Author Topic: 'Healthcare for all'  (Read 17116 times)

Wetstuff

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'Healthcare for all'
« on: October 23, 2019, 01:37:27 PM »
..a clarion call to attract a base for Bernie and Warren not dissimilar to 'Bring back Coal', and equally as likely to be worked on 'after the sale'.  Here is a short summary of programs in other countries that often get mentioned. This particular statement stood out because a US immigrant can begin the 'chain' process of bringing in elderly parents or sick relatives once they have status.

"Those wishing to settle in Canada must pass a thorough "health screening" prior to being eligible for "universal" healthcare coverage. If the government cannot confirm that the cost of a pre-existing condition will not exceed $20,000 in annual expenditures, then healthcare coverage will be denied permanently."


https://www.medpagetoday.com/blogs/kevinmd/82877?xid=nl_mpt_investigative2019-10-23&eun=g1282527d0r&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=InvestigateMD_102319&utm_term=NL_Gen_Int_InvestigateMD_Active

Jim




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PonoBill

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Re: 'Healthcare for all'
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2019, 04:29:35 PM »
Gotta love the summation: When it comes to healthcare reform, our politicians need to stop trying everything else, and just do the right thing the first time. It is not Medicare for All.

Where the fuck did that come from? And what exactly is the right thing the first time? I read the article twice assuming I missed something. Nope, neither topic was discussed at all in the article.

In fact, we actually do have a rational healthcare system that includes both single-payer negotiated payments to hospitals and physicians along with supplementary private coverage. It's called Medicare, and it works very well--for the most expensive and intractable sector of the healthcare population. I haven't seen a cogent argument against it other than doctors and the insurance companies wouldn't like it and I'm reasonably certain that's why there isn't any argument in the article you like--just an unsupported statement out of the blue. Given the current clusterfuck that is healthcare insurance in the USA (which I'd place at the feet of Obama, exacerbated by moronic Trump meddling) I think it's the only likely solution. Medicare happened because the health care industry didn't want to insure the most expensive and challenging age group. The fact that medicare works is a solid demonstration that single-payer negotiation is a critical part of keeping health care affordable. And no, it's not going broke, though without Medicare for All it will get more expensive. People are living longer, and medical cost rise rapidly with age. Extending the insurance pool to younger, healthier people will reduce the cost.

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SeldomScene

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Re: 'Healthcare for all'
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2019, 05:56:59 PM »
Once people learn that you actually have to pay for Medicare the shine will wear off. Most people pay $137.50 a month (each person) then pay whatever you select for Part C and Part D.  My wife and I pay about $675 a month for total Medicare.  A lot of people just want everything free.  As for those countries that have socialized health care, try downloading their tax forms and fill them out as if you live there.  Youíll pay one way or the other.  I did that with our neighbors to the north and my taxes increased four fold.

eastbound

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Re: 'Healthcare for all'
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2019, 06:45:04 PM »
i pay 2250 per month for what's supposed to be good coverage for my wife and me and one stepchild--that's 27k a year (no dental)
i burn about 4000 per year in deductibles across those covered

i am often fighting with my insurer about whether medical activity is warranted, and why they wont cover charges they consider excessive

whatever the case, im 31k out of pocket before i even get to start arguing about shit

oh and i really enjoy the ridiculous paperwork and admin procedures that are clearly designed to exhaust the consumer who's fighting to not get shafted

gimme medicare for all with supplemental--ill pay either via my taxes, or ill pay the premiums out of pocket

medicare covers, today, here and now, the most expensive demographic in the us---waaaay more efficiently than our private insurance sector covers our much healthier younger people---it's a clear corporate failure

i am so jealous when i shepherd my dad through medical episodes--he has medicare with supplemental--works great--hell, he's had a knee and a hip replaced, and a hammer toe pinned down, at ny's hospital for special surgery, considered one of the best orthopedic hospitals in the country--zippo paperwork--zippo out of pocket--stunning to an idiot like me with "good" private insurance

canadian incomes and taxes, when adjusted for obvious cost of living differentials, including healthcare (estimated to hit americans for an avg of 10 k per yr vs 3k for canadians), real estate etc are actually quite comparable to those for americans--where if anything canadians end up with slightly more disposable cashola than americans---google around
« Last Edit: October 23, 2019, 06:55:38 PM by eastbound »
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SeldomScene

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Re: 'Healthcare for all'
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2019, 07:17:46 PM »
Two things:  $2250 a month?  How can that be with the Affordable Care Act in effect?

The Canadians I know arenít living large.  Median home price $1 million.  Gas, $6 a gallon.  Taxes, enormous.  Your assertions are vague and general and offer no basis in facts.  Itís just an ideological justification on an informal forum.  If everyone would just believe ...

PonoBill

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Re: 'Healthcare for all'
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2019, 07:34:23 PM »
Once people learn that you actually have to pay for Medicare the shine will wear off. Most people pay $137.50 a month (each person) then pay whatever you select for Part C and Part D.  My wife and I pay about $675 a month for total Medicare.  A lot of people just want everything free.  As for those countries that have socialized health care, try downloading their tax forms and fill them out as if you live there.  Youíll pay one way or the other.  I did that with our neighbors to the north and my taxes increased four fold.

My wife, fifteen years younger than me, pays $1200 a month for insurance. $1000 deductible. She has type 1 diabetes but controls it tightly and is otherwise extremely healthy. She constantly battles with the insurance company about all kinds of trivia. I'm trying to understand your point Seldom--$675 a month for two people over 60 is a fraction of what you would otherwise pay.
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eastbound

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Re: 'Healthcare for all'
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2019, 03:43:48 AM »
my insurance is provided by an entity with 500 employees--provided by aetna, ranked a top quality insurer by consumer reports

i pay my premiums in total, out of pocket, bc i am am technically a 1099 "employee"--regular employees have half of their premiums deducted from their paychecks, and the employer pays half

and obamacare is not "in force"---it's been gutted by trump and repubs---there are no decent insurance offerings on the NY exchange, and in most states--there were, before--in fact i got a great policy for two years for less than half the price i pay now with lower deductibles---then they gutted the payments system and rendered it dis-economic to provide decent policies at all---if i were now, with aca gutted, to need to get insurance as an individual, id not be able to get decent quality insurance with a carrier that allows me to use decent hospitals-----and anything other than dangerous, were my family to get sick, would push into the 4000's per month with even higher deductibles---believe me i shop alternatives

if you don't think an other-than-totally-lousy family policy costs 2k+, with multi thousand dollar deductibles, you are being attracted into the trump camp---good luck with the trump camp!

lol on the mcdonald's employee policies--they have deductibles AND lifetime cap at some laughable value like 75k!!

like i say---give me medicare with supplemental--ill happily pay outta pocket or in my tax bill---i am done with the private insurance con job--

vague==>"the Canadians i know"

if you think youre medicare is too expensive for most americans to be happy with, speak to some younger non-medicare-covered "americans you know"--ask about the cost of their insurance and their medical care overall--describe your costs and care to them---see if they'd be happier with your lot than theirs...........
or do some reading on the matter..........

Medicare is a great value for you---especially when your very costly health demographic is considered---and it works---quite well, in fact

want

« Last Edit: October 24, 2019, 03:52:27 AM by eastbound »
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RideTheGlide

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Re: 'Healthcare for all'
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2019, 09:27:08 AM »
For several years my plan was to retire at 63.5 and then use COBRA to bridge to Medicare. With rising prices, age banding, larger deductibles and less things covered, it's a bigger slice than I want to take out of savings. I don't know how median wage workers get by.
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