Author Topic: What do you know about VESL ?  (Read 1432 times)

OkiWild

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #15 on: July 06, 2020, 06:01:03 PM »
my Riviera had a ďmade in ChinaĒ sticker on it

Plenty of reasons not to buy from China, but low quality isn't one of them. Not anymore, not in today's Global economy. The country that manufactures nuclear power plants, nuclear submarines, fighter aircraft (largely made up of composites), the world's leading manufacturer of turbochargers to the OEM's, your prescription meds, largest supplier of epoxy resin, and third for the carbon sheet in your SUP, and your iPhone... But somehow, for some reason, they're incapable of manufacturing a good quality SUP? LOL. Nonsense.

If there's a SUP quality problem from China, it's in the seller. I can get a SUP made in China for $150, and I can also get one made for $1,500. The quality hinges in how much I, they buyer, want to spend.

The market for the average person buying a SUP has dictated super-low prices, which is generally synonymous with low quality. That the market is flooded with them doesn't mean that there aren't excellent brands that also have the manufacturing done there. Conversely, high prices don't necessarily mean high quality, as we've seen right here on this forum.

It's interesting that there are boards not shaped and glassed "overseas," and yet no one rides them, and they get little coverage. Over on Sea Breeze I asked about Bombala boards. It's primarily a site for those down under, and Bombala boards are Aussie-made. Shaped by name-brand shapers, and competitively priced. Not one reply.   

surfcowboy

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #16 on: July 06, 2020, 08:21:14 PM »
I correct my correction.

Buy a used name brand man.

Kip

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #17 on: July 06, 2020, 09:17:25 PM »
We donít have a good market for used SUPs up here, so Ultimately Iím buying brand name, new (just got the invoice for my board).
This is just for curiosity. Iím constantly impressed by the knowledge on this forum, so wanted to put it out there!

Iíd have a hard time believing that a 14í x 24Ē VESL is any lower quality than my 14í x 25Ē Riviera, but I just donít know enough about material properties or manufacturing to know for sure. I mean, I think the phone Iím typing on is made in China, and itís pretty nice.

The VESL race board does seem like a good option for a newbie dabbling who might just thrash it. Nice price point, light weight, decent enough design.

But you all bring up some great points ! Love reading this stuff.


TallDude

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #18 on: July 06, 2020, 10:15:40 PM »

Iíd have a hard time believing that a 14í x 24Ē VESL is any lower quality than my 14í x 25Ē Riviera, but I just donít know enough about material properties or manufacturing to know for sure. I mean, I think the phone Iím typing on is made in China, and itís pretty nice.

Anyone would have a hard time knowing the difference, including the people that make them. There's no computer that sands the boards (that I've ever heard of), it's just a skilled sander. Sand them too thin, and that board is weaker than the next one they sand. What's the name on the board? Maybe it's a run of Riviera's or VESL's? Won't know until it gets painted. Point is, these places run through hundreds if not thousands of boards. They are 1# or 1.5# EPS that was CNC'd from someones file. They get a layup schedule, glass it, sand it, and paint it. The glassing schedule determines the strength and or weight. Type of composite, and how it's laid up. Some companies have the same board but with different layup options. The cheap and the more expensive. Brand and sell as you may, but most cheap boards are very similar in quality.
When you hear PVC sandwich, that's a whole other level. PVC foam (which is a thin wrap over the EPS foam) is very expensive. Like $100 to $200 dollars just for the material. Then it gets vacuum bagged, and you get a bullet proof shell. Drop it on rocks, drag it along the beach no problem. You're now talking $1,800 range for that kinda board. I don't think anyone does a race board with a PVC sandwich. Usually just Carbon to keep it light and stiff.
I still have my 12 year old Naish Nalu with a full PVC sandwich. It's been slammed on the the rocky shore in big surf, and dragged miles by my kids with stuff piled on top of it. It's never had to be repaired, ever!
« Last Edit: July 06, 2020, 10:21:08 PM by TallDude »
It's not overhead to me!
8'8" L-41 ST and a whole pile of boards I don't use.

madeinsantacruz

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #19 on: July 07, 2020, 07:38:02 AM »
FWIW - the "Cruz SUP" guys who are smearing VESL are the same donkeys who ripped off L41 shapes and even call some of their models "CIM SUPs".  Don't be fooled by the low price point or warranty claims folks.  You get what you pay for.   


surfcowboy

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2020, 08:15:07 AM »
Kip, youíre getting a shipped SUP either way. But I understand the need to try things out. (You can test this, right?)

If you canít test it, get something used shipped. Or buy the VESL and donít sweat it. But I will offer that youíre asking people on here who know a lot about SUP construction and the business and have zero reason to deceive you.

So trust them when they say that there are different grades of boards. No one is saying China boards are bad by default. Blue Planet has their boards made in China. But they pay for better construction and also visit the factory to confirm that the methods and materials are what they spec.

This is contrasted by the people who are buying a container full of whatever at whatever is a cheap price. The real manufacturers arenít just marking things up more. They are paying these factories to do more.

Above all, do what you think is best for you in your situation, in your location, at your chosen budget. Donít worry what anyone thinks. But Iím not sure Iíd try to refute what people are offering here. Your smartphone analogy only proves the point. There are $1,000 phones and $100 phones and they are far from the same.

If you are in a place without boards at all, then you likely arenít in the ocean. So youíre not going to worry about breaking a board in shore break or waves. You likely arenít competing in races (if you are, you can 100% buy a used board at a race, likely from a visiting pro.) So the advice those of us who live near the coast are giving isnít as applicable to you. If youíre near a remote coast then you understand the value of buying solid gear, as your life may be in danger if it breaks. (My friends in Alaska donít buy cheap outboards for example.)

I can confirm that the people commenting on this thread have built and repaired hundreds of boards. One is even, in my opinion, one of the better shapers in the biz. But again, what someone needs in Santa Cruz isnít what my friends back home in the landlocked South need. They all paddle inflatable boards and I cannot fault them one bit. Great boards  for the price and the use-case. But they cannot argue that they are the best quality on the market, nor do they need to be.

Youíve gotten as good of info as we can offer. Short of cutting open a VESL you likely wonít get more. I hate to see people agonize over a choice thatís not really a choice. Unless youíre going to drive or fly or ship a few boards in sight unseen, youíve probably got your answer and itís fine imho. Enjoy, paddle, and donít sweat the gear too much. Come with me to Malibu and youíll see amazing surfers on 8í Wavestorms. (Prone) but no one is arguing they are as good as a Stewart or whatever. And thatís totally fine. Horses for courses.

Hope this helps. Not sure why I cared enough to even comment lol but please take this in the helpful and friendly spirit it was written. I just hate to see folks make something so fun a hassle when choices are actually limited. Run what ya brung as Steamroller says lol. You will 100% have a blast and if it breaks we will help you learn to fix it and you can show us pics of the inside and solve the mystery!!  ;D

Good luck, post pics!

Kip

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2020, 09:55:52 AM »
SurfCowboy,

Thanks man! Thoughtful post and well written! I wasnít trying to doubt anyoneís advice and had never intended on buying a VESL (but see now thatís how it sounded!) I  just wanted to know more and have the knowledge.

I was out paddling yesterday and thought ďwhy are you spending so much time and energy falling down this research rabbit hole when you could buy a nice board and enjoy SHREDDING!Ē So, perfect advice.

We live on the ocean, but for some reason, not a huge SUP market. For instance the only boards on CL right now are my Riviera and my friends 2015 AllStar which is about to go up.

Thanks for taking the time. I really appreciate you all!

burchas

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2020, 10:48:19 AM »
I wasnít trying to doubt anyoneís advice and had never intended on buying a VESL (but see now thatís how it sounded!)

I think that's perfectly fine. That's a public forum and maybe you're not in the market for a board right away but other readers might so it's all good and helpful conversation.
You almost never know who you helped, but I got enough private messages and emails through the forum thanking me for a good advise.
in progress...

SanoSlatchSup

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2020, 11:32:05 AM »
Iíd have a hard time believing that a 14í x 24Ē VESL is any lower quality than my 14í x 25Ē Riviera, but I just donít know enough about material properties or manufacturing to know for sure. I mean, I think the phone Iím typing on is made in China, and itís pretty nice.
You're probably not that far off, but Rivi did go out of business several years back for whatever reason(s).

As other have said, "you get what you pay for"...which isn't always a bad thing. My first SUP was an overseas "pop out", and it did exactly what I wanted it to...let me know if I enjoyed the sport or not, w/o shelling out a whole lot of money on something that I might decide later wasn't for me. I still have one of their first boards from 2011 that's still in great shape, and I use for company who want to go out, and have a relatively easy board to learn on (9'6"x31"x4.5" @ 140L or so). So depending on what you plan on doing with the VESL, how often you think you'll use it, and how well you maintain it...it should last you for quite sometime, and give you lots of fun at a reasonable price.

Also, because they're relatively inexpensive, you won't get bit so bad on the backside when resale becomes a thought. Right now used boards in SoCal almost have to be given away since the supply and demand curve has fallen to the supply side so much...and selling a $1500 custom SUP for half price (if you can even get that...I know of guys getting rid of them for $400-500 just to move them), is a lot bigger hit than selling a $700-800 board for  $300-400 that you can get for them for them all day long to other "new" SUPers.
Me: 6'1"/185...6'0" Kings Foil Board...6'0" Chelu Foil Board...9'6" Bob Pearson "Laird Noserider"...9'6" Costa Azul Wide Body...14' Lahui Kai "Manta"...8'0" WaveStorm for when proning urges still hit, and 7'3" Chuck Glynn foil board backup.

sflinux

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2020, 03:39:49 PM »
Saw an interesting exchange between the company and "The Mullet"  here:
https://www.paddlemonster.com/2018/01/19/sonar-report-jan-19-2018-complicit-consumers/
That paddlemonster link reminds me of this post by Joe Blair:
https://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=3939.0

FWIW - the "Cruz SUP" guys who are smearing VESL are the same donkeys who ripped off L41 shapes and even call some of their models "CIM SUPs".
I haven't seen the a Cruz SUP in person, but I agree they look like L41 shapes.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2020, 03:50:44 PM by sflinux »
Quiver Shaped by: Joe Blair, Blane Chambers, Kirk McGinty, and Bob Pearson.
Me: 195#, 6'2"

surfcowboy

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Re: What do you know about VESL ?
« Reply #25 on: July 07, 2020, 06:45:45 PM »
Thx Kip, yeah and thanks for sensing the tone.

As was said, really nice used SUPs are practically given away here in SoCal but I know itís hard to find them elsewhere.

Someone ought to get a group together and have Creek deliver a load into the local market. That way weíd get to see him and you too. 😅

 


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