Author Topic: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help  (Read 3873 times)

TallDude

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #15 on: September 16, 2019, 11:33:30 PM »
You don't want it cool, you want it warm, then cooking (literally) hot. I can get my shop to about 95 degs which works for a cook off cure. I use two radiant electric heaters I bought at a 2nd hand store. If it's cool or cold the epoxy will cure funky. Feels rubbery and does not sand well. I prefer to cure and sand the CF first, then do the 2 or 4 oz. after. You are not getting much strength out of the fiberglass, it's more of a sanding layer. The concrete sealer goes on last after every thing is done, and yes it's good for pin hole.

tarquin

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #16 on: September 17, 2019, 01:44:05 AM »
Jimmy Lewis has done a load of great vids about glassing. His poor mans peel ply is great. Lap tape technique etc.
 
 

TallDude

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #17 on: September 17, 2019, 10:00:18 AM »
Jimmy Lewis has done a load of great vids about glassing. His poor mans peel ply is great. Lap tape technique etc.
+1  Great videos. You have to watch them closely, because he blows through the basics and makes it look easy. It's not, he's just super efficient. 

willi

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #18 on: September 22, 2019, 04:59:27 PM »

Hello TallDude & Tarquin -- TallDude The tip about using the roller table was spot on -- It is a hell of a lot easier than glassing with the cloth draped over the board and pouring resin on it -- If one has the room its the way to go.
I was even able to use the Jimmy Lewis thin plastic tip on the board after i got the carbon down on the board and trimmed.
 
Being in the heat over 80 here most of the time --  there was not time to chat as the carbon transfer went great - Tarquins tip about the roller heating up was good advise --I ran from the big table to the glassing room to unroll the carbon-- even then I could feel the heat --but the roll out process goes so fast - and once the carbon was down  and spread out there was a little time to work all the bubbles and laps out.
Speaking of bubbles -- I have about 6 or 8 --small ones yes I was paying attention but they snuck by ;} -- so what is the best treatment as i am sure not the first person to get a bubble in carbon ??? I was going to drill a small hole in the carbon and press some thixotropic glue into it with a heavy weight to flatten it out. This glue doesn't get hot enough to melt the foam - and it what I use to put my fin box in (and repairs) as there is no fear of too much heat and its very strong. Is the consistancy of vaseline when mixed so it stays where you put it.
The help you all have shared is awesome - thanks so much for the camraderie.

Here's a couple of pics of the process

Thanks again

Peace & Aloha





willi

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #19 on: September 22, 2019, 05:04:49 PM »
missed a couple of pictures during the process

willi

TallDude

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #20 on: September 22, 2019, 08:48:37 PM »
The wet tables are under rated. Glad that worked out. You might try a little direct spot heat. The eps expands when you heat it, but a little more heat and it shrinks. I've never tried it, so maybe make a practice piece on a junker board or a sample piece you make. A safer route would be to put a slice through it side to side then put a couple of pieces glass over it. You'll never see the cut after it's all sanded out. If it wants to pop up, throw wax paper down and put some weight on it.

blackeye

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #21 on: September 23, 2019, 01:01:54 PM »
If it wants to pop up, throw wax paper down and put some weight on it.

A bit of plastic might be better if another layer is to be applied, but yeah, don't forget a barrier between the weight and the board! I use plastic sheet, then a small sandbag if the surface is curved, then weights on top of that.

One time the eps melted on me as the epoxy went soft. Maybe a momentary application of high heat might work? ie with an iron of some sort? I don't know.

TallDude

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #22 on: September 23, 2019, 01:47:23 PM »


I was even able to use the Jimmy Lewis thin plastic tip on the board after i got the carbon down on the board and trimmed.
 
I wonder if this is why you ended up with some bubbles? I don't think Jimmy does anything more than spackle, which fills the voids but doesn't actually seal the blank. If you did the epoxy and MB sealer on the blank, it does actually seal the blank. With Jimmy's plastic technique, I guessing he can push / force some of the epoxy into the blank as he drags his squeegee over the plastic (I've never tried it)? Flattening any bubbles out. When you put the plastic over your board, I can see how air or epoxy bubbles might get trapped between the sealed board and the plastic. The bigger the board the trickier it gets. Plus you need good lighting to see those bubbles.   

willi

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #23 on: September 24, 2019, 11:45:20 AM »


Hello TallDude -- Thanks for the reply & thoughts -- I did use spackle & thickened (microballons) epoxy to seal the blank as you suggested.
I had better luck with the botton being covered with plastic than I did the top -- the plastic  on top caught a bit of air and once the plastic is down and stuck its hard to get the air bags out of the plastic -- maybe i was using too thin .75 mil -- as it would rip pulling the tape tight pver the rail to the bottom. But did squeeqie down pretty nice.

I will use some 1 mil I have on the next experiment (it will be a Naish style down- wind board . We get pretty much afternoon wind here with little  bay or Gulf chop -- and though it would be fun.

I did an almost finished weigh in and it right at 19 pounds right now with maybe 2 more pounds of fin etc to add -- that amkes me happy -- now I gotta get it wet.

How many vents would you put in as it is a 14 -- but is gonna be painted white .??

thanks for your input

aloha







TallDude

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #24 on: September 24, 2019, 04:50:13 PM »
At least one. If you're painting it white, then one should be enough. On my 18'+ unlimiteds I use 2 vents.

willi

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #25 on: September 25, 2019, 06:26:59 PM »


Hello TallDude -- yea lots of foam in an unlimited - how lont is it ? Did you build it ? Carbon & what would it weigh ?

Got the 2.8oz glass done on the bottom today 00 and wondered as you mentioned beofre -- you sand it all off ? I am guessing it is used to seal the carbon and is not needed !!!

I weight the board after i glassed it today and it right at 19 pounds -- Not much else to put on it - fin & box & deck pad  and glass the deck -- so I am happy with the projected (in my head) weight ! Oh and paint - sanded also ! Guess under 25 pounds would be OK for a home built board!

The new thread on paint is interesting / seems like the concrete sealer would be heavy ?

Thanks again for all the help

aloha

willi

thanks again for

willi

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #26 on: September 26, 2019, 06:19:49 PM »


hello TallDude -(or anyone with an opinion ;])

- A little direction if you have time -- the 2.8 oz is down over the carbon and sanded --do you put a sand coat on and be done --or the concrete sealer now --

My other boards I have put a coat on and sanded to matt finish and left it (but that was with 2 x 6oz cloth - but no carbon - trying to save weight here   

maybe a hot coat as its quite smooth -

thank

aloha

TallDude

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #27 on: September 26, 2019, 07:01:43 PM »
The hot coat is the standard routine on most boards, but.... it will add weight. Do you need it? Probably not. The concrete sealer should do the trick. I would prime and paint first, then do the concrete sealer last. A little bondo here and there after you prime works good.

Here's a link to my time machine... https://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,18700.0.html


willi

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #28 on: September 27, 2019, 08:44:29 PM »


Woa - TallDude that is some project you did -- and yikes the final is awesome -- what perseverance you have -- lots of nights trying to sleep figuring out next step and all --']

Thanks for the info on the hot coat (and other tips too)-- The 2.8 oz cloth came out very flat top and bottom easy to hand lam --However it is so hot here the resin kicks quick -- no fooling around --got to get it down squeegie and clean up fast -- --  -
- so I will prime -- sand and spray it with an oil base white gloss -an put her in the water-
yes, very boring but it is wicked hot here and boards heat up fast  on beach or car top --high volume Gore vent in the middle --

For the record the 3K twill I used held together nicely - Soller and the guys were helpful with quick shipping. I got the 2.8 cloth from Thayercraft -- Steve is very knowledgeable -- but I am sure Zoners know about those sources.

Will send some pics when the boards painted --  -- right at 20lbs now with paint - fin & deck pad to come.

aloha
willi

 --

willi

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Re: 14' Open water rocker / bottom shape help
« Reply #29 on: September 28, 2019, 01:52:08 PM »


Any ideas on fin placement -- on a 14 (one in picture )   that will surf smaller downwind slush - both my 12.6 boards have about 24" to the back of the fin box and don't wiggle around too much when i do catch funky little waves --
wonder how to translate to a 14 - more suited to some downwind work

thanks again

aloha