Author Topic: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?  (Read 1011 times)

exiled

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What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« on: December 01, 2020, 11:30:30 PM »
I'm on a 4'8 right now, just getting good enough to pump out into two for ones. Is jumping on board 2 inches shorter going to do much to help my pump game? Or would it be better to order a narrower board instead so I don't catch rails on turns as easily?

Hdip

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Re: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2020, 06:01:33 AM »
What’s the width of your current board. I’m on a 4’8”. Picking up a 4’6” today. Will report back in a week or so.

jondrums

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Re: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2020, 11:53:24 AM »
my experience is that it isn't just the length.  think about:
1) swing weight.  Light weight and short are great here. But a longer board that is lighter can be lower swing weight depending on how much lighter and if the nose shape is pulled in or thinned out.
2) balance point of the board+foil in relation to the foil - pick up your board/foil upside down and you want it to balance about one third to one half of the way back from the leading edge of the front wing.  That means the lifting center of the foil is aligned with the center of mass of the board.  When you unweight the board to pump, it'll fly along lifting up nicely.  If it is too front heavy, it won't come up as well when you unweight it.
3) with the foil adjusted to the right spot for weight balance point as in #2 above, it is also hopefully in the right spot versus the floating center of the board while you're paddling into the wave

All in all, I'd say once you're down to a 4'8" board, if its decently well weight balanced (#2 above) then going shorter is going to have only a minor effect.  You'll get bigger gains by working on your technique - staying high out of the water on the foil being the biggest one.

bigmtn

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Re: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« Reply #3 on: December 02, 2020, 03:29:06 PM »
shorter will usually pump better, however you might run into the problem of catching a lot less waves.  I had a 4'4 that i loved when I was up on foil, but was often frustrated with missing waves that I would have normally been able to catch on my larger prone boards.

juandesooka

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Re: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2020, 09:50:53 PM »
that's my worry bigmtn.  Even going to 4.9 from my 5.0, the volume drop meant not being able to paddle effectively -- though so nice once up riding.   I am going to try making a 4.4, similar to Ride Engine Escape Pod, but an inch thicker...see if I can get best of both worlds, short pumper but also enough volume to be paddleable by middle-aged mortal.  I report back around xmas time wooo



exiled

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Re: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2020, 11:11:01 PM »
What’s the width of your current board. I’m on a 4’8”. Picking up a 4’6” today. Will report back in a week or so.

4'8x22x3.5 @49L. I'm about 220 lbs, but I figure I can shave off 5L and not lose much in paddling.

Surfside

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Re: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2020, 03:40:09 AM »
my experience is that it isn't just the length.  think about:
1) swing weight.  Light weight and short are great here. But a longer board that is lighter can be lower swing weight depending on how much lighter and if the nose shape is pulled in or thinned out.
2) balance point of the board+foil in relation to the foil - pick up your board/foil upside down and you want it to balance about one third to one half of the way back from the leading edge of the front wing.  That means the lifting center of the foil is aligned with the center of mass of the board.  When you unweight the board to pump, it'll fly along lifting up nicely.  If it is too front heavy, it won't come up as well when you unweight it.
3) with the foil adjusted to the right spot for weight balance point as in #2 above, it is also hopefully in the right spot versus the floating center of the board while you're paddling into the wave

All in all, I'd say once you're down to a 4'8" board, if its decently well weight balanced (#2 above) then going shorter is going to have only a minor effect.  You'll get bigger gains by working on your technique - staying high out of the water on the foil being the biggest one.

Excellent! Will keeps this in mind on the next board build.

Thanks

Wetstuff

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Re: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2020, 06:09:50 AM »
JD... "2) balance point of the board+foil in relation to the foil - pick up your board/foil upside down and you want it to balance about one third to one half of the way back from the leading edge of the front wing.  That means the lifting center of the foil is aligned with the center of mass of the board.  When you unweight the board to pump, it'll fly along lifting up nicely.  If it is too front heavy, it won't come up as well when you unweight it."

At what length would you discard these parameters?  Some of those early downwind boards had massive front overhangs.  I am trying to figure out general placement for a 9-0 inflatable without the ability to test in advance.  Thanks. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QfFRvd7H6I&feature=emb_logo

Jim
Atlantis Mistress .. Blue Planet MultiTasker ..   Atlantis Venom

surfcowboy

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Re: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2020, 08:09:12 AM »
Duct tape will allow a little testing. 😂 But seriously you could make a small plate out of 1/4" ply and it wouldn't affect the test that much.


For my longboard wavestorm I used the Gong Carter pics and calculated the difference in length. They made a 9' with boxes.

jondrums

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Re: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« Reply #9 on: December 03, 2020, 08:56:36 PM »
At what length would you discard these parameters?  Some of those early downwind boards had massive front overhangs.  I am trying to figure out general placement for a 9-0 inflatable without the ability to test in advance.  Thanks. 

The magic board will be one where the foil placement for best pumping matches the foil placement location for wave catching.  Its a bit of an elusive thing, so I'm not sure I know enough to speak well on this. My first guess would be that it might be impossible to match these up in a board that big, so you should probably pick the best location for wave catch.  Essentially I think this would mean your weighting and foot position for paddling into a wave matches the weighting once you're on foil.   In other words, the lifting center of the foil is in the same location as the neutral buoyancy position of the board when floating in a level position.

At one point back in the day, Alex Aguerra had some suggestions on where to put the foil for various board lengths.  I followed this on my 9' modified SUP and since it was tuttle, I'll never know if it was right.  It doesn't pump for shit though.

Most of my time is on SUP boards, and I can tell you for certain that matching the foil position to the center of gravity of the board makes a big difference for pumping.

Hdip

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Re: What difference does a couple of inches make on your board?
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2020, 07:08:49 PM »
Reporting back. I went from a Sarah plain n tall 4’8”. To a 4’6” of these. https://www.instagram.com/p/CGszzBVjnuu/?igshid=aipl91nqw0kc

The difference was huge. Better pump. Better turns. It made a wing I was struggling with feel amazing.

 


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