Author Topic: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL  (Read 2902 times)

Rastaman3030

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Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« on: October 23, 2020, 08:49:50 PM »
Has anyone ridden both the Armstrong HS1850 and the Gong Curve XL foils (previously called the Pro)? It would be great to hear first hand experience on the differences. The sizing appears similar. The price difference is enormous, is the Armstrong really that much better to ride?

surfcowboy

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2020, 07:23:56 AM »
I also want to note the availability of carbon masts for Gong now.

soepkip

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2020, 08:15:25 AM »
I also want to note the availability of carbon masts for Gong now.

The mast you need for winging. the freesurf carbon mast is on preorder only, is that what you mean?
Available 18 November they say
One size only: 100cm....


Thatspec

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2020, 09:26:06 AM »
Yes, Iíd agree these two wings look very similar in pics. The Gong appears lower volume by a little, might have a higher stall speed but be a hair faster. The curve xl is almost undoubtedly a little heavier but will likely survive contact with hard objects better, my curves have survived admirably. Iíd plunk down the extra bucks for anything that would have better performance (Or my definition there of) than my Axis kit but it doesnít exist. Love the quality and finish of Armieís stuff but I wonít go backwards in glide perf.

If I may go off on a tangent... As to masts, sure the Gong masts are always going to be waitlisted. My 70cm is due to ship 11/3 (pre-ordered at least a month ago). I have the 100 already which is way too long for surf.

Thereís still time to cancel it and Iím wondering if I should. Is 70cm useful in the surf with the wingspans I require at my weight, minimum 94cm +/-? How about downwinding? Just concerned itís too short for any use and Iíd be better off moding an alu fuse with an Axis mast at 75-80cm. Apparently Beryl has used the 70 with 2XL Veloce and had a fine time of it but thatís on a narrow prone foil board (mines 28Ē). Would appreciate opinions.

SanoSlatchSup

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2020, 11:29:14 AM »
Is 70cm useful in the surf with the wingspans I require at my weight, minimum 94cm +/-? How about downwinding? Just concerned itís too short for any use and Iíd be better off moding an alu fuse with an Axis mast at 75-80cm. Apparently Beryl has used the 70 with 2XL Veloce and had a fine time of it but thatís on a narrow prone foil board (mines 28Ē). Would appreciate opinions.
IMO 70cm is too short in the surf. I run Axis 75cm which is fine, but really wouldn't want to go any shorter. I have an 82cm on order since that was my last, and preferable height when I had my GF setup (29.5" w/~3" adapter)...which was a huge improvement from my 24" w/adapter that's basically the 70cm you're talking about now. I personally wouldn't go less than 75cm, but that's JMHO.

Me: 6'1"/185...5'7" Kings Foil Board...6'0" Kings Foil Board...9'6" Bob Pearson "Laird Noserider"...9'6" Costa Azul Wide Body...14' Lahui Kai "Manta"...8'0" WaveStorm for when proning urges still hit, and 7'3" Chuck Glynn foil board backup.

surfcowboy

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2020, 05:16:47 PM »
SanO, is that for breaching on the turns?

Fishman

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2020, 08:00:15 PM »
Yes, Iíd agree these two wings look very similar in pics. The Gong appears lower volume by a little, might have a higher stall speed but be a hair faster. The curve xl is almost undoubtedly a little heavier but will likely survive contact with hard objects better, my curves have survived admirably. Iíd plunk down the extra bucks for anything that would have better performance (Or my definition there of) than my Axis kit but it doesnít exist. Love the quality and finish of Armieís stuff but I wonít go backwards in glide perf.

If I may go off on a tangent... As to masts, sure the Gong masts are always going to be waitlisted. My 70cm is due to ship 11/3 (pre-ordered at least a month ago). I have the 100 already which is way too long for surf.

Thereís still time to cancel it and Iím wondering if I should. Is 70cm useful in the surf with the wingspans I require at my weight, minimum 94cm +/-? How about downwinding? Just concerned itís too short for any use and Iíd be better off moding an alu fuse with an Axis mast at 75-80cm. Apparently Beryl has used the 70 with 2XL Veloce and had a fine time of it but thatís on a narrow prone foil board (mines 28Ē). Would appreciate opinions.

Not sure if I read it on the Gong forum or facebook, but there has been a couple of reports about the Gong carbon fiber mast/fuse have some issue at the wing connection point. Something was coming loose I couldn't really understand how exactly. They may have already resolved the issue, But since you mentioned you might cancel your order anyway it might be another factor to look into.  I'll see if can find a link
« Last Edit: October 24, 2020, 08:04:17 PM by Fishman »
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obxDave

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2020, 01:31:50 AM »
Has anyone ridden both the Armstrong HS1850 and the Gong Curve XL foils (previously called the Pro)? It would be great to hear first hand experience on the differences. The sizing appears similar. The price difference is enormous, is the Armstrong really that much better to ride?


Take just about any gear intensive sport and this becomes a common question.  Is that expensive gear going to suddenly improve your riding skills over less expensive gear? Nope, not at all. These forums get caught up in ďgear minutiaĒ by participants (myself included) many of whom are older with sufficient play funds and limited (and declining!) physical abilities. ďThis carbon mast is amazing,..itís a game changer!Ē ..... Sure......

I learned everything on the original Pro XL. Heavy, wobbly aluminum masts, loose foil-to-fuselage connection that I had to tighten, no half dozen options for fuselage or rear wings. I got all my transitions on that setup. Tried more expensive stuff from Moses and Axis. Did it suddenly make me a better rider?  Nope, not at all.  I just try and practice as much as possible in decent conditions and I constantly practice my current/new transitions all the time instead of riding in endless straight lines. Some days barely powered on my 6m, others overpowered on my 3.3m. Patrice was doing everything (and then some) on that same gear a year ago.

Iíve never ridden any Armstrong gear. One of our locals just purchased a full Armstrong setup of everything; foils, masts, handwings and board. Iím sure Iíll get the chance to ride it at some point. It looks like very well made gear. Iíll bet the 1850 is similar in performance to the carve XL. Neither setup will be as important as the conditions you ride in, getting dialed into what you already own, how often you ride, and how you ďtrain yourselfĒ.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2020, 01:48:59 AM by obxDave »

obxDave

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2020, 04:22:51 AM »
One other really cheap (but next to impossible for many of us older types) way to gain some instant performance improvement without a bunch of expensive techie gear;......loose weight!  My knees suck. Only way I can keep riding/playing on the water was to shed the pounds...

surfcowboy

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2020, 09:52:18 AM »
Dave, now no one wants to think about eating less or differently. lol

I fall in the middle, mostly due to what Iíve seen in the water. There are certain changes that do make a difference, at least in surfing. A direct example is that a young guy we surf with was on a Slingshot Infiniti 76 and surfing great but not connecting waves. He switched to an Axis 900 and that weekend he was getting 2 for ones. 1 day change for the money. Good investment. But that was super low aspect to high aspect, so itís not as clear.

Iím not sure about winging yet. For example Iím staying on my easy and slow XL Rise til I struggle somewhere and know itís not me. I love that I can get on foil, flail like Jim Carrey and the wing just flies straight. Iíll outgrow this but a tweakier wing will just slow my progression until then.

Yesterday a buddy hopped on my SUP and XL Rise and caught wave Iíd never have been able to catch and held the wing down like Iíd never have been able to do. Part is size but a lot more of that was skill lol. It inspired me.

One other thing, Gong just announced a Pro/Curve T model which is higher aspect than the original Curve. Itís supposed to be the lift of one size up with the speed of the smaller size. So now you have 4 styles and maybe 15 total options of wings from Gong before you even swap a tail. They and Axis seem to now have the most designs, but who knows if thatís a good thing. A lot of people ride one wing, right?

Sorry to take this away from the original topic. Contact Armstrong and get a demo or keep an eye out at your local. You may find it unlocks something youíve been missing. Or that it shows you how far you have to go still.

SanoSlatchSup

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #10 on: October 25, 2020, 10:04:02 AM »
SanO, is that for breaching on the turns?
Yes and no. Yes for not breaching in the turns, but also an all around much better height to allow you a little more forgiveness in everything thing your doing in the takeoffs, speed running down the line, getting above the whitewater while your wing is still somewhat below it in less turbulence, and more room at the top coming off the wave to allow longer and/or more pumps back out as well.
Me: 6'1"/185...5'7" Kings Foil Board...6'0" Kings Foil Board...9'6" Bob Pearson "Laird Noserider"...9'6" Costa Azul Wide Body...14' Lahui Kai "Manta"...8'0" WaveStorm for when proning urges still hit, and 7'3" Chuck Glynn foil board backup.

Rastaman3030

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #11 on: October 25, 2020, 10:12:01 AM »
One other thing, Gong just announced a Pro/Curve T model which is higher aspect than the original Curve. Itís supposed to be the lift of one size up with the speed of the smaller size. So now you have 4 styles and maybe 15 total options of wings from Gong before you even swap a tail. They and Axis seem to now have the most designs, but who knows if thatís a good thing. A lot of people ride one wing, right?

Can you point me to more information on the new Curve T foil? I donít see it on Gongís website. This sounds very interesting.

One of the primary reasons Iím considering moving away from Gong is the difficulty of getting replacement components and the ridiculous shipping charges. I was quoted over $250 USD for shipping alone on the Veloce wing, which is nearly the cost of the product. 

Fishman

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #12 on: October 25, 2020, 03:24:58 PM »
One other thing, Gong just announced a Pro/Curve T model which is higher aspect than the original Curve. Itís supposed to be the lift of one size up with the speed of the smaller size. So now you have 4 styles and maybe 15 total options of wings from Gong before you even swap a tail. They and Axis seem to now have the most designs, but who knows if thatís a good thing. A lot of people ride one wing, right?

Can you point me to more information on the new Curve T foil? I donít see it on Gongís website. This sounds very interesting.

One of the primary reasons Iím considering moving away from Gong is the difficulty of getting replacement components and the ridiculous shipping charges. I was quoted over $250 USD for shipping alone on the Veloce wing, which is nearly the cost of the product.

They say it will be on their site Monday this week.
 Shipping so high now buying one thing hardly makes any sense . I'll be ordering 3 things to ship together to ease to blow.
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surfcowboy

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #13 on: October 25, 2020, 07:58:27 PM »
I only saw it in video and wing foil group on Facebook. We need a damn French logistics person (I may take this on, actually) thereís got to be a better way to get this stuff. What part of the country you guys in? We might need a Gong Buyers Club.

surfcowboy

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Re: Armstrong HS1850 Vs Gong Curve (Pro) XL
« Reply #14 on: October 25, 2020, 08:56:31 PM »
From Gong:

Malo super rad on his new Curve T front wing.

On line next week.

I created a line based on the Curve with a higher aspect ratio, called T for Tall.

Basically the MT is between the M and the L. It has the width of the M and a span between M and L.

Under feet it keeps the speed of the lower size and the lift of the bigger size.
And thatís just amazing.

We have in stock since friday the MT, the LT and the XLT. Available 🥳🥳🥳

Combined with a Veloce stab, you have the best combo of speed, lift and turns, and it is easy to drive as a Curve.

https://youtu.be/pgXgt9XD3V0

Luckiest kid in France.

 


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