F-one Swing Boom ideas anyone?

[SUPeter]

Just did a relatively long search of the forum posts and am still wondering if anybody has been able to affix a length of carbon fiber to a F-one swing so that it is firm and rigid.  The handles on the Swing are so flimsy so I feel I will need to make some sort of frame out of foam blocks or carbon fiber.  I've only used the 6M and feel the handles are not quite right in their position.  I have an extendable carbon paddle shaft which would be perfect.  Just wondering.  Thanks in advance.

[Admin]

One good thing about the Swing is that the handles are well placed (although they could use a bit more width).  This becomes a negative if you want to attach a boom without removing the handles because now you have a carbon boom and a handle where you most want to grip...and this does not keep the boom from swaying.  That is all less than ideal.  A real solution would first involve the removal of the existing handles. 

A year later and the Swing is still the wing to beat.  F-One has to have heard the handle critique and I would be shocked if we don't see improvement there this fall.

[Wetstuff]

SP,   Listen to the Boss.  I've messed with this and it's annoying as hell having your knuckles (I am one who hates labels in shirts, so I noticed instantly..) scrape the existing handles. There are ways of making them lay a little flatter (don't know about the F-One specifically) but ...don't dare cut them off.  Sell it and get an Echo or one of the newer designs with fewer or better handles. 

Jim

[Admin]

Just saw this on FB posted as "coming soon" from Cabrinha.  I don't know that this is the perfect implementation but it looks like a step in the right direction.  Not to sound like a broken record but I think variations on this theme (wider, rigid, firmly attached handles - preferably modular) will be the answer.

[SUPeter]

Thanks all!  I was initially thinking of building a very lightweight carbon wishbone that seated on the leading edge on both sides of the inflated strut(boom).  This wishbone would meet at the connection to the carbon boom at the correct height off the inflated strut.   The original 2 forward handles would be tied out of the way to loops sewn into the cloth seam which attaches the inflated boom to the canopy .  Using a fitted foam block in the rear handle(placed when deflated.) would provide a rigid connection at one point in the rear.  If and when I ever proceed with all this craziness , Ill post some pics.  Till then, Ill probably just get used to the handles like everyone else.

PS one of my motivations for going to all this trouble in solving a problem which, for the most part, doesnt exist is that I will be doing some long, offshore downwinders off the coast of Maine.  I also have a lightweight 3 part SUP paddle.  The blade will fit nicely in a small backpack alomg with other offshore neccesities(epirb, water, .....).  The shaft will be the 2 other pieces of the paddle.  I just do not feel going that far out without a paddle, or a chaperone boat, is a good idea. 

[Dwight (DW)]

Just saw this on FB posted as "coming soon" from Cabrinha.  I don't know that this is the perfect implementation but it looks like a step in the right direction.  Not to sound like a broken record but I think variations on this theme (wider, rigid, firmly attached handles - preferably modular) will be the answer.

The twin thin center struts make me go hum....did anyone test it with a harness. With the industry rampant with strut failures, that one scares me.

[SUPeter]

Great Pics!  Those just gave me another possible idea to rattle around my head for a while.

[deja vu]

Here's a link to a discussion of wind wings and booms over at seabreeze.

One can purchase nylon gloves with open fingers at Home Depot, which will protect your hands from scraping the handles, if that's an issue.

https://www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Stand-Up-Paddle/Foiling/Booms-or-Handles-Let-s-hear-your-Pro-s-and-Cons?page=1

[PonoBill]

Just did a relatively long search of the forum posts and am still wondering if anybody has been able to affix a length of carbon fiber to a F-one swing so that it is firm and rigid.  The handles on the Swing are so flimsy so I feel I will need to make some sort of frame out of foam blocks or carbon fiber.  I've only used the 6M and feel the handles are not quite right in their position.  I have an extendable carbon paddle shaft which would be perfect.  Just wondering.  Thanks in advance.

I've been doing exactly that since I got my first F-one. I started with Duotone so I'm a boom believer, and I agree that the F-one handle locations are fine but they still suck. It's a trivial thing to make, but I got enough questions about it to make a video on how I do it.

Adding the boom even with just velcro stiffens the handles substantially without any further fiddling. Initially, I made carbon inner handles that wrapped around the inside of the handle and connected with velcro to the fake boom. Turned out to be an unnecessary complication, using two velcro straps on the front handle that attach at the front and rear of the front strap, then one strap in the front of the middle handle and one in the rear of the back handle yields a boom nearly as rigid as a Duotone.

Initially, I used a short length of SUP paddle shaft with a handle in front, but it tends to catch the wrist leash. I modified a Ke Nalu Wiki paddle blade by drilling a hole through the shaft and ferrule and installing a push pin so I'd have a canoe-length paddle if I needed it. I think that's more practical than SUP length since you'd likely want to kneel anyway. But I never bothered to take the blade with me and I'm a couple of generations past that first fake boom.

[paddlur]

Just did a relatively long search of the forum posts and am still wondering if anybody has been able to affix a length of carbon fiber to a F-one swing so that it is firm and rigid.  The handles on the Swing are so flimsy so I feel I will need to make some sort of frame out of foam blocks or carbon fiber.  I've only used the 6M and feel the handles are not quite right in their position.  I have an extendable carbon paddle shaft which would be perfect.  Just wondering.  Thanks in advance.

Check Bills thread on the “fake boom“ thread his design might help you with the F1 6m as I have the same issue rear handle for me was not far enough back for my preference albeit 3-4”,yeah I could fly it but was not comfortable for my style and weight in the stock handle locations.Not exactly what I had in mind for a 1k wing but with fake boom makes it much more doable this is my rendition of Bills fake boom simple easy peaszy,hopefully F1 upgrades the handles on the V2 6m as they are IMO in need of improvement as I have flown quite a few wings and would grade the F1 handles near the cellar and rear location needs to be more elongated like the cloud handle or a handle added on otherwise it’s a great light wing hoping the V2 addresses these issues then the F1 will be hard to beat

[Admin]

Here is a snip from this old thread:

https://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,35669.23.html

One really classy way that this could be done is to have to two strips of parallel Spectra webbing (or similar) running lengthwise on the strut with 3-4 inches between them.   They would be stitched and reinforced so that there would be very snug loops every inch or so along the full length of each strip.  The radiused base plates of the handles (or bars) would have tabs that inserted into these loops.  The tabs and loops would be the same dimension.  Insert when partially inflated and full inflation would fully secure them.  That would allow a super rigid connection and would allow any width or configuration.  It would be entirely customizable  as well as very light and inexpensive.

Here is a super rudimentary strut mock-up.  It shows two handles with 4 tabs each.  In reality the radiused plate and the tabs would match the curve of the strut. The plate width would match the spread of the two strips (no gaps).  The tabs would be rounded and the plate itself would be greatly reduced.  A bar or mini bars could be attached in the same way.  Any length bar would work so riders could really choose what they wanted.  # of handles, length of bar, bar diameter, bar shape, 90 degree handle.  No restrictions.  Riders sharing a quiver can each get their perfect in a matter of seconds.

I know that I would be happy to buy a set of long carbon handles or a small bar of this design.
 

[paddlur]

Patent it ASAP Admin! Lol great idea really that is highly likely that wings might go this direction in some form moving forward as winging wings have a real personal/customized fit for weight, height,style compared to kiting kites/wings.The boom Duotones have address this issue well too although never tried one yet let alone seen one in person around here kinda surprised

[SUPeter]

That's exactly what I had in mind, except I was going to do it with bands of carbon cloth, initially layed over saran wrap, right on the strut with the handles fitting through it- tied off to the side during use.  The paddle will then be tied to carbon risers off of this structure.  Im hoping one build will suit my 5m as well as my 6m.  I haven't compared the handle measurements yet.  The whole curved plate will be held in place by the tied down handles and a forward strap around the front of strut.

[PonoBill]

Maui Hot Sails has done a version of this design with their two-piece boom. Last winter Jeff Henderson was fiddling with stainless steel clips that hug the strut for 3/4 of the circumference and slip into sewn-on pockets that tighten when the strut is inflated. the design works fine, I haven't seen the latest version, but Jeff is using one and it looks good. I suspect making the clips out of stainless is a better idea than carbon, and the weight is likely similar. I don't think the clip needs to wrap as far as Jeff was doing--any pocket is going to tighten down well, probably just a 1/4 wrap would be good.

I'm tempted to get a new 4.2 to replace my very worn one and making a similar modification. My sewing skills are modest, but I think I could do this.

[Admin]

That's exactly what I had in mind, except I was going to do it with bands of carbon cloth, initially layed over saran wrap, right on the strut with the handles fitting through it- tied off to the side during use.  The paddle will then be tied to carbon risers off of this structure.  Im hoping one build will suit my 5m as well as my 6m.  I haven't compared the handle measurements yet.  The whole curved plate will be held in place by the tied down handles and a forward strap around the front of strut.

This sounds like a great mod and I can entirely understand not wanting to remove the handles from a (nearly) perfectly good wing.  The 100% solution, though will get rid of all of the excess.  Your method of forming each handle to the actual strut and building individual handles is wonderful and would allow the handles to be level with one another through post heights (unlike the Cabrinha above) even if the strut is not straight.  I am thinking that if the plate width and curvature were chosen well and if the strut has a straight enough design that a single handle shape could still be very good in all strut positions and on all wing sizes.  If the strut shape and the handles were rethought from scratch with this in mind then it could be a really tight connection.  I have harped on this a lot but that would also allow incredible modularity, customizability, and the packed size would become super small and light without handles.  One set of handles would cover all of your wings so even if the handles were expensive it would be cheap over a quiver.