Author Topic: So where are you going with this winging thing?  (Read 1537 times)

obxDave

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So where are you going with this winging thing?
« on: October 01, 2020, 03:36:53 AM »
I hate to ask the question like some lame job interview, but what are your goals with winging?  Itís been a year since I joined the forum and started winging, and the last 2 months have been the first time period in that year Iíve gone nowhere on progression and wondered what Iím supposed to do next. One month out from the finger injury and one month of crud winds and 10 other things getting in the way. Iím one of those ridiculous type Aís that goes nuts if I just do the same thing every day, and donít try something new, even if I fail miserably at it. There has to be a challenge to get to the next goal. Doesnít have to be a sailing skill at all, just something that requires learning. Anyway here are mine for winging:

  • More selfie drone filming and better 360 cam footage. Just did one day with my Staaker drone. Want to do more. Have a Skydio 2 on order as well. My 360 cam footage is still really crude compared to what is possible
  • Way more travel to new riding spots. Turning 62 and officially retiring this month. :) Gettin a little travel trailer (like a gazillion other people) to just pack the gear and wander. If international travel ever restarts Austrialia is top on the list since both our daughters live there
  • Some new skills like sustained backwinded riding and this wing flip thing where you go from backwinded to toe-side in the same direction by just rolling the wing over your head. Pretty cool. Iíll have to come up with some others...
  • Ocean riding. I give lip service about doing it, but always chicken out. In my defense we generally have crappy overwhelming shore break conditions. Absolutely nothing like Hawaii or even FL/CA for that matter
  • Downwinders. Really havenít even tried for a decent one yet. Itís time

I know 90% of the topics here are about gear, gear, and more gear. Iím as guilty as anyone, but I get weary from it!

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2020, 04:15:58 AM »
Hey Dave,

I got a Skydio 2 last month and it is pretty incredible.  I did one session with it and it really stoked me for possibilities.  I have the beacon as well and I have it in a waterproof neoprene phone armband.  That works well.  It follows me really well when foiling.  There are a couple of kinks that they are still working on that will make it really, really good.

Problems:

It still relies a bit too much on visual tracking using the cameras instead of the GPS.  For that reason when you flip the wing (Jibe or similar) the camera stutters if the wing obscures you.  It isn't awful but it can detract from a shot.  It didn't lose me doing this, it just stuttered.  Skydio tech support (which is truly awesome) suggested more distance so I will try that. 
 
A bigger issue is that it dropped me when I fell in a botched 360.  It can't visually recognize me swimming so it begins to hunt.  It didn't find me again so it waited for the 20 seconds of searching and then began return to home.  That is the default return to home behavior and it cannot be changed in settings.  This is a big deal because it did this after 10 minutes of filming.  That is not much time after launch, paddle out, etc.   

Tech support told me that I can likely get the drone tracking me again by hitting a button on the beacon to get it to find me.  I will try that next time but at least for the moment I am going to be conservative and try to stay out of the water.  Another way to get around this would be to not set a home point and then it will just hover at the last contact point.  That is a little sketchy though, because you have a guaranteed water crash if your battery dies.   

The last little thing is that you cannot set a home point with the beacon alone, so you need to have a phone/iPad with the app open to set the home point.  I have been doing that and leaving my ipad on the beach at the launch site but it would be cool if you could use the beacon only.  That would simplify things a lot.  Skydio said they will likely add that function to the beacon. 

I am looking forward to a second test when conditions return to Westerly at a location that makes droning possible. 


winged surfer

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2020, 08:17:57 AM »
Admin please show us some footage of the Skydio2! i'm also very interested even they don't ship to Europe.

regarding my future goals i just finish to learn closing the Heelside to Toeside Tack which took me almost 2 months and was quite challenging but know i complete both Gybes and Tacks Stages.
So my next additions will be:
- 360
- 360 air
- Duck Diving jibes
- Downwinds


Phils

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2020, 05:04:38 PM »
Wave riding.  Keep chasing bigger waves. 

maiz

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2020, 08:53:04 PM »
I recently joined the Armstrong brigade and my bit is chomped to shit in anticipation of:

Goal #1: Wing foil on the Oregon coast. Iíve been at the coast with enough wind but waves were overhead and Iíd have shredded wing getting past the break.

Goal #2: Prone foil-surf with pump back out action. Iíve been at the coast with no wind and perfect 2.5í waves but it was too shallow, would have ripped the foil from board. [hands in prayer emoji] for the right combo next trip westward.

Aside - Armstrong set arrived last weekend. Took it out once this week in 35-50mph Gorge winds. Damn those winds were silly but WOW this setup! With 1550 front wing, I could pump-n-glide downwind for days. Quite a different ride than my Infinity 76.
Wing - Naish S25 Wing Surfer 4.6, Naish Hover Wing 60L :: Foil - Slingshot Infinity 76

obxDave

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2020, 11:32:07 PM »
Admin, my Skydio expectations are pretty modest for winging and kitefoiling. As long as return-to-home is reliable then Iíll be happy. Staaker for all its crudeness of no optical avoidance at all, has a really reliable waterproof beacon and generally stays with you during the falls.  Iíll have fun comparing the two.  You need to post some Skydio video! I think Iíve seen one short phone video of you riding from a 100 yds away in my year on the forum. That goes for the infamous  Mr Bill as well. Maybe another goal; witness the Gorge crew in action ::).  Havenít been there since 1985...

So I guess wave riding is a common goal. I donít come from a surfing background so itís always overly intimidating for me. I live on the bloody ocean so I best get over it! Always interested in how people are getting through their first shore-break sessions. Dwight did an Instagram post of getting smacked good trying to get out in some messy stuff. I got shivers Admin, my Skydio expectations are pretty modest for winging and kitefoiling. As long as return-to-home is reliable then Iíll be happy. Staaker for all its crudeness of no optical avoidance at all, has a really reliable waterproof beacon and generally stays with you during the falls.  Iíll have fun comparing the two.  You need to post some Skydio video! I think Iíve seen one short phone video of you riding from a 100 yds away in my year on the forum. That goes for the infamous  Mr Bill as well. Maybe another goal; witness the Gorge crew in action ::).  Havenít been there since 1985...

So I guess wave riding is a common goal. I donít come from a surfing background so itís always overly intimidating for me. I live on the bloody ocean so I best get over it! Always interested in how people are getting through their first shore-break sessions. Dwight just did an Instagram post of getting smacked good trying to get out in some messy stuff. I got shivers just watching it (great respect for his gutsy attempt).

Tried some more sustained backwinded riding yesterday. Got nowhere. Gonna be a tough nut to crack, but thatís part of the fun




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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2020, 01:28:26 AM »
Admin, my Skydio expectations are pretty modest for winging and kitefoiling. As long as return-to-home is reliable then Iíll be happy. Staaker for all its crudeness of no optical avoidance at all, has a really reliable waterproof beacon and generally stays with you during the falls.  Iíll have fun comparing the two.  You need to post some Skydio video! I think Iíve seen one short phone video of you riding from a 100 yds away in my year on the forum. That goes for the infamous  Mr Bill as well. Maybe another goal; witness the Gorge crew in action ::).  Havenít been there since 1985...

I will try to strap the beacon to Bill and Chan and film them as soon as I understand the drone a little better.  They have both gotten really good!  I think this type of drone is going to be absolutely amazing for filming other people.  The shots it gets sweeping around a subject during transitions, etc. are unbelievable looking.  Stuff that a skilled film crew and helicopter pilot would have struggled for a decade ago.   With someone who knows the drone managing the controls from shore, you could use it at any location (you need a very specific launch/land setup when self filming).  That in itself would be huge.  Also, the usable portion of the relatively short battery life would be effectively doubled (because you wouldn't need to waste half of the battery for getting to the water and paddle out) and you could change between the auto follow presets on the fly.   If you had the time, you could strap this to a bunch of skilled riders and make a really amazing Wing film.  I will try to post up a selfie video this week if we get our forecasted westerlies again.

My winging goals are pretty basic.  I am a year in to foiling and I feel comfortable foiling now in most of the conditions that we get here.  Honestly, just my basic foiling skills are still improving each month.  This last month my foot position changed a lot.  My stock position has narrowed, my front heel has swung back and my back foot has come forward a few inches (with no change to my foil kit).  This has added a lot of efficiency in lighter winds and I find myself using a full air wing size smaller.  It has also helped me in riding swell.  I am feeling small foot and body position things all of the time which no one else would even notice but I consider them progress.  I notice my speed increasing and my carving improving.

Likely it is our location but riding swell better is my main goal right now.  Winging long stretches gliding, passing hands on the leading edge handle only for jibes while following burly swell downwind.  That is my goal.  I have had an early taste of this and it is so magical and satisfying that it has my full attention. 

Other than that I am trying to keep my goals in line with a body that is trying to quit on me. 
« Last Edit: October 02, 2020, 01:47:37 AM by Admin »

obxDave

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2020, 01:52:48 AM »
Other than that I am trying to keep my goals in line with a body that is trying to quit on me.

Common theme for us older types. Just had a cataract scare and my retnaís arenít in the greatest shape either but the doc says Iím ok for now. Even unstrapped with the wing, the right knee has its session time limits. No strapped in jumping on my goal list......  Quick highlight of a recent session shaking off some of the rust from not riding much. Lots of foot switching just get ďfoil legsĒ going again. Really liking the speed/glide of the Veloce XL

https://youtu.be/rAgAF5_vpkY

Mike dubs

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #8 on: October 02, 2020, 06:09:44 AM »
Nice, I love to have some flat water like that😛 mike

Solent Foiler

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #9 on: October 02, 2020, 11:23:08 AM »
Since I decided to start winging, I've had a couple of projects in mind - an epic wind against tide downwinder and foiling some tidal standing waves. I just want to get good enough so that I can do them justice when the time finally comes - probably next summer now... I'm treating them as a prize as a reward for all the effort I'm putting in to try and get competent. Ultimately, competence leads to flow, which is something worth chasing in itself...

For the moment, I'm trying to enjoy the process of progressing, despite it's frustrations!
I'm 5'10", 65kg riding:
Gong Flint 5'6 95L
Gong Catch 5'3 34L
Gong Veloce L and XL on 100 monoblock mast
Gong Pulse - 4m, 5m
Gong Superpower 6m

clay

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2020, 12:26:34 PM »
Wave riding for sure, so stoked for some wind and wave combo!

I like to know how stuff stands the test of time, or how my ancestors evolved, or the nature of a human.  Novelty is a word I've heard that goes back thousands of years and even pre-history.  So this new wing ding thing checks my novelty box, and not knowing what waves/wind spots are wing foil-able is exciting and I'm really curious to see how winging in long period waves goes...

I have an aversion to jetskis and wakeboats, so the clean quiet propulsion of the wind ding I am loving very much.

And the community aspect I am really enjoy, winging has brought so many awesome folks into my life.  All kinds of adventures await!
Aloha, I welcome and appreciate all responses of positivity and good feeling.

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCOIE6FWr1SpWvbPJIIiEgog

supunk

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2020, 01:30:41 PM »
Other than that I am trying to keep my goals in line with a body that is trying to quit on me.

Common theme for us older types. Just had a cataract scare and my retnaís arenít in the greatest shape either but the doc says Iím ok for now. Even unstrapped with the wing, the right knee has its session time limits. No strapped in jumping on my goal list......  Quick highlight of a recent session shaking off some of the rust from not riding much. Lots of foot switching just get ďfoil legsĒ going again. Really liking the speed/glide of the Veloce XL

https://youtu.be/rAgAF5_vpkY

Looking very slick Dave. Are you goofy or regular?

surfcowboy

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2020, 09:15:09 PM »
Dave, I love this thread idea. Thanks for posting. So many foil discussions are about gear itís true.


Iím early in my progression but here goes.

Downwinding is probably top for me. We donít get amazing wind or swells but the wing should make long winter downwind runs possible. NW swell, NW wind means a long run down the SoCal coast. Iíve found a few wingers here too so we should have a fun and safe time.

Wave riding, if I can find a good launch. We have a ton of point breaks here that should be easy to get out into and they all mush up at high tide so you couldnít paddle in. Iím looking to do laps like Keahi on his recent Instagram video.

Coast exploring. We have so much inaccessible coast here. I canít wait to check more of it out. Whoís going to accompany me to The Ranch next Summer? ;) Maybe a run back from Catalina?

Finally, just enjoying the feeling of foiling. Iím not sure Iíll be able to prone foil at my age and with my lack of shortboard experience. But the wing, some foil SUP , and maybe eventually an efoil will keep me happy and healthy as I age.

I had a pelican buzz me today as I surfed and watching him ride that breeze 1 foot off the wave I immediately wanted to be on foil and ride that sweet with him.

Find a safe launch and start easing out into the ocean. There are so many rewards out there.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2020, 09:17:44 PM by surfcowboy »

Phils

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #13 on: October 03, 2020, 01:49:59 AM »
Wave riding progression:  Went to the Gorge early summer with a few weeks of winging experience and barely able to do a gybe.  Went into the river almost everyday and worked on wave/swell riding.  Started with simple hand transitions going downwind (see Topic a few pages back).  By the end of summer I was going to Swell/Hatch on 30 mph days with 2.8 wing and comfortably riding head high stuff.   The Gorge is the ideal place because you can always find waves of different sizes, there is no shore break to get through and it is easy to get back upwind.

Getting past shore break:  You can do a lot of practice in flat water as I will point out.  If you don't have much experience with any sport, go out there with nothing or just a board initially to get used to the ocean.  A wing board with a bottom handle is a must.  Make sure your leashes are in good condition and securely attached.  Do the basics by holding board via handle upwind and the wing downwind and walk in.  Watch the timing of the waves and look for gaps.  As you go for it to get enough depth for takeoff,  realize that the wind direction is critical.  If it is more side shore, you may be able to straddle or kneel out.  If it is not side shore enough, you have to prone paddle out. (I practice this every session even if I don't need to).  It also depends a lot on the bottom contour.  On some beaches the contour is often not uniform and you can get depth by traveling side shore, so know your beach.   If the wind is strong and directly onshore, pick another day or another location.  When you are deep enough, be quick about getting going.  I practice being as fast as possible in flat water sessions.  And keep in mind that the first tack may be the dreaded weak foot forward...so get quick on that side.   Of course, getting going quickly means lots of wing power, so go large.  The DW video above is a very useful reminder of this.   Things will go wrong, you will get worked so expect it.  (helmet, impact/life vest) Never let go of your board.  The wing can take care of itself downwind.  Once out, don't be tempted by the waves close to shore.   Coming back in can be very tricky.  Don't make the mistake of getting close and floating in.....you will get worked.  Foil all the way in under power.  You will curse your leashes often.  I have found that the reel leash system that Robert of Blue Planet uses is the best for staying out of the way in rough conditions.  I use it now in all conditions (again, in preparation for big wave days).
« Last Edit: October 03, 2020, 01:52:40 AM by Phils »

obxDave

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Re: So where are you going with this winging thing?
« Reply #14 on: October 03, 2020, 03:13:20 AM »


Looking very slick Dave. Are you goofy or regular?

Iím regular stance. Many years of windsurfing and twin tip kiteboarding got me very acclimated to switching stance all the time. Switch stance in kitefoiling is definitely harder to learn than winging switch stance, so learning that first made winging switch a breeze. Heck, I was doing old classic windsurfer freestyle crap when I was 23. The flatwater freestyle oriented stuff is what Iíve always gravitated to, although at 62 the balance sure isnít what it used to be.  The surf break  is where Iíve always felt completely intimidated

Wave riding progression:  Went to the Gorge early summer with a few weeks of winging experience and barely able to do a gybe.  Went into the river almost everyday and worked on wave/swell riding.  Started with simple hand transitions going downwind (see Topic a few pages back).  By the end of summer I was going to Swell/Hatch on 30 mph days with 2.8 wing and comfortably riding head high stuff.   The Gorge is the ideal place because you can always find waves of different sizes, there is no shore break to get through and it is easy to get back upwind.

Getting past shore break:  You can do a lot of practice in flat water as I will point out.  If you don't have much experience with any sport, go out there with nothing or just a board initially to get used to the ocean.  A wing board with a bottom handle is a must.  Make sure your leashes are in good condition and securely attached.  Do the basics by holding board via handle upwind and the wing downwind and walk in.  Watch the timing of the waves and look for gaps.  As you go for it to get enough depth for takeoff,  realize that the wind direction is critical.  If it is more side shore, you may be able to straddle or kneel out.  If it is not side shore enough, you have to prone paddle out. (I practice this every session even if I don't need to).  It also depends a lot on the bottom contour.  On some beaches the contour is often not uniform and you can get depth by traveling side shore, so know your beach.   If the wind is strong and directly onshore, pick another day or another location.  When you are deep enough, be quick about getting going.  I practice being as fast as possible in flat water sessions.  And keep in mind that the first tack may be the dreaded weak foot forward...so get quick on that side.   Of course, getting going quickly means lots of wing power, so go large.  The DW video above is a very useful reminder of this.   Things will go wrong, you will get worked so expect it.  (helmet, impact/life vest) Never let go of your board.  The wing can take care of itself downwind.  Once out, don't be tempted by the waves close to shore.   Coming back in can be very tricky.  Don't make the mistake of getting close and floating in.....you will get worked.  Foil all the way in under power.  You will curse your leashes often.  I have found that the reel leash system that Robert of Blue Planet uses is the best for staying out of the way in rough conditions.  I use it now in all conditions (again, in preparation for big wave days).

Philís, this is great advice. I just have to get my sh#t together and tip toe out there. I have a new real leash from Blue Planet (we used them in the early kiteboarding days). Even bought an impact vest to provide some extra flotation for the inevitable ďgetting workedĒ episodes ::).   I can check surf cams from Kitty Hawk to Hatteras any time and be at a riding spot within an hour or so. Like you say, just need to pick the right (meaning mild) conditions to venture out there without making a fool of myself, or breaking stuff.  Baby steps.........

« Last Edit: October 03, 2020, 03:16:57 AM by obxDave »

 


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