Author Topic: Funny thing with paddle length...  (Read 2980 times)

burchas

  • Custom Built
  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2095
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #15 on: May 20, 2020, 08:10:38 PM »
...I spent two weeks that I'm not going to get back collecting data...

I was about to say "oh poor baby" and then I realized I spent 2 years on that and never even collected the data ??? But judging by my dozens of paddle parts I feel somewhat confident saying I got to the same conclusion, different is better, or it could mean that I'm just hard on equipment. Otherwise, why am I looking at dozens of paddle parts :D
in progress...

Night Wing

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2584
  • Piney Woods of Southeast Texas
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #16 on: May 20, 2020, 08:16:33 PM »
I'm 5'8" (68") and 140 lbs. I've had my left and right shoulders surgically repaired. I also have a cranky lower back that "talks to me sometimes".

When I flat water paddle, I raise my paddle handle "mouth high". This saves wear and tear on my shoulders. My paddle blade is 75 square inches. For the reasons given above, my total paddle length is 72".

This works well for my 11'1" One World sup and my two 10'5" Duke sups.
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters (2 Dukes)
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters

supmmmm

  • Waikiki Status
  • *
  • Posts: 36
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #17 on: May 20, 2020, 08:27:19 PM »
For surf paddles, the smaller the board the shorter I like the paddle. In relation to my height I have; one paddle that come up to my chin, another that’s tip of nose length (gets used most often for surf) and one head height.
For my race boards the longest that I have is about 10” overhead.
And I use surf wax on all my paddles to keep the grip tension down.

singingdog

  • Malibu Status
  • **
  • Posts: 63
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #18 on: May 22, 2020, 04:36:50 AM »
What I basically determined is that different is better. Take an inch off, add an inch, either might feel better. Six months later do the opposite and it will feel better.
Yep. I come to SUP from a 6 day/week nordic skiing habit. I have several sets of skate poles, all in 1 cms increments. Sore? Switch it up. Doesn't seem to matter if it's longer or shorter, the full-body adjustment to the different length helps alleviate soreness and injury from the high repetition. I have noticed a similar thing with paddles. I have a couple of different lengths and will switch anytime I feel that I am starting to get sore or creaky (OK, more creaky).

Night Wing

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2584
  • Piney Woods of Southeast Texas
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #19 on: June 15, 2020, 11:30:20 AM »
Since I've been staying home and doing flat water paddling for two hour sessions on our largest private freshwater lake with 2, ten minute breaks to rest, I started to notice there was a few sore spots on my right hand where my fingers meet at the palm of my hand. I surmised "maybe" my paddle length was "too short". So yesterday, Sunday morning, I started to do some in depth experimentation.

Now for some background. I'm 5'8" and weigh (right now) 140 pounds. I chose for my experiment, one of my two Dukes. It's specifications are: 10'5" in length, 32" in width, 4.5" at it's thickest at 190 liters.

I chose a 4 fin quad setup (2, 5") (2, 4"). I can paddle my Duke in a straight line just by paddling on my right side without switching over to my left side. I only use my left arm and left hand when I want to turn right with a 90 degree angle.

My paddle is considered a woman's paddle since it has a small diameter shaft and I have a small skeletal frame. The paddle is a Naish Alana 75 Vario, two piece adjustable paddle with an adjustment range between 65"-84". I've been flat water paddling with this paddle at 72" in length. The 75 square inch paddle blade is very easy on my two surgically repaired left and right shoulders.

The sore spots were where my right little pinky (and the finger next to it) met at the palm of my right hand. I really don't grip the entire shaft of the paddle by wrapping my entire hand around it. I just rest the paddle shaft were my fingers on my right hand meet the palm of my right hand. The sore spots come when I bury the paddle blade and push against the water towards me when I'm going forward.

I decided to "go long" and started to increase the length of the paddle by 1" increments. To make a long story short, I found at the 77" length, the sore spots on my right hand were not feeling sore at this length. I guessed the pressure was evenly distributed on all of my right fingers so no more sore spots.

Normally for flat water paddling, I paddle for 2 hours with two, 10 minute rest breaks (one rest break per hour) with the paddle length at 72". But at the 77" length, I could paddle an extra hour with a third 10 minute break. And no more sore spots on my right hand.

So for flat water paddling from now on, instead of my previous 72" length in my first post in this topic thread, I'm going with the 77" length from now on.
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters (2 Dukes)
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters

LoudounSUP

  • Waikiki Status
  • *
  • Posts: 41
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #20 on: June 29, 2020, 04:32:11 PM »
I'm so glad I purchased an adjustable for my first paddle. Lots of trial-and-error. I'm 192 cm (75.5 inches) and have been playing with lengths between 203-210 cm (80-83 inches). funny thing - I like different lengths depending on which side I'm stroking...is this normal or should I schedule a spine alignment (lol).
SUP in Nordic Virginia
2019 SIC RS Air Glide 14x28

Quickbeam

  • Teahupoo Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 1079
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #21 on: June 29, 2020, 07:33:43 PM »
I'm so glad I purchased an adjustable for my first paddle. Lots of trial-and-error. I'm 192 cm (75.5 inches) and have been playing with lengths between 203-210 cm (80-83 inches). funny thing - I like different lengths depending on which side I'm stroking...is this normal or should I schedule a spine alignment (lol).

Absolutely agree with you re an adjustable paddle. I always advise those new to the sport to start with an adjustable. It took me a long time to get the right paddle length dialed in. For reference, I’m 5’ 8” and use a paddle length of 72 1/2”.

As for spine alignment, sorry, can’t help you with that one!
Infinity Blackfish 12’ 6” x 23”
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 24”
Infinity Whiplash 12' 6" x 24 1/2"
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 26”
Bark Competitor 12’ 6” x 29”
Red Paddle Explorer (Inflatable) 13' 2" x 30
Red Paddle Race (Inflatable) 12’ 6” x 30”

stoneaxe

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 12069
    • View Profile
    • Cape Cod Bay Challenge
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #22 on: June 29, 2020, 11:03:41 PM »
I played around all over the place, longer, shorter, real short. Came back almost full circle....shaka overhead for flatwater, 3" overhead for surf.
Bob

8-4 Vec, 9-0 SouthCounty, 9-8 Starboard, 10-4 Foote Triton, 10-6 C4, 12-6 Starboard, 14-0 Vec (babysitting the 18-0 Speedboard) Ke Nalu Molokai, Ke Nalu Maliko, Ke Nalu Wiki Ke Nalu Konihi

LoudounSUP

  • Waikiki Status
  • *
  • Posts: 41
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #23 on: June 30, 2020, 06:30:03 AM »
I'm so new that I'm not sure if the shoulder fatigue is due to poor conditioning or paddle length? I dropped down one inch and it felt much better. I'm only 4.5 inches longer than my height - is that unusual?
SUP in Nordic Virginia
2019 SIC RS Air Glide 14x28

Quickbeam

  • Teahupoo Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 1079
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2020, 08:18:24 AM »
I'm so new that I'm not sure if the shoulder fatigue is due to poor conditioning or paddle length? I dropped down one inch and it felt much better. I'm only 4.5 inches longer than my height - is that unusual?

Shoulder fatigue can absolutely be caused by paddle length. My paddle length is also 4 1/2” over my height. I don’t know how “normal” this is, but it’s what works for me. And yes, shoulder fatigue was one of the things that went into finding the right length. My shoulder still gets sore at times, but not near as much as it did with a longer shaft. I tried to find a balance between the paddle length that gave me the best stroke and didn’t hurt my shoulders. After a very long time of trial and error, I came up with 4 1/2” above my height.
Infinity Blackfish 12’ 6” x 23”
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 24”
Infinity Whiplash 12' 6" x 24 1/2"
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 26”
Bark Competitor 12’ 6” x 29”
Red Paddle Explorer (Inflatable) 13' 2" x 30
Red Paddle Race (Inflatable) 12’ 6” x 30”

Luc Benac

  • Teahupoo Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 1818
  • Super Natural British Columbia
    • View Profile
    • When not paddling...
    • Email
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2020, 11:43:22 AM »
I would say that having two exemplary of your favorite paddle with one inch difference and switch from time to time seems like a good idea now.
(or swapping hot glued shafts of course).
When you have several favorite paddles, it is a little bit more challenging :-)
Naish Maliko 14' x 26" 273L
Sunova Allround 14'x27" 319L
Naish Nalu 11'4" x 30" 180L
 *Salish 460 & 500, Andaman 500, Viento 520

sflinux

  • Malibu Status
  • **
  • Posts: 60
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #26 on: July 01, 2020, 02:00:27 PM »
I hate the idea of height+X" as a formula.   You're talking about plus or minus an inch or two, and I would say the formula shouldn't be viewed as accurate enough to resolve that kind of difference. 

Shouldn't we take into account deck height above waterline?  The difference you are seeing versus other people could be entirely due to this.  On my foil board with a scooped deck, my feet are nominally under waterline.  On my bigger surfing board I'm probably 1.5 inches above water.  I use the same paddle for both, but I can tell the difference
Good point.  In windy and choppy conditions I find I like a lower center of gravity.  I wonder if an ideal equation would have the guild factor built into it.
Erik Antonson polled surfers and noticed that paddles fell in the chin, nose, & eyebrow realm with some +/-.  He noticed a trend that taller riders seemed to be on the shorter paddle length of the bell curve, and shorter riders on the longer paddle length end of the bell curve.  I presume it has to do with a taller person have longer reach, so can use a shorter paddle and vice versa.
That being said I am 6'2" and my paddle is still a couple inches taller than me.  I have been cutting it down about 2" every 6 months.  My shoulder loves the shorter paddle length.  I noticed a shorter paddle is more stable in the surf.  A shorter paddle will give you a higher cadence, which is good for acceleration.  I thought I was going to cut again, but just tried that paddle with my 12' board  (guild factor 1.80) and the paddle length felt pretty good.  I will keep this paddle length for now, and go shorter for my next paddle for my lower volume boards (guild factor 1.2+).  Colin Mcphillips says he liked to go shorter with every new paddle (-0.5") during his progression.
My first paddles had no handles.  When I am contemplating going shorter, I try not using the handle to get an idea if that paddle length is comfortable.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2020, 02:16:22 PM by sflinux »
Quiver Shaped by: Joe Blair, Blane Chambers, Kirk McGinty, and Bob Pearson.
Me: 195#, 6'2"

LoudounSUP

  • Waikiki Status
  • *
  • Posts: 41
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #27 on: July 03, 2020, 03:36:24 PM »
Today I went even shorter - down to 79 inches (just a tad over 200cm). BTW, I started at 84 inches. My shoulders are thankful but now I worry that I'm not getting much positive blade angle at the catch. Still tons of tinkering to do!
SUP in Nordic Virginia
2019 SIC RS Air Glide 14x28

supthecreek

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 6845
  • Walk directly at what you want
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #28 on: July 04, 2020, 04:57:30 AM »
I am surprised.... I don't think it's been mentioned here:

Ke Nalu "Extended Ergo T handle"
It's 10" long , so it will allow for a vast range of paddle length options with a single paddle.

I used one to determine what height I liked best.
Simply cut the shaft to a length that will suit a reasonable height  (you can always cut shorter)
Using hot glue, insert the handle to a length you want to try, let it set and off you go.......

want to go shorter?
Carefully heat the shaft with a heat gun, and reset the length.

Once you find a happy place, be happy till you want to adjust again... then reheat and change length.

The longer hosel on the Extended Ergo T weighs next to nothing... I can't even tell which paddle it is in anymore.

My length?
2" OH for every board, Surf or flat-water because I flatwater on low railed surf style SUPs like the Search or Point Break

My shoulders never bother me because I paddle for enjoyment, not speed. 10 years later and still love exploring the estuaries and marshes.
Many of my "speed obsessed" friends gave up paddling when they stopped getting faster.... just a thought  ;)

Don't misunderstand, I love the race crew and attend many races to mix with them and soak up the positive energy....
But I like to offer the option to new  paddlers..... plenty to love about enjoying the glide, at pace less harmful to body parts.

email
supthecreek@gmail.com

My YouTube channel:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHRI23a8H21jASPdVCQUpog/videos

LoudounSUP

  • Waikiki Status
  • *
  • Posts: 41
    • View Profile
Re: Funny thing with paddle length...
« Reply #29 on: July 04, 2020, 08:23:51 AM »

My shoulders never bother me because I paddle for enjoyment, not speed. 10 years later and still love exploring the estuaries and marshes.
Many of my "speed obsessed" friends gave up paddling when they stopped getting faster.... just a thought  ;)

Don't misunderstand, I love the race crew and attend many races to mix with them and soak up the positive energy....
But I like to offer the option to new  paddlers..... plenty to love about enjoying the glide, at pace less harmful to body parts.

Many thanks supthecreek! I think you have a good outlook that many can benefit from (including me!). Right now I'm enjoying being back on the water again after an 18-year hiatus. I enjoy moving the boat (err board) - the entire process - but most especially the quiet times alone gliding along a flat lake.

As for handle types, I'm trying to find the best match between T-Curved, T-Curved Ergo and Oval. I'm thinking perhaps the oval will be good for my small(ish) hands?
SUP in Nordic Virginia
2019 SIC RS Air Glide 14x28

 


SimplePortal 2.3.7 © 2008-2020, SimplePortal