Author Topic: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?  (Read 13111 times)

PonoBill

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #15 on: June 18, 2019, 07:07:38 PM »
The good news is that I can have a Duotone tomorrow. The bad news is that given my place in line, it's going to be a 3M or wait until the next shipment. Given my maturity and the fact that I'm pretty heavy for the 3M to be any good to me, and my order was for a 4M and 5M, I am of course, turning down the offer of a 3M.

Yeah, right.

Tomorrow will be nuking, and I'll be out in the thick of it, with a little hankie tied to a boom. It's going to be fine. I'm certain.
Ponohouse is for sale: http://www.ponohouse.com
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

Admin

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #16 on: June 19, 2019, 03:24:35 AM »
The good news is that I can have a Duotone tomorrow. The bad news is that given my place in line, it's going to be a 3M or wait until the next shipment. Given my maturity and the fact that I'm pretty heavy for the 3M to be any good to me, and my order was for a 4M and 5M, I am of course, turning down the offer of a 3M.

Yeah, right.

Tomorrow will be nuking, and I'll be out in the thick of it, with a little hankie tied to a boom. It's going to be fine. I'm certain.

We have 3, 4 and 5 SPG wings ready to go.  Back on Friday.  Bring Advil.  Are you ready?


Admin

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #17 on: June 19, 2019, 03:25:32 AM »


« Last Edit: June 19, 2019, 03:45:58 AM by Admin »

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #18 on: June 19, 2019, 03:46:42 AM »
Someday the kooks will start showing up at our park  >:(


ninja tuna

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #19 on: June 19, 2019, 05:02:47 AM »
OK ,one question.  I have seen a couple of videos now where the guys are pumping the wing and trying to get the foil going.  I get that from windsurfing to get a little extra air.  But wouldn't it be better to just hold the wing and pump the foil. 

toejammer2

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #20 on: June 19, 2019, 06:32:16 AM »
Hey PonoBill,
Did you score yours from Bigwinds? Iím on ďthe listĒ  with a deposit but am probably far down-havenít heard anything from them.
Cheers

PonoBill

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #21 on: June 19, 2019, 09:22:52 AM »
Yes. I don't know if this is still true, but they have more 3M wings than they have people on the list. You might be able to score one if you call them today--that's how I'm getting mine. Talk to TJ.

Admin--yes I am very ready. Advil supply stocked. Impact vest fluffed and ready. Now we just need to figure out the beat place to flop around in.

Ninja, I had more luck not pumping at all. Just power up on a reach and let the foil drive itself out of the water. That assumes enough wind to do that, but I was in gusty less than 20mph when I did it. I think a lot of pumping might be fine once I'm more used to the thing, but it worked to just let it lift and be stable.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2019, 09:36:07 AM by PonoBill »
Ponohouse is for sale: http://www.ponohouse.com
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

Julie_Scheyer

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #22 on: June 19, 2019, 11:38:33 AM »
Aloha!  Iím new to this forum.  I have been hydrofoiling downwind using Foilwings for a few months. ďhow much windĒ Here is Kane hydrofoiling just by pumping.  Itís how much you can pump, and your hydrofoil board and hydrofoil wing size.  Iím not much of a pumper, or paddler, so I need the wings...Duotone has a 5m and it is comfortable for mediocre non pumping athlete me, on a 2000sqcm front wing and 68l board in avg 12mph. A more skilled person can easily ride it in less. 

« Last Edit: June 19, 2019, 11:42:06 AM by Julie_Scheyer »
Duotone Foilwing rider.  Hydrofoil setup for Foilwings: Fanatic 1500 or 2000sqcm front wings, 80cm fuselage, 90cm Mast & Fanatic 5ft 68L Sky Solbach proto board.  SUP: SIC Bullet 16ft, Naish Mana 8í6Ē, Fanatic 6í3Ē wave SUP hydrofoil. Qb paddles

Julie_Scheyer

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #23 on: June 19, 2019, 11:51:15 AM »
more 3M wings than they have people on the list.

Here is a video of Ken Winner 190lb riding a 3m in the gorge gusty 28avg.   This day Dan and Rod thought it was too windy for their 4m, so didnít even go.  The 3m was too big for me this day but didnít have a 2m in the gorge. I think most people their will want a 3m if they want to ride 25+ which is when itís the most fun.



Here is me a less windy day on a 3m too.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2019, 12:08:41 PM by Julie_Scheyer »
Duotone Foilwing rider.  Hydrofoil setup for Foilwings: Fanatic 1500 or 2000sqcm front wings, 80cm fuselage, 90cm Mast & Fanatic 5ft 68L Sky Solbach proto board.  SUP: SIC Bullet 16ft, Naish Mana 8í6Ē, Fanatic 6í3Ē wave SUP hydrofoil. Qb paddles

PonoBill

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #24 on: June 19, 2019, 12:11:07 PM »
Very cool Julie. It's blowing pretty hard today, so I'll be able to try it out as soon as I get my hands on it. I'm making the bits to do two carbon booms. They'll be very light but should be strong enough. I'm using paddle shafts instead of the smaller diameter, thicker carbon usually used for windsurfing booms. I don't think that much strength is necessary--we'll soon know if I'm wrong. I didn't get the specs for the boom, so I'm kind of flying blind until the parts show up. Let me know if you or Ken sent the specs, my spam filter is fairly aggressive. Absent some big surprise they'll be tested and ready when you guys get here.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2019, 12:23:51 PM by PonoBill »
Ponohouse is for sale: http://www.ponohouse.com
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #25 on: June 19, 2019, 12:59:15 PM »
OK ,one question.  I have seen a couple of videos now where the guys are pumping the wing and trying to get the foil going.  I get that from windsurfing to get a little extra air.  But wouldn't it be better to just hold the wing and pump the foil.

You need flow over the foil to make it work. Just pulling the foil up and down does nothing without forward motion. So you need both. The wing sail making some forward motion, then the foil will doing something when you pump it. The more forward motion you make with the wing sail, the easier the foil will be to pump, and the more effective foil pumping will be.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #26 on: June 19, 2019, 03:57:40 PM »

Hi Dwight,  He looks like he is keeping the nose of his board dipped slightly down and then if it starts to dive he makes a little back foot adjustment rises back up a bit and then back to that dipped position.  Maybe not?

What youíre seeing is a SUP being driven hard and fast by the wing sail. That makes it ride nose low. Lower than youíd see in normal paddle surfing with a foil.

The reason is that foil designers set wing and fuselage angles of attack so that boards ride level at target speeds. Ride too slow and the nose will ride high. Ride too fast and the nose will ride low (because the front wing has to take a lower angle of attack at high speed). Riders with hand-held wings can force their boards to higher speeds than a surfer will normally manage (at least after the drop), so it's not uncommon to see the nose of the wind-powered SUP or surf foil board riding lower than you would expect.

If there's a mismatch between rider weight and front wing size -- i.e, the rider is light and the wing is big -- the board's nose will ride more noticeably low at high speed. If the rider is heavy and the wing is small, the board may ride nose up at all but high speed.

There are other complicating factors (like back wing loading at high speed), but that's the essence of it.

ninja tuna

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #27 on: June 19, 2019, 04:28:16 PM »
Thank you for the explanations Pono and Dwight.

Looking at the video Dwight posted  on page 1 a little bit more.  I know the water is mixed up and there is some cross chop in the video.  But the guy looks like he his trying to take off going upwind rather than starting cross wind or downwind and then turning upwind.  What it looks like to me anyways.

PonoBill

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #28 on: June 19, 2019, 06:17:00 PM »
Downwind doesn't work for taking off. As soon as you start moving your speed is subtracted from the wind speed so the wing gets less power. And the wing doesn't like being used as a sail, so if you want it to behave well you need to reverse it so the leading edge is facing you. More than a bit clumsy, but that's how people are downwinding with the wings. I think a broad reach will be almost as ineffective.

Close hauled will give you the highest apparent speed across the wing and the most lift when the contraption first starts moving, but I don't think the guy flopping around is really trying to achieve that. I think the people in the videos that are pumping away when they are barely moving are just trying too hard to get up too early. I got up on what I think was pretty much a beam reach--with the wind at 90 degrees to the board and wind. As soon as I got up the board kind of went more upwind on autopilot.
Ponohouse is for sale: http://www.ponohouse.com
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #29 on: June 20, 2019, 04:03:01 AM »
Iím sure wing foiling is closer to windsurf foiling, than kitesurf foiling.

I windsurf foil a huge surf wing. I have to pump to get going most of the time. The pump is identical to regular windsurfing. A tick off beam reach is ideal.

Where foiling differs from regular windsurfing, is once up on foil, you want to make sure you had enough forward speed when you pop up to stay up and stay stable. A premature pop up (not enough flow across the wing) will make a beginner crash. A good foiler will continue to pump while airborne, if need.

Also, once up, a foil loves to go upwind and that makes it power up massively. So quick, and with so much power, it will shock you. Donít panic, just head off the wind and the power is gone. I always tell my wife, donít worry if the wind nukes once youíre out foiling, you can always ride downwind until it is all gone. A windsurf foiler  can foil downwind at angles you would not believe. As close to a wing surfer as you can get. Probably 170 degrees. I just hold the sail across the board and surf the foil.

« Last Edit: June 20, 2019, 04:06:17 AM by Dwight (DW) »