more which I liked.  Trying to find that happy place.

Here is the session.  I didn't get to switch over to quad, but we're supposed to have some swell for a while so I'll get a chance to dedicate a session to that.

https://youtu.be/0hQmOyxkX0A

 


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