Author Topic: Axis Foils  (Read 218155 times)

supunk

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #945 on: April 13, 2021, 02:36:38 PM »
Interesting to hear about this. Have had this happen a fair few times when pushing hard upwind. Sometimes it is possible to de power quickly and stay on foil but if you donít react quick itís usually game over. Always wondered what was going on as there was no wing tip breach. Thought I must be breaching the stab but this makes more sense. Really helpful to know. Thanks  ;)

paddlur

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #946 on: April 13, 2021, 08:49:56 PM »
Question for those that like to go fast on the HA wings...

Have you ever experienced an issue where the foil suddenly gets a mind of it's own and goes sideways when you're going fast on a beam reach ?

It happened to me on Sunday and since raising the issue I've had other people reporting the same issue. It's caused by ventilation, see:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tIQlDJ-XPY  (Hadou is a well known bloger on all things wing/axis).

It seems to happen less with the thinner carbon mast, but people haven't experienced this issue with other brands of foils  :-\
Let me preface by saying too each there own no doubt,but this has been my personal dislike of HA wings unlike you on a reach,HA wings in the surf for me there tendency to get a mind of there own at some moments which have led me to really favor the tad lower aspect wings like the 1060 they just handle more reliably in the waves for me less surprises.Now granted have not tried the black fuse series yet or any other hi aspect wings beside The GF GL series which was not a fav of mind either.Will say for me not a big fan of the HA wings supfoiling either for that matter.Now if your on flatter water and want to go fast the HA wings are fun for me I liked the 1150 for that but once it got in the waves is where we parted ways much prefer the 1060 by a long shot not into setting any speed records especially wave riding,so for me the 1060 goes plenty fast for me in waves and my confidence level is high no surprises unless good ole pilot error
Naish kites-mhl lift foils-GoFoil-ASD surfboards fortaleza brasil,Kalama supfoil.AXIS foils

Alysum

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #947 on: April 19, 2021, 04:34:46 PM »
If anyone's seen KD Wilde's interview on the blue planet show (which I highly recommend). He shows a custom g10 material made surf wing on the Axis K fuselage  ;D ;D He claims that the black fuse head is too thick  :o

https://kdfoils.myshopify.com/products/800surf-for-axis-foils

Obviously it would only work for lightweight riders.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2021, 04:40:35 PM by Alysum »

Hdip

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #948 on: April 19, 2021, 04:39:15 PM »
Why obviously? KDMaui is 195 pounds I think.

Alysum

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #949 on: April 19, 2021, 04:41:25 PM »
Why obviously? KDMaui is 195 pounds I think.

Have you seen the K series mount ? It's quite small.
He looks a lot lighter than 195Lbs  :D
« Last Edit: April 19, 2021, 04:43:13 PM by Alysum »

Hdip

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #950 on: April 19, 2021, 06:46:51 PM »
Ah that makes sense.

2 minute 50 second mark in the blue planet podcast he says heís 6í0Ē 195#.

Vancouver_foiler

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #951 on: April 20, 2021, 10:10:11 PM »
Goodness gracious the 980 is an amazing winging foil. is there even a top end on it? Ran it back to back againt the kiruji 1210 today-more to follow.

StephenZ

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #952 on: April 21, 2021, 05:40:29 AM »
The mast ventilation issue reported here has nothing to do with the wing - and it's not an axis only thing, except indirectly with the HA foils by being faster and more efficient.

It's a result of 3 factors, the upward angle, the speed, and the mast section, and in particular the thickness of the mast relative to its chord.

It is caused by the water flow around the mast switching from laminar to turbulent flow. I'd imagine this creates an area of lower pressure around the mast, sucking in air, causing it to ventilate.

I'd imagine a longer mast gives more time to react before the air makes it down to the wing, which I think is the point when it it becomes unrecoverable.

I've never heard of it for masts with a thickness of less than 14mm, and I'd be very surprised to hear any reports of it for the axis carbon mast in any situation. However for the 19mm axis aluminium mast this effect is likely to come into play.

In the case of the HA axis wings such as the 980, you are able to go faster and at a great angle upwind than on other surf foils. Probably why nobody has reported it on any of the slower wings.

It was an often reported problem with the original liquid force kitefoil mast that had quite a narrow chord, but was quite wide at 20mm. I experienced it using the project cedrus mast (also 20mm thick) with various kitefoils when I cranked it hard upwind, more so with faster foils. I've never experienced it with the cedrus mast with any surf or wing foil, including the axis 980 v1, which is what I'm currently riding. I generally don't ride highly powered though, not by choice at least.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #953 on: April 22, 2021, 10:40:52 AM »

Hdip

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #954 on: April 22, 2021, 12:00:17 PM »
The mast ventilation issue

I watched the Spanish YouTube on the last page too. Is this only a kite/wing thing where you're leaned over against the wind and the mast is providing a lifting surface? Would that type of ventilation even occur if you're just surf foiling?

Alysum

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #955 on: April 22, 2021, 02:23:46 PM »
The mast ventilation issue reported here has nothing to do with the wing - and it's not an axis only thing, except indirectly with the HA foils by being faster and more efficient.

It's a result of 3 factors, the upward angle, the speed, and the mast section, and in particular the thickness of the mast relative to its chord.

It is caused by the water flow around the mast switching from laminar to turbulent flow. I'd imagine this creates an area of lower pressure around the mast, sucking in air, causing it to ventilate.

I'd imagine a longer mast gives more time to react before the air makes it down to the wing, which I think is the point when it it becomes unrecoverable.

I've never heard of it for masts with a thickness of less than 14mm, and I'd be very surprised to hear any reports of it for the axis carbon mast in any situation. However for the 19mm axis aluminium mast this effect is likely to come into play.

In the case of the HA axis wings such as the 980, you are able to go faster and at a great angle upwind than on other surf foils. Probably why nobody has reported it on any of the slower wings.

It was an often reported problem with the original liquid force kitefoil mast that had quite a narrow chord, but was quite wide at 20mm. I experienced it using the project cedrus mast (also 20mm thick) with various kitefoils when I cranked it hard upwind, more so with faster foils. I've never experienced it with the cedrus mast with any surf or wing foil, including the axis 980 v1, which is what I'm currently riding. I generally don't ride highly powered though, not by choice at least.

Good feedback thanks.

I've heard that people are experiencing it less with the axis carbon mast as it's obviously thinner.

The 19mm thickness of project cedrus has kind of put me off getting one as I was worried I wouldn't be able to go any faster than the current Ali 19mm plus ventilation. Good to hear you're not experiencing issues with it though.

Hdip

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #956 on: April 22, 2021, 07:13:33 PM »
I just remembered that Gunnar talks about mast ventilation in his Project Cedrus mast review. I think he felt it was less likely to ventilate. I don't have time to go back through right now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Jsn-nhbU48&t=13s

PonoBill

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #957 on: April 22, 2021, 10:58:04 PM »
I'm going to have to buy a project Cedrus mast since I had the same idea pretty much at the same time. I never implemented my idea and I'm glad I didn't since mine was a little wimpier. This looks cool.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

daswusup

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #958 on: April 23, 2021, 07:17:46 AM »
https://youtu.be/P5Tk-2IM3Ac

Nice video DW! Love the shape of that new board. My Gong HIPE has a similar, simple shape but its way heavier. I noticed that I can do the downward pulsing pumps on it really well. Like the french guy light wind video a few months back. Do you use that technique on this board? I also have the prized V1 980 and love it paired with the 380 stab. Its confusing going from black series back to red and having to remember how to pump them up to foil in light wind. I did notice that the HIPE is a bit sticky on touchdowns which I attribute to the flat bottom. How is yours on touchdowns? BTW, if you really want to max out your speed try a SS Dart. The 0-20mph is nucking futz! Send it!!!

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Axis Foils
« Reply #959 on: April 23, 2021, 07:29:04 AM »
..... I noticed that I can do the downward pulsing pumps on it really well. Like the french guy light wind video a few months back. Do you use that technique on this board?

I donít recall that video, so Iím having trouble understanding what you describe. The board does slide down a piece of chop and reach planing speed really easy. No sticking, the tail fires it back onto foil automatically.
Quote
.... if you really want to max out your speed try a SS Dart. The 0-20mph is nucking futz! Send it!!!

It would be fun to demo a Dart. I have not seen one in person.

 


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