Author Topic: Quad Issues on new board  (Read 3265 times)

StarboardSUPMan

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Quad Issues on new board
« on: January 24, 2020, 05:25:00 PM »
I just got a new board with a 5 fin setup.  It's a 95 Liter Brusurf 8'0".  Smallest board yet for me I'm 180lbs 6'2". 
I have been surfing a thruster setup for the past year and started that way with this board, but decided to try quad today. 
For Quad fins I left in my 4.5" high standard G5 fins in front and put in smaller 3.5" trailing fins. 
The grip felt good no sliding, bottom turns were good.  I had to focus on keeping my rear foot over the tail pad.  However once in a while I would get going too fast and I would feel like the board would lock up and I couldn't turn it.  I'd miss the section where I wanted to turn and have to wait for the board to slow down to become unlocked.  It was a strange feeling but during those moments I felt like I could only hang on and wait it out.  Anyone else experience that or know what to do?  My only thought to solve it was I need my foot back further to control it.  Could it also be I have all 4 fins in the water at the same time where normally I only have 2 fins engaged on a turn? 

Here's a poor quality video of me on a SurfLine cam so you can see I can turn the board with quads just fine most of the time.

https://youtu.be/5xYJlqu0WbI
« Last Edit: January 24, 2020, 05:29:53 PM by StarboardSUPMan »

TallDude

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2020, 10:42:59 PM »
You will get more speed and less drive. I do have speed issues with my quads and trying to figure out how to control it. Generally I like the speed and the skatey feel, but there are times I miss the drive. Put your thruster setup back on and see how different it feels. On my performer long board I hated the thruster set up, but really it with quads. On my old 9' short board I liked the thruster setup, but the quads a little more. My 8'8 L41 is a quad only setup and I love this board.
The rake and foil on the thrusters makes a difference. The trailer fins are typically foiled two sides and the front fins foiled on the outside and flat on the inside. My Rusty quads are 4.5 and 3.5 feel really loose, but the tail of the board is narrow. My L-41 is 4.5 and 4.5 fast but a little tighter. It has a wide tail which adds to the speed and is taking more effort to carve backside.
http://www.surfscience.com/topics/surfboard-fins/setups/quads-offer-speed-and-more
It's not overhead to me!
8'8" L-41 ST and a whole pile of boards I rarely use.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2020, 04:25:59 AM »

Night Wing

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2020, 05:41:30 AM »
Since the upper Texas coast where I sup surf has basically small waves, all three of my sup boards are setup as 4 fin quad setups. Why? Because with small waves, I need the speed since my sups are between 30"-32" in width and they have large volumes with regards to my small 144 pound weight.

When I was researching fin setups, I came across a Blue Planet video which discusses all fin setups from single fin, twin fins, thruster (all three fins the same length), 2 + 1, 4 fin (quad) and 5 fin which I call 4 + 1 (quad with a small nubster).

The video of it is below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaaOWMPAmG0
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters (2 Dukes)
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters

TallDude

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2020, 10:54:09 AM »
It's not overhead to me!
8'8" L-41 ST and a whole pile of boards I rarely use.

TallDude

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2020, 11:07:07 AM »
Since the upper Texas coast where I sup surf has basically small waves, all three of my sup boards are setup as 4 fin quad setups. Why? Because with small waves, I need the speed since my sups are between 30"-32" in width and they have large volumes with regards to my small 144 pound weight.

When I was researching fin setups, I came across a Blue Planet video which discusses all fin setups from single fin, twin fins, thruster (all three fins the same length), 2 + 1, 4 fin (quad) and 5 fin which I call 4 + 1 (quad with a small nubster).

The video of it is below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaaOWMPAmG0
Here's another older but good one from Robert that talks a little about the foils of the fins.
https://youtu.be/CYcOk-mYSj0
It's not overhead to me!
8'8" L-41 ST and a whole pile of boards I rarely use.

TallDude

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2020, 11:12:02 AM »
Another good explanation of performance fins. I'm learning something today :D

https://youtu.be/ZnrEnMVhOk0
It's not overhead to me!
8'8" L-41 ST and a whole pile of boards I rarely use.

SanoSlatchSup

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2020, 01:38:45 PM »
Another good explanation of performance fins. I'm learning something today :D

https://youtu.be/ZnrEnMVhOk0
So you're saying I'm doing it wrong? 

No wonder the dang thing won't turn. :o :D
Me: 6'1"/185...6'0" Kings Foil Board...6'0" Chelu Foil Board...9'6" Bob Pearson "Laird Noserider"...9'6" Costa Azul Wide Body...14' Lahui Kai "Manta"...8'0" WaveStorm for when proning urges still hit, and 7'3" Chuck Glynn foil board backup.

StarboardSUPMan

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2020, 03:04:29 PM »
Lol Iím not that bad with my fins.  6 fins should stiffen that board right up.  I had another session today and had fewer issues.  The waves were cleaner and allowed me to experiment more.  I didnít have any lockup issues that could have been due to the peaky/ choppy waves yesterday. I did get worked over when I went up to the lip and the wave pitched over on me.  Went sideways and got thrown but that is probably more learning, keep my foot back and commit to the turn.  Each day with quad Iím more won over.  Speed and looseness are big benefits.  Thruster will always hold a place in my heart but I think I can maneuver and outrun fast sections better with quads.  Thanks for all the video help really helps understand the fin differences

Night Wing

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2020, 03:18:32 PM »
As I said before, I normally use a 4 fin quad setup. Basically two, 5" fins and two, 4" fins. But, if I need a 5 fin setup, my nubster fin is 2.25" in height and this is because of my light weight.
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters (2 Dukes)
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters

Night Wing

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2020, 03:36:05 PM »
I had to go back and find the topic where I can show my 5 fin setup with my 2.25" nubster fin installed on my One World, 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 liters board.

I just hope this picture takes as an attachment since I can't preview it.
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters (2 Dukes)
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters

SanoSlatchSup

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2020, 03:38:20 PM »
Each day with quad Iím more won over.  Speed and looseness are big benefits.  Thruster will always hold a place in my heart but I think I can maneuver and outrun fast sections better with quads.  Thanks for all the video help really helps understand the fin differences
Yes, and in all seriousness this time :)...when I was still surfing/SUSing, I did eventually gravitate to quads with a tiny nubster since I too was on a shorter, but wide tailed mini-Simmons shaped board as my go to...in the typically mushy conditions of SanO, where trying to squeeze any bit of speed possible was the goal the majority of the time.

Eventually went back to a Pearson/Laird long board where speed was not as much of the essence, and the 2+1 setup I liked better for that board to help keep me going somewhat straighter when trying to get out on the nose (something that I was never really all that good unfortunately :-\)
Me: 6'1"/185...6'0" Kings Foil Board...6'0" Chelu Foil Board...9'6" Bob Pearson "Laird Noserider"...9'6" Costa Azul Wide Body...14' Lahui Kai "Manta"...8'0" WaveStorm for when proning urges still hit, and 7'3" Chuck Glynn foil board backup.

StarboardSUPMan

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2020, 04:41:58 PM »
Update.

I had my board out today in chest high waves and gave the quads another go.  I could turn a bit better and continue to get better each day I have them in.  As the tide dropped I went in for lunch and decided to switch back to thruster for another session. 

This was the first day I was able to try quad and thruster setups back to back, same swell same wave.  The first wave on the thruster and I knew I wasn't getting the performance I was looking for on the quads.  The thrusters had that immediate snap to turn the board.  On the first wave I turned so hard I dumped myself off the board.  My turns were instantly sharper, I was able to really hit the lip and turn back down where as the quads I felt like I got hung up on top of the wave for a moment.  I was throwing more spray and I didn't realize how much I enjoyed pumping the board down the line.  It was like I turned the performance button on in the board.

My board does have a fairly narrow tail.  17.5" wide 12" up from the tail.  Also would be interested in quad fin box placement.  My measurements put my side fix boxes at 17" off the tail and 1.5" in from the rail.  My rear fin boxes are 7" off the tail and 1.5" off the rail.  Finally my center fin box is 7" off the tail.  Here are a few pics of the setup.  Been doing a little glassing had to reinforce the fin boxes.






I took the last pic to show the size of the rear quads I was using.  I never ran it with 5 fins in it.

I welcome some more quad fin suggestions as well as the possibility of a nubster.  I have a few nubsters kicking around I may try out.  It has been a fun experiment playing with different fins.  One I'd like to continue and keep learning from!  Appreciate all the feedback!
« Last Edit: January 26, 2020, 04:58:13 PM by StarboardSUPMan »

Night Wing

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2020, 04:59:25 PM »
I welcome some more quad fin suggestions as well as the possibility of a nubster.  I have a few nubsters kicking around I may try out.  It has been a fun experiment playing with different fins.  One I'd like to continue and keep learning from!  Appreciate all the feedback!

If you play around with a nubster fin, they come in different heights. And where you place the nubster in the long single box for a 5 fin setup makes a big difference in how the board performs in conjunction with the type and height of the waves as well as the length of the board along with your physical weight.

If you look at the photo of my orange colored One World with my 2.25" nubster fin attached, notice my nubster is not installed at the far end of the box. Their is a little gap of space between the nubster and the end of the box.

This small space makes a BIG difference in my board. As they say, "sometimes the smallest detail makes the biggest difference".
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters (2 Dukes)
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters

OkiWild

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Re: Quad Issues on new board
« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2020, 06:21:45 PM »
Me on a new board: First set up as a quad "This sucks, it won't even turn." Second out as a thruster "This is way better," and surf it like that for a while. Then start thinking about quad again, switch it out "This board is magic as a quad." LOL

Turns out the problem is usually me getting used to the board.

But different boards are different in their tail shape, and more importantly, the fin placement. First thing I notice about your board is the trailers look to be placed pretty far back. Like farther back than the center box? That's going to make a quad really, really tight. In addition to that, your trailing fins are set back in their tabs.  Inserting  a picture of three of my performance boards, and notice how far forward the trailers are in relation to the center box. 

With the fins like mine, the boards turn almost like a thruster, but won't slide, and actually feels like there's acceleration when on a rail (because there is). The only drawback is that when flat (not really on a rail) and accelerating (like dropping in) in powerful, hollow surf, which is 95% of what we have here, the tail can feel really skatey, which is pretty unnerving. Many people like the nubster or guitar pick center, I like the Mink Systems diffuses (black tabs on the tail). They're all the way at the back, which works well to keep the tail from squirming, especially when there's some chop, and air moving under the board.

My problem with thruster on SUP hasn't been one of speed, but one of "hook." With the wide tail and increased volume when compared to a normal short board, once put hard on a rail, I can feel the board wanting to "cork out," and it's really easy for me to push through the hold of the fins, especially when coming out of the turn and the board is transitioning back to flat. Some people like this sliding feel. I don't, and the quad cured this. One of my Tokoro 6' short boards measures 12" leading edge to leading edge of the forward fins, where my SUP boards measure closer to 17". So in a turn with the thruster on SUP, it ends up feeling more like a twin short board, and the quad brings back to more of what I like.

But again...fin placement is everything, and on some boards, some things aren't going to work.


 


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