Author Topic: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.  (Read 3558 times)

VincentShay

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DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« on: June 19, 2019, 09:10:17 AM »
Hi there! Since my wife and I own a kayak and paddleboard shop on the central coast of California (Avila Beach Paddlesports) and we had about 6 months off due to all the rain we got this season, I had alot of time on my hands. 


This Foil Thing has captured my interest after going to San O' last year to surf with my wife and we happened to park next to Jeff Clarke.  He was cool enough to show me his foils and talk about it. Then I surfed with him, me on my board and him on his foil.  REALLY cool!  For the next few days Em and I watched these amazing athletes foiling and making the often less than stellar, mushy surf, look fun.


Some of my friends on the Central Coast was doing it, mainly surfing, but I really am into downwind SUP paddling, so I wanted a downwind foil.  I had never done it, nor knew anything about it but I was game to try. This season was tough on the wallet so I couldn't afford a new foil and board (jeez, like $2000 + WOW) BUT I figured I could make one.  Even if it didn't work out, I thought maybe I would learn some stuff. And what the heck, I had designed some kayaks in my time (design for Murky Water Kayaks in Canada) in the surf kayak world way back.


How hard could it be! HA, I was in for a lesson.


It was a LONG process of learning and searching on the internet for what others were doing and the ideas behind hydrofoils and how others were making their own. I wanted to make it easy as possible so I learned Fusion 360 and made some large wing shapes, thanks to a few people on the internet who helped me. I had my .stl file and off to get some EPS foam cut! NO way not as easy as it seems...or as cheap!


Back to the drawing board!


So, either people were engineers and experienced carbon fiber/infusion/mold making guys with vacuum bags, etc, which I was NOT or you were someone who tried to carve something out of wood...or maybe skills somewhere in between.  I wanted more!


Yesterday, 5 months after I started this project I was able to put my wings on an old CorranSUP a friend had put foil boxes in (they ended up coming out after 10 runs!) and was towed behind a small inflatable to see if this would even FLY. It did!


Really I had no idea what I was doing. Most of us don't, I think! But I think at least going for it is a great learning experience.  Enjoy the vid! Its entertaining a bit and will give you a general idea of what I did to make mine. Its about 6 months condensed into 10 minutes of fun and frolic.


Now, I am going to go out and buy a good GoFoil Maliko 200! Hahahahaha.


Watch in HD.[size=78%][/size]



Vincent Shay
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PonoBill

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2019, 09:45:05 AM »
Before you give up, try making your wings out of plywood. I tested shaping a wing from three layers of 1/4 ply with carbon between the layers. Glued them up with epoxy and a lot of clamps. I didn't shape a usable wing, just roughed it out to test stiffness. Answer: very stiff. I think I can make a durable, cheap wing very quickly with a CNC router and this material. If you want to enhance the durability you can glass it, or just soak it in epoxy, stick it in a bag and draw a good vacuum on it. Release the vacuum and the epoxy penetrates. Basically the old WEST system simplified.
Ponohouse is for sale: http://www.ponohouse.com
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

VincentShay

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2019, 09:55:17 AM »
For sure! Thanks for the ideas.


So, for me I want to make a couple more...but this first one was kind of getting my feet wet.  If this thing works, I would just send up to Murky Waters to make a mold and carbon fiber prototype.  Really stiff and a tad thinner...probably work even better.


I just needed to figure out an easy way to create the more complex shape like what Slingshot was doing...something the DIY guy could do easily.


This one was actually stiff after laying up with 3 layers of 6 oz glass...one more layer would have been optimum but it got the ball rolling. 


Super fun!
« Last Edit: June 19, 2019, 09:57:08 AM by VincentShay »
Vincent Shay
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surfcowboy

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2019, 10:41:56 PM »
Love hearing this man. Iíve still not flown mine since the break on the initial test flight.

I agree with Pono, make your prototypes out of ply. Container on here does a great job. As to the ďnot knowing what youíre doingĒ thatís fine man, I think a lot of these companies had no real idea. Just stubborn enough to make and test.

Glad to see another home builder.

supunk

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2019, 12:36:47 AM »
Loved the vid and story. I was racking my mind 18 months ago with ways I could make a foil when I was trying to get into the sport and little was available locally and everything was v expensive. Ended up getting a cheap foil off Alibaba to get started. Still think of ways I could make my own wings. Liked the plexi glass/foam method. Inspiring. You have got me thinking again :)

FRP

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2019, 02:35:23 PM »
Hey Vince

Inspiring video. Love the stoke. I came into surfing through kayak surfing. My wife also surfed and had a Murky Waters carbon kevlar ďReactionĒ arguably one of the finest high performance surf kayaks ever designed and built. And the designer was.......Vince Shay! It has been a few years now but I can still picture her flying down a wave face in Tofino, doing a speed role, come up and the continuing surfing the wave. I sold my Salsa this year to a local young ripper. Now totalling addicted to SUP surfing. Great to hear from you.

Cheers

Bob
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"The time spent surfing is time that is added to my life"
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VincentShay

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2019, 04:22:48 PM »
Hey Bob! So STOKED that you loved that surf kayak.  Those were fun times! Now I am all about downwind SUP.  We have an incredible run here from Avila to Pismo....


Seriously, thanks for the shoutout and I think the biggest stoke I ever got from Surf Kayak Design was seeing people enjoying them in the surf.  I built that Reaction in 2004 and people still buy it from Murky Waters.  Way too honored.  The best thing was that these kayaks don't break. And I tried!  Ed at Murky Waters is seriously one of, if not THE BEST manufacturer in the World. 


This foil thing is pretty interesting...I just bought two foil boards from Dave over at Infinity and can't wait to actually learn to use them in the surf with a 'real' foil.  Thanks for all the suggestions ALL.


-vince
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SUPeter

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2019, 09:25:51 AM »
Yes, you will have a very strong and stiff wing using plywood.  You will also have a very heavy wing by going that route, not to mention the extra time it takes to carve that wood to spec, unless of course you have a CNC cutter.  Take a look at the carbon lacing method between ply templates . It'll cost you about $50 USD in supplies and will create a wing that often weighs less than production wings.  The biggest benefit being the easily followed contours of the ply templates which will help to create perfectly shaped and symmetrical wings with ease. Just a thought!  It really is easier than the wings I've carved from plywood. Just a thought.

PonoBill

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2019, 10:13:24 AM »
I have a CNC router on the way, and I'll probably get a larger, higher spec one as soon as I'm comfortable with it. The idea is to be able to design a wing and have it carved without my attention and effort. In that scenario I can make a lot of them with different design ideas for the same amount of time invested that it would take to master making one with your method. Especially since I'm not a particularly careful or patient worker.

I'm not worried about weight for these wings, I probably won't even seal them to extend their life--they can be one or two uses and fall apart as long as I learn what I'm looking for. I like your approach a lot, I might try that later. I have a Glowforge laser cutter that would pump out those templates nicely.
Ponohouse is for sale: http://www.ponohouse.com
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

surfcowboy

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2019, 07:17:01 PM »
Pono, if you cut me some ribs Iíd 100% do a test build using Peterís method. Iíll pay materials and shipping and offer whatever design help I can (little to none lol) So if you want a test pilot Iíll kick in some labor.

I have a pretty good mast and plate design. I need a better way to calculate and set my angle of attack but I think those of us on here who have been doing this (and have no real commercial outcome) should team up and start open sourcing some of this stuff. The commercial guys can benefit but so will the DIY guys.

Iím about to take on making a foil board from scratch and Iíll post what I find Oas always.

supunk

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2019, 09:40:40 AM »
Has anyone got any info on the dims of the new GL GoFoil wings? Have been inspired to start laminating a plywood high aspect wing to try and fit onto my Gong fuse. The blank is 110cm x 20cm. The GL wings look very flat from the pictures I have seen. Would like to get a better idea of the wings dims including the angle of attack? Everything so far has been eyeballed!
Thanks in advance :)
« Last Edit: June 25, 2019, 10:04:10 AM by supunk »

PonoBill

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2019, 11:07:11 AM »
Pono, if you cut me some ribs Iíd 100% do a test build using Peterís method. Iíll pay materials and shipping and offer whatever design help I can (little to none lol) So if you want a test pilot Iíll kick in some labor.

I have a pretty good mast and plate design. I need a better way to calculate and set my angle of attack but I think those of us on here who have been doing this (and have no real commercial outcome) should team up and start open sourcing some of this stuff. The commercial guys can benefit but so will the DIY guys.

Iím about to take on making a foil board from scratch and Iíll post what I find Oas always.

If you can give me the template outlines in a vector format that I can convert then I'll be glad to run them off for you. Otherwise it's project 2031. Which means you can expect to see them around 2031.
Ponohouse is for sale: http://www.ponohouse.com
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

surfcowboy

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2019, 07:05:14 PM »
Sounds like my schedule. lol

Iíll see if I can sort that out. Seems do-able. Iíll hit up SUPeter and see if heís ever drawn them or if heís eyeballing them.

kiwi

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #13 on: June 26, 2019, 01:15:53 AM »
Has anyone got any info on the dims of the new GL GoFoil wings? Have been inspired to start laminating a plywood high aspect wing to try and fit onto my Gong fuse. The blank is 110cm x 20cm. The GL wings look very flat from the pictures I have seen. Would like to get a better idea of the wings dims including the angle of attack? Everything so far has been eyeballed!
Thanks in advance :)


My next project is a wing like these new high aspect ones. I'm going for a metre span with a chord of 160mm using an NACA 4416 profile, I considered a thinner profile but since its allready so much smaller in the chord it will only be 26mm thick which is allready much thinner than most wings. I'm going with 2 degrees AOA with washout of 2 degrees over the span so that the tips are at 0 degrees.

Lazz

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Re: DIY SUP Foil Wings- Oh geez.
« Reply #14 on: June 26, 2019, 06:40:30 AM »
Has anyone got any info on the dims of the new GL GoFoil wings? Have been inspired to start laminating a plywood high aspect wing to try and fit onto my Gong fuse. The blank is 110cm x 20cm. The GL wings look very flat from the pictures I have seen. Would like to get a better idea of the wings dims including the angle of attack? Everything so far has been eyeballed!
Thanks in advance :)


My next project is a wing like these new high aspect ones. I'm going for a metre span with a chord of 160mm using an NACA 4416 profile, I considered a thinner profile but since its allready so much smaller in the chord it will only be 26mm thick which is allready much thinner than most wings. I'm going with 2 degrees AOA with washout of 2 degrees over the span so that the tips are at 0 degrees.


Looks very promising Kiwi, does it fit on the Axis fuselage?