Author Topic: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?  (Read 9610 times)

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Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« on: May 31, 2019, 03:42:08 AM »
For those interested in how light of a wind you might be able to foil in, check this out.  This is zero whitecaps on a 4 meter wing.  Sub 10 for sure, and he is pointing.  Also a good showing of pumping up onto a foil in ultra light conditions.  Pretty much what you would imagine for super light wind wave foiling.  That is for sure possible.  Very impressive. 

« Last Edit: May 31, 2019, 03:52:39 AM by Admin »

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2019, 04:10:53 AM »
Same Dude, slightly more wind.  He is cranking in still mellow, just capping wind speeds (15?).  He is staying switch footed for full reaches on port.  Stoked to see that!  The less footwork the better for me, and none sound just fine :).  Our wings are shipping this week.  Wooohooo.  Hoping hard that we can pick up the basics of foiling.  It is great to see that these things look prime for these light conditions.  Here in the Gorge, all of the windsurfing beaches without easy kite launches (basically all of the beaches :)) are empty in these conditions.





« Last Edit: June 02, 2019, 04:15:33 AM by Admin »

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2019, 04:18:56 AM »
PS:  Question for you experienced foilers.  He looks like he is trimming the board to be slightly downhill when he is reaching comfortably.  Is that a thing?

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2019, 06:44:17 AM »
PS:  Question for you experienced foilers.  He looks like he is trimming the board to be slightly downhill when he is reaching comfortably.  Is that a thing?

What does downhill mean? Downwind or riding down the wave face?

Anyway, Iíll ramble on what you might be seeing. You have to exert lots of effort to break free of the water, pumping the sail, or wing, and the board. Then once airborne, the last thing you want, is to have to do all that work again! So your first priority once up, let the speed build, then your stable and the safe flying margin is better for not dropping off foil. So then it becomes a game of reading the conditions and keeping the speed up and wave energy working for you. At this point you can actually stay airborne at much lower wind speeds, but you really have to be alert and keep using that wave energy wisely. The last thing you want, is to do all that hard work again to get airborne.

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2019, 08:38:05 AM »
PS:  Question for you experienced foilers.  He looks like he is trimming the board to be slightly downhill when he is reaching comfortably.  Is that a thing?
What does downhill mean? Downwind or riding down the wave face?

Hi Dwight,  He looks like he is keeping the nose of his board dipped slightly down and then if it starts to dive he makes a little back foot adjustment rises back up a bit and then back to that dipped position.  Maybe not?

PonoBill

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2019, 10:35:19 AM »
Down for speed, up for height. You'll have a fairly easy time of this since you're a snowboarder. Front foot pressure keeps the foil under control by varying the angle of attack. An increased angle of attack gives a little more lift, but a lot more drag. If you're not trying to increase height you're generally trimming the wing flat or slightly down to get the speed up. The height above the water and your speed are where you're storing energy. Higher and faster means you can go longer if you run out of energy or if you want to turn.
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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2019, 11:03:44 AM »
Down for speed, up for height. You'll have a fairly easy time of this since you're a snowboarder. Front foot pressure keeps the foil under control by varying the angle of attack. An increased angle of attack gives a little more lift, but a lot more drag. If you're not trying to increase height you're generally trimming the wing flat or slightly down to get the speed up. The height above the water and your speed are where you're storing energy. Higher and faster means you can go longer if you run out of energy or if you want to turn.

Cool.  Thanks guys.  So, I am understanding that you can change the foil angle up or down a bit without following that angle?  That is how it appears but my mind does not grasp that. Or is it a series of mellow adjustments that I am not picking up on?

PonoBill

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2019, 11:23:04 AM »
Yes to the former. The wing is flying. In many respects it's just like an airplane--you don't make an airplane climb by pointing the nose up, you make it climb by opening the throttle. Foilers violate that all the time with pumping and popping the nose up to get the board up in a wave, but it's only a momentary thing. If you hold that pose too long the wing loses speed and stalls. Conversely if you have the angle of attack sharply negative, you will drive it down, but you'll be going very fast when you do. A little gentle downward tilt increases speed, decreases drag, and can wind up lifting you higher if you continue getting some kind of energy input--wave, sail, kite or wing. It's one of the reasons why kite foilers often seem to be tiptoeing around. It's relatively easy to outspeed the kite and get slack strings if it's high above you in something close to the neutral position. Same thing happens in a wave. If you catch a good sized wave and trim the foil so it won't overfoil and toss you, you have to turn right away or your speed will get you into the flats before you can react.
Ponohouse is for sale: http://www.ponohouse.com
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2019, 11:33:59 AM »
Yes to the former. The wing is flying. In many respects it's just like an airplane--you don't make an airplane climb by pointing the nose up, you make it climb by opening the throttle. Foilers violate that all the time with pumping and popping the nose up to get the board up in a wave, but it's only a momentary thing. If you hold that pose too long the wing loses speed and stalls. Conversely if you have the angle of attack sharply negative, you will drive it down, but you'll be going very fast when you do. A little gentle downward tilt increases speed, decreases drag, and can wind up lifting you higher if you continue getting some kind of energy input--wave, sail, kite or wing. It's one of the reasons why kite foilers often seem to be tiptoeing around. It's relatively easy to outspeed the kite and get slack strings if it's high above you in something close to the neutral position. Same thing happens in a wave. If you catch a good sized wave and trim the foil so it won't overfoil and toss you, you have to turn right away or your speed will get you into the flats before you can react.

Ooooh!  I have a lot to learn.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2019, 12:21:53 PM »
To further mess with your head.... >:(

I sometimes see guys riding along forcing the foil to fly instead of letting it fly. Powering along nose high, forcing it to fly near stall. Then sometimes you see the opposite. Itís whacky.

You really, really, should fly strapless to learn to feel the wing and learn to fly it with foot placement. Giving the wing what it wants at all times. Maximizing lift/drag and efficiency. When you truly understand trim and maximize the wing like a pro, add your straps if you want. Just donít get trapped into fixed feet and forcing a foil to fly out of ideal trim.

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2019, 12:31:57 PM »
This could be you soon Admin.  ;D

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #11 on: June 02, 2019, 01:33:29 PM »
This could be you soon Admin.  ;D


I imagine there will be a long period of that and worse :).  I'm just stoked to let the sucking begin.

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2019, 02:40:47 PM »
my worse nightmare and it's hard enough with the foil  :o ;D

PonoBill

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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #13 on: June 03, 2019, 06:09:58 AM »
That very well could have been me. We started out on the biggest windsurfer I've ever seen. I could barely carry it. On my knees, flying the wing, wobbling out to the reef and back, doing the walk of shame.
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Re: Wingsurf Foiling - How low a Windspeed is possible?
« Reply #14 on: June 18, 2019, 03:18:49 PM »

Wrong thread
« Last Edit: June 18, 2019, 03:21:59 PM by Fishman »
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