Author Topic: Wing boards vs. SUP boards  (Read 1062 times)

exiled

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Wing boards vs. SUP boards
« on: October 28, 2020, 03:25:12 PM »
So I'm looking for a new SUP foilboard, not entirely sure I want to start winging, but maybe I guess. I noticed the larger fanatic and quatro wing boards are really close to what I'm looking for size wise in the foil sup though. Are there any design choices (rocker, conclaves, etc. ) that make them unsuitable or less than ideal for sup foiling?

surfcowboy

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Re: Wing boards vs. SUP boards
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2020, 05:44:19 PM »
Iím curious as to what folks say. I will offer that from my recent research it seems to be size dependent.

Shorter wing boards have the mast at the very back of the board and some have more specific things like flat bottoms and no concaves which could make paddling straight harder. (I do fine with my flat bottom SUP foil)

There are also volume distribution differences but those are more subtle than I can speak to.

But from what I see the larger ones seem to be pretty well suited for SUP or winging. If youíre a beginner winger, Iíd say itís fine. That said, Iím now building a wing board thatís too small to paddle now that Iím getting on foil consistently so maybe Iím arguing against my point here.

Admin

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Re: Wing boards vs. SUP boards
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2020, 02:02:30 AM »
One thing to watch for is rocker at the foil track.  I had a Fanatic SUP early on that wasn't flat there.  It drove me nuts.  Move the foil a cm forward or back and the angle changes.  Flat through the track means no shimming which is really nice.  If you are new to foiling, it is really tricky to isolate what is going wrong with your gear.  Little things like this can make a big difference.

daswusup

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Re: Wing boards vs. SUP boards
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2020, 06:25:52 AM »
I have been buying a bunch of wing/sup boards in the past couple of years. I had a SS Outwit 5'6" which I used for supping and learning to wing. It worked amazing for both. I sold it and got 2 smaller boards more wing specific. Gong HIPE 5'2" 110L and a Moon Buddy 5' 80L. I was hoping that the Gong would be my new supfoil board. I had it out in the waves for a couple of sessions and it paddles like complete dogchit compared to the Outwit. Like, I couldn't catch waves. Too tippy and hard to paddle straight even for a few strokes to get on. Reminded me of trying to go supping on small sup boards years ago and losing the fun of picking off everything.  It is great for winging and I will keep it for my kids and others to try winging. I only use the MB for winging now. I haven't tried but think the MB will be a decent prone foilboard. I believe that the Outwit had some decent shape to it that gave it at least some good paddling characteristics. The Gong is just a little flat tugboat with no shape. Conclusion: Wingboards and supfoilboards are two different things that cannot be combined outside of learning to wing on a larger board. This only lasts a few sessions with proper conditions IMHO. I am 82 Kilos(185lbs). If I ever got another supfoil it will likely be in the 6' 120L range. I want easy in on the waves. Send it!!!!

juandesooka

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Re: Wing boards vs. SUP boards
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2020, 12:19:17 PM »
A few random thoughts ... my supfoil progression over past 3-4 years has been through-hull bolts on a standard 9.2 sup, then a foil tracks on a 7.6 door board, then a 6.8 purpose-built supfoil.  And now a 5' wingboard DIY homage to fanatic sky board.  I mostly prone surf foil now, not much supfoil any more, so the use of these boards is primarily winging lately.

I am permanent intermediate and have a somewhat cynical bad-attitude about many or most of the design features for foil boards.  A bit like each year's new colours for fishing lures, designed to catch fishermen more than fish.  ;-)   Foilboards are a platform that spend most of their riding time above the water surface, much of the sophisticated bits offer such marginal benefit that a typical rider probably wouldn't notice them much. But hey, just one man's opinion eh.

I find my 6.8 works great as day-to-day go-to for winging.  It is roughly 110-120L.  On the bigger side, in both length and volume, but that makes it quite easy.  I can comfortably stand on it when wind is too light.  Easy paddler.  But not so huge that it's a pig for doing turns, riding waves, etc -- keeping in mind I also use it for in surf as a supfoil with paddle.  It would obviously be too big for doing airs or rad freestyle moves, but as I am not doing either, it fits the bill most of the typical lawn mowing type days.

I am experimenting with my 5' board too and still in learning phase, so can't give a proper opinion yet. It is SUPER fun once up and riding, so little swing weight.  BUT: short of being lit, in lighter winds it can be challenging to knee start and get up on foil. I am at the stage where once up and riding I am afraid to fall off, in case I can't get back up, which means I find I ride safe and won't take chances or push the edge ... and that edge is what makes riding fun. So anything short of perfect conditions, I find I end up defaulting back to ol' reliable. I will need to bite the bullet and put in the time to properly learn this "performance" board.

Point being: IMHO smaller sup foils are fine for winging.  Progression comes at a cost, you need to weigh what you gain against what it may take away, decide what you're after.

Finally, technical note: for sup/surf foiling, our crew has been spending quite a bit of effort to get foils perfectly level with the centre of the board, using shims to account for tail rocker.  I was surprised to see how much tail rocker the Fanatic Sky has though.  This goes along with one of the Progression Project podcasts, where the guest talked about preferring a little nose-up, to give a surfboard/snowboard feel, vs dropping into waves with the feeling the board is diving.  That's an interesting variation.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2020, 12:22:10 PM by canada foiler »

PonoBill

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Re: Wing boards vs. SUP boards
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2020, 05:24:23 PM »
Canada Foiler has some intersting points, though the bulk of his post belies the idea expressed in the second paragraph. Yes, once you're up the shape of the board matters a lot less, though a seven foot board will only be fun for the "Look at me!! I'm flying!!" stage, which is over quicker than a rabbits romance.

I mostly wing on a 6'6" X 32 Flying Dutchman, and if it wasn't so light, I'd probably be doing everything I can to go shorter. I've SUP surfed and wingfoiled long, heavy boards and they hold you back on doing anything but mowing the lawn. As soon as you start doing jibes, or running downwind, or try to tack they simply suck toads.

I also have a 6'0" X 28 SIC Manta, and it's wonderful once it's up in the air, but at 103L it's a bit of a bear to kneel on and get the wing up in chop and swells. I can do it, but it takes a lot of attention, and every time I fall I spen a few minutes screaming curses. Like Canada, when I wing on that board I spend most of my time trying not to foil, not taking chances and making progress. With my 6'6" FD, it's no big deal at all.

You can get used to almost anything, but it might not be fun for quite a long time getting there. I'm willing to sacrifice a little performance for ease of use and pure fun. But i still want to progress, and that's easier on a smaller board.

Back to the original question, at first, a combo board will be just fine. But at some point you'll want a board that's perfect for surfing and one that's perfect for foiling, And they are NOT the same board. Any board you can water start on is fine for winging. But only the pros can surf on something like that.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2020, 05:27:33 PM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

juandesooka

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Re: Wing boards vs. SUP boards
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2020, 05:35:35 PM »
Canada Foiler has some intersting points, though the bulk of his post belies the idea expressed in the second paragraph. Yes, once you're up the shape of the board matters a lot less,

Just to clarify: my bad attitude note was about gizmos, "double concave to single concave to V with deep concave chines and a step tail".  Fully agree with you about size/shape trade-offs ... and when you really boil it down, for winging it mostly comes down to volume.

Wetstuff

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Re: Wing boards vs. SUP boards
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2020, 06:27:49 AM »
" A bit like each year's new colours for fishing lures, designed to catch fishermen more than fish."   So true, CF.  If the a near-perfect universal product (foil, board, wing) came along it would be abandoned in 2-3 years.  It seems our new 'consumer instinct'. I am guilty. 

Jim
Atlantis Mistress .. Blue Planet MultiTasker ..   Atlantis Venom

 


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