Author Topic: First Hardboard  (Read 948 times)

MaartenAir

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First Hardboard
« on: November 30, 2019, 10:25:18 AM »
Hi All,
First post here. I started paddling 2 seasons ago. First I rented boards, tried out several and ended up buying a Red Paddle Voyager 13'2". I'm 6'3" and 205 lbs. I like the board and use it in flat water and some chop.

So here's my question: I would like to add a hardboard in case I want to to a quick session and don't feel like pumping up the board. I've looked at touring boards but could end up not using the red again. Storing space is an issue so a 12'6" hardboard is still a questionmark for me. To add some diversity, would it be a good idea to go for an allround board like a Naish Nalu 10'6, a Quest 10'8" or maybe a Quest 9'8"(200liters).
Opinions are welcome.
Thanks, Maarten (from The Netherlands)

supthecreek

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2019, 02:22:06 PM »
Hi Maarten, welcome to the Zone!

For years, all I had were my surf SUPs, so I did all my flat-water paddling on small boards.
I am 5'10, and hovered around 235 lbs most years.

I paddled my 8'10 Allwave for several years.
Then I got a 10' Mana which was awesome on flat-water.
Later, I bought a 10'6 Naish Nalu that was also really nice as a flat-water board.
I surfed them all, but I was paddling them around 6 miles, 4 or 5 days a week.
BUT... I don't race around on them... I am happy to cruise the edges, exploring and enjoying the waterworld.

So yeah.... I have always been a big fan of short SUPs in flat-water, because of the ease of use and the fact I can surf them as well.

Sunova has supplied me with 12 and 14' boards that I now use on flat-water, but if I was paying.... I'd still be on short boards  ;D

Here's a vid, that shows a lot of flat-water and some surfing on a 9'5 x 32 at 160 liters (same volume as the 10'6 Nalu)
I give all the stats and rocker info in the vid.

You may want to go with a longer board, but this one or something similar will fit your space easily and very nice to carry!




Hail SUPin

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2019, 06:28:18 PM »
I have the 10í8 Quest and itís a really good board for an all arounder. I prefer the Quest over the Nalu. The board paddles really good, itís plenty stable, and surfs really good.  The only thing that might be a problem is if you want to strap anything down to the nose with tie downs. Whenever I pack extra water and snacks for a longer paddle it bogs the nose down and makes it a little harder to paddle. But overall I really like the 10í8 Quest and definitely recommend it, especially if there is a chance to surf it.

Dusk Patrol

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2019, 10:53:01 PM »
Hey Maarten, welcome
Are you only going to be on flat water? If so, consider sticking with a flat water shape, or at least a hybrid, with a little bit of shape in the front. Yes you can enjoy being out in the environment on an all rounder with their surf shape, but (I think) itís great to feel some efficiency and glide (and tracking) on flat water. And youíre already used to that with your Red.
Then for your goals of jumping on a quick session and storage, maybe something in the 10í6 - 11í6 length? And in a light-ish construction so not awkward to wrangle...Starboard has an 11í6 touring, Surftech has some Joe Bark designed hybrids, Sunova has the Search....depends on whatís available in the Netherlands. But if you get an all rounder you might go find some surf, which wouldnít be bad either : )
Bullet V2; RS 14x26; New Deal 9'6; BluePlanet 9'4

MaartenAir

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2019, 12:30:40 AM »
Thanks for the wellcome and advice guys.
@Rick: nice video. I'm surprised that the 160 liter board carries you that well in flat water. Nice board! Your flat water scenery looks familiar to what we have over here.

I can demo the Nalu and Quest in my neck of the woods. Seems like I'm moving in the right direction there.

I won't be racing the board, just cruising and fitness paddling. Might try some waves too. A hybrid shape could be an option.

I'll try out some boards and look into the Sunova as well. I noticed there's a dealer in Germany, so not too far away. Thanks again and happy paddling,

Maarten

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #5 on: December 01, 2019, 09:03:05 AM »
Maarten,  One thing not mentioned - the nose shape of the board.  I often paddle backwater like Creek, in his videos, and in open larger bay areas. When there is a breeze we get a 7-15cm short, quick chop ...and for some reason, the longer paddle legs seems to always be on a diagonal. 

I had  a dedicated 'cruising' board that people loved but it had a plumb stem (vertical nose) compared to a dinner plate, surf nose.  I was forever getting slapped sideways. I had to work extra hard to hold a course.  The surf nose rode over the top of these bumps. That race shape must benefit racers -it is quite common- but I quickly sold the board.

Jim
Sunova Skate XL .. Blue Planet MultiTasker ..   Atlantis Venom

Dusk Patrol

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #6 on: December 01, 2019, 03:47:34 PM »
Yes, totally agree with what Wetstuff says about avoiding the verticle piercing prow nose... kind of an anachronistic design now anyway.

Check out Gong's Sherpa and hilariously named Perv. They once told me they would happily deliver to any address in Europe (but not, sadly, to the states).

https://www.gong-galaxy.com/en/category-product/sup-en/sup-cruising-en/page/2/   
« Last Edit: December 01, 2019, 03:49:16 PM by Dusk Patrol »
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MaartenAir

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #7 on: December 02, 2019, 06:26:14 AM »
Maarten,  One thing not mentioned - the nose shape of the board.  I often paddle backwater like Creek, in his videos, and in open larger bay areas. When there is a breeze we get a 7-15cm short, quick chop ...and for some reason, the longer paddle legs seems to always be on a diagonal. 

I had  a dedicated 'cruising' board that people loved but it had a plumb stem (vertical nose) compared to a dinner plate, surf nose.  I was forever getting slapped sideways. I had to work extra hard to hold a course.  The surf nose rode over the top of these bumps. That race shape must benefit racers -it is quite common- but I quickly sold the board.

Jim

Thanks Jim,
My Red Voyager tends to veer off wind on the crosswind legs so that sounds familiar. I like the red but in a crosswind it's not very comfortable to paddle. Going with the surf nose makes sense and confirms my search. This forum is very helpful. BTW that Atlantis Venom of yours looks awesome. Maybe Starboard saw it too when they designed the Generation :-)
Best regards, Maarten

MaartenAir

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2019, 06:40:11 AM »
Yes, totally agree with what Wetstuff says about avoiding the verticle piercing prow nose... kind of an anachronistic design now anyway.

Check out Gong's Sherpa and hilariously named Perv. They once told me they would happily deliver to any address in Europe (but not, sadly, to the states).

https://www.gong-galaxy.com/en/category-product/sup-en/sup-cruising-en/page/2/   

Hi, thanks for the input. I have noticed that Gong board. How about that name LOL. Pricewise these are interesting, good looking board. No idea what the weight on these things are. I'm kind of an old fashioned guy though and don't like buying stuff on the internet. Especially not an SUP. I prefer to look the person I'm buying from in the eye.
I have found a surf store here on the coast and they sell Sunova. How about that. They even have the The One in store. The 9'5" is maybe a bit on the small side but I'll check it out anyway.

Regards, Maarten

Night Wing

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #9 on: December 02, 2019, 08:55:15 AM »
@ MaartenAir

What I am about to post is just "food for thought".

It looks to me you're mostly going to do flat water paddling and cruising. And "maybe" do a little sup surfing. But, when it comes t to sup surfing, you have never mentioned what the waves are like where you would go surfing and whether they are normally tiny, small, medium or head high.

Where I sup surf on the upper Texas coast, our waves are normally in the range of tiny (1'-1 1/2") to small (2'-2 1/2'). With these small waves, you will not  see prone surfers since they are mostly on performance boards of (6'-7 1/2') with volume in these boards from 60-90 liters. So with our small waves, you won't find many prone surfers at all because our waves do not have enough dynamic lift energy in them to allow these people to surf.

Ditto for sup surfers who are using a 9'-9 1/2' long sup with 120-140 liters. Why? Because these people usually weigh a lot more in pounds than the liters of their boards. So a guy of 175-190 pounds will have a hard time sup surfing a board with a 1' wave in height because of, again, not enough dynamic lift energy in these types of waves.

I have two relatively long boards which are 11'1" @ 173 liters and a 10'5" @ 190 liters which easily gives me a nice gliding ride in our tiny to small waves which because I only weigh 145 pounds right now.

Both of these boards can also sup surf a bow tanker wave in the ship channels when there are no waves at all. These two boards will do coastal cruising as well as flat water paddling. Both boards also have 5 fin boxes which, in my opinion, turn these boards into "jack of all trades boards and master of them all" because they can master any wave situation which I will encounter.

Getting back to sup surfing. Below is a few videos of where I sup surf on the upper Texas coast. I've chosen these videos to show you what a 10' sup (and above in length) can do in tiny to small waves. Please take note in both videos below, there are no other prone or sup surfers around because of these types of waves.

The first video is of a 11' x 32" @ 200 liters Riviera sup boards which can be rented down at our local surf shops which cater to prone and sup surfing. The video will show this board on a tiny wave which doesn't break.



The second video is of a 10'6" sup on tiny to small waves. I don't know the width of this board but I'm "guessing" it is around 30"-31" in width.



Since you've watched both videos, at your 205 pounds, I think you should seriously look at any board over 10' in length. When I was looking at a third sup, I wanted a board so any of my friends could ride it in flat water and sup surf it. I eventually settled on the Blue Planet "Duke" at 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 liters because my guests could use it as well as I could use it. And as a bonus, it had 5 fin boxes which I am a big fan of in sup boards over 10' in length.

But, there wasn't any videos of the Duke so I had to look at one Blue Planet video which featured a board similar in length, exact width and close to volume of liters. It was the Blue Planet "Easy" which is 10'2" x 32" x 4.5" @ 181 liters. The "Easy" has a hybrid pulled in nose whereas the "Duke" has a nose rider nose.



After watching the above video about 50 times, I knew the "Duke" would be perfect for my guests as well as me for the wave conditions which are prevalent on the upper Texas coast. And it would be perfect for flat water paddling, coastal cruising, bow tanker wave surfing as well as beach sup surfing. And as a bonus, this board has my preferred 5 fin boxes.

 So the above is my thoughts on this subject.
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters

Dusk Patrol

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2019, 12:04:36 PM »
You mention the Starboard Generation. That’s what I’m describing as a hybrid. The Generation is an evolution of one of my favorite boards ever, the first gen Freeride.
Check out the nose on this:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RLCAUZzctFA&feature=youtu.be
Not made anymore...

And by all reports, Gong are a bunch of stand up guys...  ouch, but true
« Last Edit: December 02, 2019, 12:28:38 PM by Dusk Patrol »
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MaartenAir

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #11 on: December 02, 2019, 12:10:41 PM »
@NightWing: thanks so much for taking the time to post your elaborate reply.

As for your question about the surf we get here: here is a video from the Dutch coast to give you an idea:



Surf can be more mushy depending on conditions.
I agree that I'm better of with a board over 10'. I like the Sunova The One 10'2". the 10'11"is is bit wide for my taste at 34". The Blue Planet board you mentioned is in the right Ballpark.
 
One of the reasons I prefer not to get a board over say 12' is the fact that I'm also a windsurfer and I have 4 windsurf boards in my garage (2 of them longboards).
That said, I kinda forsee that I'll have a couple more SUP boards in time LOL.
I really do like the simplicity of Stand Up Paddling. It is such an engaging activity. Just take a board and a paddle and go. No rigging of sails etc. It gives me time on the water and that is just priceless IMHO.

Regards, Maarten






MaartenAir

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2019, 12:16:14 PM »
You mention the Starboard Generation. Thatís what Iím describing as a hybrid. The Generation is an evolution of one of my favorite boards ever, the first gen Freeride.
Check out the nose on this:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RLCAUZzctFA&feature=youtu.be

Yes an interesting board for sure. My local Starboard dealer didn't dig it though.  I kinda like it but there is not much user info on it yet (at least I haven't found it). At 28" wide it's on the narrow side for my lenght and skill ;-) fairly long as well at 12'6. Still a good looking board an I'd like to know what people think about it.
I like the JP Hybrid as well but it's supposed not to be any good for big guys like myself.

Regards, Maarten
« Last Edit: December 02, 2019, 12:19:03 PM by MaartenAir »

Night Wing

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #13 on: December 02, 2019, 02:39:25 PM »
@ MaartenAir

Thanks for showing me what type of waves you have on the Dutch coast.

I do a lot of flat water paddling since I'm about 117 "miles" from Surfside, Texas so going to the beach is a 2 1/2 hour drive for me is not a short drive. When I was looking at an 11' sup board for flat water paddling, I still wanted it to be able to do sup surfing. I'm going to give you a few more videos to show you what an 11' sup board can do for flat water paddling and sup surfing.

The first video is of a Sup Sports "One World" which is normally a production made board of 11'1" x 30" x 4.6" @ 200 liters with 3 fin boxes. But in this video, I think this is a custom built One World so it would be around 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 180 liters with 3 fin boxes. This white colored board is doing some coastal cruising.



But there isn't too many "One World" sups showing them surfing waist to head high waves. Again, I had to find a production made sup board around 11'-11'2" in length as a substitute for a "One World". So I found a video of a Starboard "Blend" at 11'2" x 30" x 4.4" @ 174 liters with 3 fin boxes and the video below is of it. And the "Blend" is still in production today by Starboard although it has seen some new modifications since the time of this video below.



Starboard also makes the "Blend" in a widepoint model which is 11'2" x 32" x 4.6" @ 198 liters with 3 fin boxes. And the video of it is below.



Since I prefer a board with 5 fin boxes, the production made "Blend" didn't make the final cut choice wise. The Sup Sports "One World" could be had in a custom built model and this is why I went with the "One World". And it would be cheaper in price than the "Blend".

I went with the "One World" because I weighed (at that time) 146 pounds. I could also thin out the rails, have the liters of volume brought down from 200 liters to 173 liters, change the grip handle and I could have it built with 5 fin boxes. This is why my "One World" is 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 liters. This would be perfect for me for flat water paddling and sup surfing for the water conditions and places I usually go to.

I ordered it on Dec 7th, 2017 and it arrived at the shipping terminal in Houston, Texas on Feb 7th, 2018. Right at 8 weeks which is not too bad time wise for a custom built sup and I had it done with ballis tec construction which is very durable. And the link to my One World is below.

https://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,32850.0.html

In conclusion, don't discount a board between 10'-11' in length especially with your 6'3" height and 205 pounds weight.

 
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters

MaartenAir

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Re: First Hardboard
« Reply #14 on: December 03, 2019, 02:09:53 AM »
Thanks again Night Wing.

I had completely overlooked the Starboard 11'2"x 32". Read some reviews on it and it's pretty good voor flatwater cruising as well and should do well in the surf we have in my neck of the woods.
Interesting alternative for sure and I can get it from my local dealer. BTW I also discovered a Blue Planet dealer not too far away. Hardboards are becoming a bit rare over here. The market is predominantly inflatable.

Best regards, Maarten