Author Topic: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings  (Read 3147 times)

PonoBill

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #30 on: August 05, 2019, 09:18:20 PM »
None of this is going to translate to public safety and the likelihood of the government making rational decisions that translate to increased safety is less than zero. I tried. I teamed up with other people who were trying. Long, sad story, but we got nowhere.

Leash entanglement is a big deal, nearly killed me, I was just lucky. I couldn't reach my knee, no matter how hard I tried. Believe me, I was giving it all I had. Not panicked, just couldn't do it in the waves and current.

The obvious choice is a waist leash. The work really well. And I wear an impact vest--always. Not just for float--I knocked loose all the cartilage around my breastbone--at least that what the doc told me. Got stuffed in pitching wave and the tail of my board got me right in the chest. The float is nice too though. With a waist leash and an impact vest the amount of time you spend underwater in serious waves is very short. Gotta love that. A waist leash pulls you to the surface, but the drag you put on the board is a lot greater than ankle leashes. Every part of the leash needs to be 2X stronger.
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hbsteve

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #31 on: August 06, 2019, 09:44:09 AM »
Windwarrior—
Nothing is missing from the story.  Somewhere early in this post, there was mention of carrying a knife.  But, the writer had never seen anyone carry a knife. 
I reported seeing someone wear a knife on a regular basis.  I never asked him why.
That’s all.

eastbound

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #32 on: August 06, 2019, 09:48:49 AM »
https://mkt.com/leashlok-hawaii/item/leashlok-leash-belt

i buy a new one every year in advance of the northeast storm season (like, now)--first big day i switch to the new leash--dont like leash breaks in big surf
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Windwarrior

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #33 on: August 06, 2019, 09:50:25 AM »
Windwarrior—
Nothing is missing from the story.  Somewhere early in this post, there was mention of carrying a knife.  But, the writer had never seen anyone carry a knife. 
I reported seeing someone wear a knife on a regular basis.  I never asked him why.
That’s all.
Roger that.
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SeldomScene

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #34 on: August 06, 2019, 08:06:50 PM »
I know that most people on here know what they are doing, but I am more and more convinced that many people don’t know the basics, whether it be how to swim or how to remount or how not to get drunk before boarding.

Two cases in point, just today Search and Rescue recovered the body of a 30 something guy from a lake over on Orcas Island, in the San Juan chain in far northwest Washington.  He was seen to fall off his paddle board yesterday.  No PFD, nothing about a leash but he was in a small (deep) lake. 

Sunday, I was going hit a few laps on my race board, at a small (two miles around) very popular local lake.  Just as I was getting ready to hop on, a teenage guy started screaming, “My mother is drowning!” As he ran into the water and started swimming out.  A few of the 40 or so people at the small swim beach started yelling, “She’s drowning.”  I looked out and saw a face bobbing up periodically next to an inflatable, in the classic drowning scenario.  Not making a sound, face barely breaking water, hand up in the air.  She indeed was near the end.

As I paddled by the swimming son, he swam back to shore, which was good because he was going to drown too.  She was about 150 feet out.  He just couldn’t not try to save his mother.  After a few seconds I realize an overweight older guy, about 65, was fishing from a small boat about 15 feet from the woman. Hence all the people yelling, which I realized was directed at him.  I yelled to him, “you, you in the boat, three times, as I had to pass him to get to her.  The third time, I yelled “You in the fishing boat, you need to help her, she’s drowning.”  I couldn’t figure out why he wasn’t answering, because I was very confident he was hearing me.  As a retired law enforcement officer, I know how to give commands and have people hear me.  when he finally looked up he said, “I hear you, and I don’t care.” 

Anyway, I got to her and there she was, paddle in one hand and sunglasses in the other, not able to get hold of the board, or really use her arms for swimming.  In the moment, she couldn’t process her predicament enough to ditch the paddle and shades and use her arms to save herself.  I got her stuff and had her put one arm over her board and one over mine, until she could calm down and catch her breath.  She held up a toy quality inflatable PFD, about half full of air, and told me she wanted to put it on.  Her Costco board was also about half inflated, which is probably how she fell to begin with.  I told her not to bother with the pfd, and I tried to help her get back on her board, but she was too weak and spent to remount.  As this was playing out, the wind blew us right by the SUP rental stand, I have no idea if they were aware of all this or not, but it seemed weird that I was the only one with her.  And, by the way, she was wearing a leash!

A guy in a river raft with his young son then paddled up, and he was able to tug her up into the raft and take care of her from then on.  But not before she asked for her sunglasses back.  First things first.

Anyway, the Coast Guard caters to the masses.  There’s really no other way.  Maybe test all Paddlers and give you an expert badge exempting you from rules designed to the lowest common denominator?  I get the sense that most SUP drownings are occurring in what I call casual waters, where big box SUPs have replaced pool floats and cheap plastic kayaks. I see ten cheap inflatables for every serious boarder, when I am in the lake, usually for a swimming workout.  People think that being able to swim in a pool equates to suddenly finding yourself alone in a cold lake, with a leash around your leg, and waves hitting you in the face.  I guess at the risk of inconveniencing all the expert Paddlers, the Coast Guard is just trying to save these people from themselves. 

As for the fat fishing hillbilly, all I could do is paddle back by him and say, “Good job, buddy.”  He just stared at me, not saying a word.  I don’t know what his major malfunction is, whether he thinks people recreating in the lake messes with his fishing, or maybe that the woman was Asian.  Or maybe he’s just a piece of s....   it’s not a crime here to watch someone drown without trying to assist, even when you have the means.  In some places there’s a Failure to Render Assistance crime, but here it’s only Failure to Summon Assistance, meaning to call 911.  Later when I got back to shore, an NFL sized guy was pretty upset about the fisherman, he had heard and seen it all.  Don’t know if they met later ...
« Last Edit: August 06, 2019, 08:22:33 PM by SeldomScene »

Windwarrior

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #35 on: August 06, 2019, 08:22:59 PM »
Orcas was always fun times! I loved hitting Mountain Lake. A lot of great beach landings or coves to hang out at. Which lake did he die in?

Lake Washington was always another cool place. I loved circumnavigating Mercer. Many many trips and beach landings.

I was always in a sea kayak though. Never an SUP. I didn't get into SUPing until I landed in Colorado. Still have the kayak but really love my ISUP. Missing Washington bad though.

I'm really blown away the guy in the boat responded like that. I always encountered quite the opposite of Washington folks. That's a shame.
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SeldomScene

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #36 on: August 06, 2019, 08:38:45 PM »
Media reports he was in Mountain Lake, which I am not familiar with.  Sad story, I have sons sons about his age ...

TallDude

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #37 on: August 06, 2019, 09:24:45 PM »
I know that most people on here know what they are doing, but I am more and more convinced that many people don’t know the basics, whether it be how to swim or how to remount or how not to get drunk before boarding.

Two cases in point, just today Search and Rescue recovered the body of a 30 something guy from a lake over on Orcas Island, in the San Juan chain in far northwest Washington.  He was seen to fall off his paddle board yesterday.  No PFD, nothing about a leash but he was in a small (deep) lake. 

Sunday, I was going hit a few laps on my race board, at a small (two miles around) very popular local lake.  Just as I was getting ready to hop on, a teenage guy started screaming, “My mother is drowning!” As he ran into the water and started swimming out.  A few of the 40 or so people at the small swim beach started yelling, “She’s drowning.”  I looked out and saw a face bobbing up periodically next to an inflatable, in the classic drowning scenario.  Not making a sound, face barely breaking water, hand up in the air.  She indeed was near the end.

As I paddled by the swimming son, he swam back to shore, which was good because he was going to drown too.  She was about 150 feet out.  He just couldn’t not try to save his mother.  After a few seconds I realize an overweight older guy, about 65, was fishing from a small boat about 15 feet from the woman. Hence all the people yelling, which I realized was directed at him.  I yelled to him, “you, you in the boat, three times, as I had to pass him to get to her.  The third time, I yelled “You in the fishing boat, you need to help her, she’s drowning.”  I couldn’t figure out why he wasn’t answering, because I was very confident he was hearing me.  As a retired law enforcement officer, I know how to give commands and have people hear me.  when he finally looked up he said, “I hear you, and I don’t care.” 

Anyway, I got to her and there she was, paddle in one hand and sunglasses in the other, not able to get hold of the board, or really use her arms for swimming.  In the moment, she couldn’t process her predicament enough to ditch the paddle and shades and use her arms to save herself.  I got her stuff and had her put one arm over her board and one over mine, until she could calm down and catch her breath.  She held up a toy quality inflatable PFD, about half full of air, and told me she wanted to put it on.  Her Costco board was also about half inflated, which is probably how she fell to begin with.  I told her not to bother with the pfd, and I tried to help her get back on her board, but she was too weak and spent to remount.  As this was playing out, the wind blew us right by the SUP rental stand, I have no idea if they were aware of all this or not, but it seemed weird that I was the only one with her.  And, by the way, she was wearing a leash!

A guy in a river raft with his young son then paddled up, and he was able to tug her up into the raft and take care of her from then on.  But not before she asked for her sunglasses back.  First things first.

Anyway, the Coast Guard caters to the masses.  There’s really no other way.  Maybe test all Paddlers and give you an expert badge exempting you from rules designed to the lowest common denominator?  I get the sense that most SUP drownings are occurring in what I call casual waters, where big box SUPs have replaced pool floats and cheap plastic kayaks. I see ten cheap inflatables for every serious boarder, when I am in the lake, usually for a swimming workout.  People think that being able to swim in a pool equates to suddenly finding yourself alone in a cold lake, with a leash around your leg, and waves hitting you in the face.  I guess at the risk of inconveniencing all the expert Paddlers, the Coast Guard is just trying to save these people from themselves. 

As for the fat fishing hillbilly, all I could do is paddle back by him and say, “Good job, buddy.”  He just stared at me, not saying a word.  I don’t know what his major malfunction is, whether he thinks people recreating in the lake messes with his fishing, or maybe that the woman was Asian.  Or maybe he’s just a piece of s....   it’s not a crime here to watch someone drown without trying to assist, even when you have the means.  In some places there’s a Failure to Render Assistance crime, but here it’s only Failure to Summon Assistance, meaning to call 911.  Later when I got back to shore, an NFL sized guy was pretty upset about the fisherman, he had heard and seen it all.  Don’t know if they met later ...
Well done Seldom!. It amazes me how people get attached to personal items, to the point that they would die because of it. I watch Live PD and I've seen people in roll over crashes crawling out on the elbows because their phone is still in their hand. Then when the police are cuffing them for a DUI they still won't let go of their fucking phones. I buy $10 Walmart sunglasses and don't worry about losing them. I lost my Oakley's in a SUP race about 8 years ago. It's been Walmart sunglasses since. Like you I always have my eye's out for people over their heads or in distress. Maybe someday some one will look out for me. The guy in the fishing boat will have his day.

Windwarrior

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #38 on: August 07, 2019, 03:40:07 AM »
Media reports he was in Mountain Lake, which I am not familiar with.  Sad story, I have sons sons about his age ...
How old was he? You have a media link?
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SeldomScene

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #39 on: August 07, 2019, 07:46:51 AM »
Sorry I can’t seem to post the actual link on my tablet.  The story is on the local newspaper, IslandsSounder.com.  Maybe someone with a computer can post the actual link.  Guy was in his 30s. 

I hesitated to post the near drowning incident at my local lake because I like to be seldom seen (hence the screen name) and I was trying to figure out how to highlight the guy in the fishing boat and the woman’s all too familiar mistakes.  Paddling up next to someone and giving assistance is a far cry from a big water rescue, Swift water rescue, or actually getting in the water for a lifesaving type rescue.

supthecreek

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #40 on: August 07, 2019, 08:53:07 AM »
Good work SeldomScene.... she's lucky that you were there... alert and capable.

it is stunning how people process their situation.... and almost more stunning how they make decisions to engage in activities without the basic skills needed,  like swimming.

Here's the link you asked for to
http://www.islandssounder.com/news/emergency-personnel-searching-for-man-who-fell-off-paddleboard-in-mountain-lake/

I was entering the surf with a brand new "Creek" last weekend.
There was a big ditch between the beach and the sandbar where everyone was swimming.
The water was overhead in the middle and 20 yards across.

At least 1,000 people and lifeguards right behind where I was walking.

I saw a little kid (6 years old?)
Struggling and starting to sink.... he saw me coming and his eyes locked on me. Someone noticed him! You could see the relief in his eyes.
Gently, I slid the nose of my board to him and he grabbed on.
"You got it?"
"Yes"
and I pulled him into shallow water.... without the drama of a "rescue"...He smiled and ran up the beach.

I patted my new board: "Nice start!"... and hit the waves.

SeldomScene

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #41 on: August 07, 2019, 09:02:58 AM »
Right guy at the right place st the right time, good eye for you. I would urge everyone who hasn’t taken a lifeguard course, not to take a course, but to go to you tube and watch a video of what someone drowning looks like.  It’s actually very, very subtle and easy not to Notice. 

Bean

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #42 on: August 07, 2019, 09:09:15 AM »
Nicely done guys!

Back in 1966, when I was 5, I was that little kid.  Crowded beach, and I slipped just a little to deep (learning to swim was just taking hold back in Norway at that time).  Only one person recognized my struggle.  Like that kid you helped Rick, I said thanks, and just ran off.  But, I'm forever grateful.

eastbound

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #43 on: August 07, 2019, 09:15:53 AM »
so scary---and when a child goes under in whitewater shorebreak, who knows where he's gone?
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Ichabod Spoonbill

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Re: Seattle Times Article on SUP Related Drownings
« Reply #44 on: August 13, 2019, 05:23:04 PM »
Another fatality due to leash getting stuck on piling.  What’s weird is the woman was doing sup yoga and went to help someone else who got stuck in a current, huh!
Happened Friday in Long Island, NY.  I had trouble trying to get a link to the article.

https://www.newsday.com/long-island/suffolk/albertson-woman-drowns-1.34564310

Very tragic and this can happen in seconds. To touch on what Area put out there is that quick release leashes aren't actually quick release imo. These leashes have "quick release" tabs or straps that you typically have to reach down to release, and in strong currents, and when you are already entangled, this becomes much more difficult and sometimes impossible. I have leashes with quick release toggles for whitewater/river use, and sometimes even getting to this on my waist isn't easy at all in strong current, so as mentioned before, preventative education, practice and staying calm is key, but entanglement with leashes is obviously dangerous and there has been multiple deaths over the past few years as a result.

There is some great stuff getting put out on this thread but I think it has to be a really balanced approach that goes both ways. If we are going to say the board is also a floatation device and it's very important to be tethered to it, then the dangers of entanglement need to be presented as well. Education on paddling in current, around boats, being aware of obstructions that can lead to entanglement, and learning about leashes and their different applications. No one thinks they are going to get entangled when they head out for the day and then it happens. It's the preventative piece, the equipment, and escape practices that also need to be incorporated as well.

A colleague of mine is joining HVH2O with some SUP lessons. She's bringing a friend and was asking all sorts of questions about the current and our safety equipment. Then the colleague tells me that her friend was close with the person who drowned on Long Island. I had to let her know that we take safety very seriously and don't operate in any substantial current. We also always do leashes and PFDs, which is the right call for where I paddle.
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