Author Topic: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer  (Read 7992 times)

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2020, 09:26:01 AM »
Nice video, although with one error. The canopies are not nylon. They are polyester, just as the leading edge is polyester. Nobody uses nylon, except cheap land kites.

We all know from windsurfing that PVC windows add weight. No getting around it.

But we also know, absolutely nobody sells a windsurf sail without a window.

They are coming like it or not, and someday you may not be able to buy one without it.

Iím going for windows this season. Any glimpse I get from one, is better than being blind all the time. Especially bad when riding in the harness. Also the next big trend.

I can't imagine wanting a 5 that weighs more than a 6, but I am happy to see brands adding in options to please everyone.  Most importantly, there is a lot more gear out there now.  I am also looking forward to smaller wings for women and kids actually arriving.

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2020, 10:32:10 AM »
For me the harness line is a must have item. I use it all the time when going upwind, so at least 50% of my session I am in it. I suppose if I had to I could get by without it, but my upwind angle would probably be about 20% less and I would probably tire out sooner.

The window would be nice for jibing. As Gong states on their website, their window is for jibing, it is not needed as much when just cruising along. For me the jibe when heading towards shore is a bit dicey when blind. Towards shore I have to worry about swimmers and getting too close to the shore break. Having a window during those jibes would give me more confidence. Now I do a quick look to make sure everything is clear, and then do the blind air jibe. The jibe heading away from land is not an issue doing it blind. No swimmers, no land, no one around. On that jibe I am looking at the swells to time my jibe right to catch a swell and not catch the back of one.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer.....My Review
« Reply #17 on: March 03, 2020, 03:42:08 PM »
For those that donít know my history, I ride a full quiver of Fone Swings, the gold standard in my opinion, after previously owning Ozone, Gong, and Duotone wings.

My buddy and I tested the new S25 Naish Wing-Surfer in the 4.6m size during the reps demo tour. The iwindsurf sensor was showing 7-23 mph. Our worst, most gusty wind direction, straight off shore to the ocean. The river is our only place to ride in that direction. A bit like inland lake sailing. Violent gusts, then near calm.

First runs, the wind felt steady. This wind direction doesnít ďeverĒ feel steady. Very impressed with that.

Then I began to put a few performance clues together. I felt fast, like really fast. Then each time I jibed and sailed away toe side, I had to pump and milk it, to stay on foil and get up to speed again. Like what the heck, there was no wind coming out of jibes. It was like this most of the day. I eventually figured out what was going on. This wing is making tons of apparent wind. That is why I feel no wind after the jibe. There was no wind! The wing was making it ďfeelĒ way winder than it actually was, from apparent wind speed generation. For those without a sailing background, making apparent wind is a good thing. All while no backwinding of the forward section on the canopy. At least no backwinding at the level seen on my Fone. The Naish felt stable and very comfortable rocketing upwind. For sure, the upwind angles are higher and faster than my Fone.

I was ripping so fast, I was weighting more than normal on the boards nose. To the point, I actually pearled the nose at full tilt boogie into the back of some chop.

My buddy Mark (also an Fone owner) came back with the same conclusions after riding the Naish. So darn fast and stable.

Later in the day, I put a windsurf harness line on the wing. Stock windsurf lines worked perfect.

The handling in the jibe was slightly different, caused by the different aspect ratio compared to my Fone wing. No issue, just a few jibes to let the instincts adjust.

The Naish takes high pressure in the leading edge better than my Fone. It doesnít bulge between the circumferential seams like it might pop, when you pump it rock hard. I like that. It gives me confidence to ride it rock hard. Adding to that confidence is Naish using high tensile thread, instead of the lower strength industry standard polyester thread. Naish switched their kites to this new thread about a year ago, allowing their kites to use higher pressures than industry standard. If I remember correctly, they tested kites to some insane pressure, like 60 psi, before the kites exploded. We all want higher pressure, it really does make wings perform better.

The handle comfort and quality, is my favorite of all the wings I have owned. They got the stuffing inside the tubular webbing just right. They feel solid and comfortable.

Naish uses the same inflation valve as my Fone, but they have figured out an improvement on the design. The Velcro cover over the valve has vent holes in it. This allows you to stick the plastic cap and Velcro cover back in place (to protect the canopy and valve cap from damage) then roll it up and air is free to escape. The one pump tube is super sized for quicker deflation and it is routed so it doesnít get kinked all the time like my Fone. Simple changes that make a huge deal in user experience. I love that!

Regarding weight, I didnít feel any difference riding it. Same with my buddy Mark. We know it has to be heavier just looking at it, but it sure doesnít feel like it in-use.

The extra handles actually came in handy and I like it. You can ride narrow arm positions like my Fone, or wider like the Ozone. If youíre boosting airs, youíll like the wider hand option. You can even tweak your positions asymmetric (to center of pressure) between toe side riding and heel side riding. It is also possible to over-sheet and drive harder and faster into the wind with the extra handles.

The window saved me already. I was off foil, putt-putting along, waiting on a gust. The gust came, but a channel marker was down wind of me. I could see it through the window.  Being able to see it clearly, I was able to pump onto foil and miss it by 15 feet. Without that window, I would have been forced to pass on the gust, and wait until I had slowly drifted past it. Iíve had issues riding around other windsurfers and kiters who donít understand wingers are riding blind without windows, so they pass way too close for comfort. Regulars to our wing spot know better, but outsiders/tourists donít understand the issue. Issue solved! Being in Florida, Iím surrounded by jet skis and boats. They canít hear me running silent on foil, and I canít see them without windows. Not good! The situation is way worse once you advance to harness use, and extract the wings full potential. This puts the wing into full windsurf mode, locked and loaded to the max, completely blocking your vision without a window.

When viewed from the leading edge looking over the top of the canopy, the Naish appears deeper in draft compared to my Fone. Measured (by eye) bottom of leading edge tube to top of canopy. The max depth is forward on the Naish and back on my Fone. Draft forward, typically translates to better stability in the upper range. Funny thing though, you might think the Fone would be deeper in draft looking at the membrane between the canopy and strut, but it is not, when viewed from the front. Leading edge diameter is similar to Fone.

So Iím sold on them. A 2nd gen product that exceeded my expectations. I ordered every size. My Foneís are going in the classified section. I ride whatever I think is best. Iím old, time is passing too fast. I plan to die with the best toys.

My current ranking on wings I have owned.

Naish S25 (2nd gen)
Fone Swing (1st gen)
Ozone WASP (1st gen)
Gong (1st gen)
Duotone (1st gen)

P.S. my 5.3m wing showed up today. It came with a pump and full replacement inflation valve parts. The valve parts are appreciated. Sand does muck up kite valves sometimes and this valve looks fancy (expensive) compared to the older kite valves.

Quickbeam

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer.....My Review
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2020, 06:41:49 PM »
For those that donít know my history, I ride a full quiver of Fone Swings, the gold standard in my opinion, after previously owning Ozone, Gong, and Duotone wings.

My buddy and I tested the new S25 Naish Wing-Surfer in the 4.6m size during the reps demo tour. The iwindsurf sensor was showing 7-23 mph. Our worst, most gusty wind direction, straight off shore to the ocean. The river is our only place to ride in that direction. A bit like inland lake sailing. Violent gusts, then near calm.

First runs, the wind felt steady. This wind direction doesnít ďeverĒ feel steady. Very impressed with that.

Then I began to put a few performance clues together. I felt fast, like really fast. Then each time I jibed and sailed away toe side, I had to pump and milk it, to stay on foil and get up to speed again. Like what the heck, there was no wind coming out of jibes. It was like this most of the day. I eventually figured out what was going on. This wing is making tons of apparent wind. That is why I feel no wind after the jibe. There was no wind! The wing was making it ďfeelĒ way winder than it actually was, from apparent wind speed generation. For those without a sailing background, making apparent wind is a good thing. All while no backwinding of the forward section on the canopy. At least no backwinding at the level seen on my Fone. The Naish felt stable and very comfortable rocketing upwind. For sure, the upwind angles are higher and faster than my Fone.

I was ripping so fast, I was weighting more than normal on the boards nose. To the point, I actually pearled the nose at full tilt boogie into the back of some chop.

My buddy Mark (also an Fone owner) came back with the same conclusions after riding the Naish. So darn fast and stable.

Later in the day, I put a windsurf harness line on the wing. Stock windsurf lines worked perfect.

The handling in the jibe was slightly different, caused by the different aspect ratio compared to my Fone wing. No issue, just a few jibes to let the instincts adjust.

The Naish takes high pressure in the leading edge better than my Fone. It doesnít bulge between the circumferential seams like it might pop, when you pump it rock hard. I like that. It gives me confidence to ride it rock hard. Adding to that confidence is Naish using high tensile thread, instead of the lower strength industry standard polyester thread. Naish switched their kites to this new thread about a year ago, allowing their kites to use higher pressures than industry standard. If I remember correctly, they tested kites to some insane pressure, like 60 psi, before the kites exploded. We all want higher pressure, it really does make wings perform better.

The handle comfort and quality, is my favorite of all the wings I have owned. They got the stuffing inside the tubular webbing just right. They feel solid and comfortable.

Naish uses the same inflation valve as my Fone, but they have figured out an improvement on the design. The Velcro cover over the valve has vent holes in it. This allows you to stick the plastic cap and Velcro cover back in place (to protect the canopy and valve cap from damage) then roll it up and air is free to escape. The one pump tube is super sized for quicker deflation and it is routed so it doesnít get kinked all the time like my Fone. Simple changes that make a huge deal in user experience. I love that!

Regarding weight, I didnít feel any difference riding it. Same with my buddy Mark. We know it has to be heavier just looking at it, but it sure doesnít feel like it in-use.

The extra handles actually came in handy and I like it. You can ride narrow arm positions like my Fone, or wider like the Ozone. If youíre boosting airs, youíll like the wider hand option. You can even tweak your positions asymmetric (to center of pressure) between toe side riding and heel side riding. It is also possible to over-sheet and drive harder and faster into the wind with the extra handles.

The window saved me already. I was off foil, putt-putting along, waiting on a gust. The gust came, but a channel marker was down wind of me. I could see it through the window.  Being able to see it clearly, I was able to pump onto foil and miss it by 15 feet. Without that window, I would have been forced to pass on the gust, and wait until I had slowly drifted past it. Iíve had issues riding around other windsurfers and kiters who donít understand wingers are riding blind without windows, so they pass way too close for comfort. Regulars to our wing spot know better, but outsiders/tourists donít understand the issue. Issue solved! Being in Florida, Iím surrounded by jet skis and boats. They canít hear me running silent on foil, and I canít see them without windows. Not good! The situation is way worse once you advance to harness use, and extract the wings full potential. This puts the wing into full windsurf mode, locked and loaded to the max, completely blocking your vision without a window.

When viewed from the leading edge looking over the top of the canopy, the Naish appears deeper in draft compared to my Fone. Measured (by eye) bottom of leading edge tube to top of canopy. The max depth is forward on the Naish and back on my Fone. Draft forward, typically translates to better stability in the upper range. Funny thing though, you might think the Fone would be deeper in draft looking at the membrane between the canopy and strut, but it is not, when viewed from the front. Leading edge diameter is similar to Fone.

So Iím sold on them. A 2nd gen product that exceeded my expectations. I ordered every size. My Foneís are going in the classified section. I ride whatever I think is best. Iím old, time is passing too fast. I plan to die with the best toys.

My current ranking on wings I have owned.

Naish S25 (2nd gen)
Fone Swing (1st gen)
Ozone WASP (1st gen)
Gong (1st gen)
Duotone (1st gen)

P.S. my 5.3m wing showed up today. It came with a pump and full replacement inflation valve parts. The valve parts are appreciated. Sand does muck up kite valves sometimes and this valve looks fancy (expensive) compared to the older kite valves.


Crap Dwight. Now Iím really confused. Hope you donít mind, but I sent you a PM.
ONE SUP Edge Pro 12' 6" x 22"
ONE SUP Evo 12í 6Ē x 24Ē
Infinity Whiplash 12' 6" x 24 1/2"
ONE SUP Evo 12í 6Ē x 26Ē
Bark Competitor 12í 6Ē x 29Ē
Red Paddle Explorer (Inflatable) 13' 2" x 30
Red Paddle Race (Inflatable) 12í 6Ē x 30Ē

ZRE Power Surge ZX4, Kevlar braided shaft (75Ē)

peterp

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #19 on: March 03, 2020, 08:57:04 PM »
Thanks for review Dwight - how does the Naish flag-out? IMO the F-One is the to date champ at flagging out which makes it no.1 choice for waves and downwind.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2020, 03:03:09 AM »
Thanks for review Dwight - how does the Naish flag-out? IMO the F-One is the to date champ at flagging out which makes it no.1 choice for waves and downwind.

Only ridden it in the river so far. Holding the nose handle on the beach, it behaves. We do think the nose handle being under the leading edge will make it easier to recover from the surfing holding the nose position.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2020, 03:05:55 AM by Dwight (DW) »

Beasho

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer.....My Review
« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2020, 06:22:10 AM »
I ride whatever I think is best. Iím old, time is passing too fast. I plan to die with the best toys.

These are strong words.  I remember you PM'd me and said "F'One is the best."  I've been dragging my feet on the wing-ding.

However I did employ your advice and bought the GoFoil GL140.  GREAT BUY!  Next the GoPro Max.  Life is short.  Fortunately I am NOT a car guy and only big into electric bikes because they get me to the surf. 

Solent Foiler

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #22 on: March 04, 2020, 07:25:24 AM »
Good stuff, and glad the bar is being pushed higher.

The Naish website isn't the best and a bit thin on detail.

Dwight - Would you care to speculate on wind ranges for the sizes? Given 4m was 'where it's at' for gen 1 wings, the lack of a 4m in their range is a bit contrary. Is the 3.6 the new 4?
I'm 5'10", 65kg riding:
Naish Hover Crossover 120
Gong Catch 5'3"
on Naish foils (1250 & 1650).
Gong Plus wings - 4m, 5m

Dwight (DW)

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #23 on: March 04, 2020, 07:25:45 AM »
Yes Beasho, fun times.  Stoked to feel the gains of a 2nd gen product.

You do need to join the winging bandwagon. Great fun. Whatever you can get your hands on, except the few duds from the 1st gen batch.


Dwight (DW)

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #24 on: March 04, 2020, 07:28:34 AM »
Good stuff, and glad the bar is being pushed higher.

The Naish website isn't the best and a bit thin on detail.

Dwight - Would you care to speculate on wind ranges for the sizes? Given 4m was 'where it's at' for gen 1 wings, the lack of a 4m in their range is a bit contrary. Is the 3.6 the new 4?

Too early to judge range. The Australian importer posted a range over on their forum. https://www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Stand-Up-Paddle/Foiling/Wind-Range-Naish?page=1#7

Rastaman3030

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #25 on: March 04, 2020, 08:31:24 AM »
Thanks for the write-up on your experience Dwight. I bought my 6M F-One based on yours, Adminís, and a few others experiences, so I trust your feedback. Two questions for youÖdo you anticipate that the Naish will have equivalent power in light wind (size for size) as the F-One? And when you have a chance, can you weigh your 5.3M?

I find that with my 6M F-One I can ride for much longer and not get nearly as tired as I do when Iím riding my 5M GongÖIím not sure if that comes down to the weight of the wing or its design, but either way itís very noticeable. Has anyone else experienced this when riding wings from different manufacturers?

The feedback that I saw on the V1 Naish wing-surfer was that it was one of the worst of the 1st generation wing designs, to see them make this big of an improvement is very surprising.

supkailua

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #26 on: March 04, 2020, 09:48:43 AM »
Rastaman3030, I noticed a lot more strain on the back arm and lat with the Slingwing vs. the Swing.

The Swing seems to be well balanced and as there is only one place to put your hands they are always in the right spot.

Between this and the use of the harness for all up wind riding, I normally get a good 2 hour session in, sometimes longer. I do keep a water pack on my back and I am exhausted afterwords, but the sessions are great.

Keys Sup

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #27 on: March 04, 2020, 02:21:26 PM »
Will there be a comparinson to the new Duotone anytime soon? Trying to upgrade for 2020.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #28 on: March 04, 2020, 04:53:08 PM »

Green Water Sports

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Re: New Naish S25 Wing-Surfer
« Reply #29 on: March 05, 2020, 06:40:07 AM »
We don't have the S25 listed at the moment but shoot me a PM if you want one. Naish have almost every size in stock and ready to go. Also reach me over here http://greenwatersports.com/contact or 1-888-252-4983
Julian
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Red Paddle Co, Starboard, Naish, Fanatic, K-Pump, Accent Paddles, Ke Nalu, Dakine, Onyx, FCS, Vamo

 


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