Author Topic: The business of Skiing  (Read 2669 times)

Wetstuff

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The business of Skiing
« on: April 02, 2019, 10:01:24 AM »
I have not done in years .. the local shop closed maybe 8yrs ago .. two local surf/kite couples still ski - one pair, retired UPS driver and teacher wife, go to Killington VT for the winter: he's an 'Ambassador', she teaches at Killington School.  ..the other couple, retired Chiro and Siemens exec., spend a month in Utah.  My grandson teaches snowboarding at Big Bear for coin on weekends.

Business Week had a really interesting piece on the change in the landscape.  I hope it's clear enough to read. 

Jim

...looks like I have to do multiple posts?





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Wetstuff

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #1 on: April 02, 2019, 10:01:58 AM »
Page 2

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Wetstuff

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2019, 10:02:51 AM »
3.  (maybe click to enlarge?)

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Wetstuff

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2019, 11:52:33 AM »
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Dusk Patrol

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2019, 01:17:40 PM »
Vail Resorts bought Whistler which was my go to splurge, then raised the already steep ticket prices and altered the 3 and 5 day passes available to kama'aina Washington neighbors.. then VR bought one of Seattle's little local places (Stevens Pass) and raised the price to $102. It seems like some line has been crossed.    Of mine at least.    Maybe that line is 'crankiness due to age'  : )
« Last Edit: April 02, 2019, 01:24:13 PM by Dusk Patrol »
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eastbound

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2019, 01:32:39 PM »
day pass at vail is 210$

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2019, 02:03:18 PM »
day pass at vail is 210$

Makes one realize how swollen the economy is with money...  problem is the differential access to it. 
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digger71

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2019, 02:28:18 PM »
Expensive if you are only skiing 1 or 2 days a year but the new model is GREAT for someone who plans to go 10+ days in a season.  I get the Ikon Base pass for $619 ($30 renewal discount) for near unlimited* days at Mammoth and Big Bear locally, and the chance to go to many other resorts in CO and UT for multiple days for no additional cost.  Far cheaper than what a season pass to a single mountain used to be.

* maybe 10 blackout dates per season

Tom

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2019, 04:11:07 PM »
I've had a season pass to Mammoth for 10 or 15 years. At first it was Mammoth and June only, then it included Big Bear and Snow Summit with small discounts at a few random resorts. It was usually priced so that you'd break even if you went 6 to 9 days a year. My bonus was after I became 65 years old it was $400 unlimited when single day tickets went for up to $150. Last year they started the Ikon pass with no senior discount, $650. This gives you 12 unlimited (except for some blackout days) and 5 days at 25 destinations. The Ikon is good for some, not so much for others.

 I only board at Mammoth so was happier with the $400 senior pass, but it's still a pretty good deal for me. Those that live in Mammoth and only ski there are pissed. Some of my friends went on trips to Aspen, Alta, and Brighton and they all said the locals there were pretty pissed that all the new Ikon skiers are showing up at their spots.

I've also heard from the local businesses that during the blackout weekends, they staff up but no one shows up.

Wetstuff

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #9 on: April 03, 2019, 06:29:44 AM »
Here's part of an email from my friend, Dottie...

"We bought SnowBasin passes this year and next.  This year they are part of a different group of resorts (The Mountain Collective). Next year they have an agreement with Epic.
   
We had a good trip, wore the crap out of ourselves, only skipped 3 of 27 days. Didnít do much else.  Ski, happy hour ( a LOT of tailgating since lodge beers are 9.50), hot tub, dinner in jammies by 6:30 or so, early crash.  We had nice lunches on the mountain, but only went out to dinner ONCE. Well twice, the last night at SLC airport hotel we had to buy dinner before early flight.   Hope to do it again."

....'chit - I'm tired thinking about it.  Beer - $9.50?

Jim
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RideTheGlide

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #10 on: April 03, 2019, 07:35:18 AM »
Gone are the days of dorm style rooms in the basement at Aspen Highlands (I think that's where we were). When I lived in Denver, I went to a lot of the smaller resorts for not much at all. One year a little place called Ski Cooper did a deal where you got a half day of snow cat skiing and a half day lift ticket for $30. It was only for a short period to get the word out. A buddy and I went and got several runs through untouched belly button deep powder. Amazing deal. Nothing like that these days. One year I got a season pass at a very small resort - Berthoud Pass - for $8. They only sold them the first few days of the season to CO residents. Every time you went, you had to get in line for a lift ticket and show your CO driver's license with a matching name and they would record that you had gotten one for that day. The idea is that you would bring friends and spend money in the lodge.
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digger71

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #11 on: April 03, 2019, 10:36:42 AM »
Interesting article with some historical prices
https://www.skiinghistory.org/news/many-cost-going-uphill-going-down

Tom - I've heard the same about locals not liking the crowds.  Jackson Hole locals in particular were not happy.  Of course very many ski town locals make their living around tourism so there's that...

lucabrasi

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #12 on: April 03, 2019, 01:33:35 PM »
I've had a season pass to Mammoth for 10 or 15 years. At first it was Mammoth and June only, then it included Big Bear and Snow Summit with small discounts at a few random resorts. It was usually priced so that you'd break even if you went 6 to 9 days a year. My bonus was after I became 65 years old it was $400 unlimited when single day tickets went for up to $150. Last year they started the Ikon pass with no senior discount, $650. This gives you 12 unlimited (except for some blackout days) and 5 days at 25 destinations. The Ikon is good for some, not so much for others.

 I only board at Mammoth so was happier with the $400 senior pass, but it's still a pretty good deal for me. Those that live in Mammoth and only ski there are pissed. Some of my friends went on trips to Aspen, Alta, and Brighton and they all said the locals there were pretty pissed that all the new Ikon skiers are showing up at their spots.

I've also heard from the local businesses that during the blackout weekends, they staff up but no one shows up.
Interesting article with some historical prices
https://www.skiinghistory.org/news/many-cost-going-uphill-going-down

Tom - I've heard the same about locals not liking the crowds.  Jackson Hole locals in particular were not happy.  Of course very many ski town locals make their living around tourism so there's that...
I just get a season pass every August figuring it's like tearing a bandaid off. It usually pays for itself but damn if I going to show up and shell out that much money every time I want to ride the lifts. If I didn't have the pass I wouldn't go as much, I am sure of that. The price of daily and half day tickets has gotten so much it pays for itself every time anymore and it's downright scary walking up to the window and dropping that much every time. 
Yeah, it really ramped up the crowds this year (jh), amazingly so. Just a zoo at times, lines, parking, on the mountain, etc. It was like Presidents weekend mid week in March and weekends really blew out while the traditionally busy times seemed the same or even down some. I think the numbers from what they predicted to what actually showed up were like double or more while everyplace that employs is pretty much understaffed to start with so lots of stress. They reupped for a few years as well. Ikon Pass. Not a fan of that many riders on the mountain at once zooming every which way. Many obviously out of control and throw that in with the high speed and just plain quad lifts able to put so many on the mountain at once and it's quite the scene.
The Ikon pass is really quite a deal tho from what I gather and actually since I am not "in town" every day anymore I was going to check it out myself.
Tourism is the life blood and if they didn't come.......it's a cruel double edged sword.
Snowbasin is quite the place.
Did Heavenly last year. Half day $125 walking up to the window. A Guiness was $16 on the mountain. Owch, and then it took about 5 minutes to get a lift ticket cuz they wanted so much info so I could "be in the system".

eastbound

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #13 on: April 03, 2019, 02:33:35 PM »
alta was 6 bux when i lived at parley's summit for a year some 39 years ago

alta is still a decent deal--fly in to slc--take a cab up little cottonwood (no rentacar) and stay at peruvian or goldminers--took my kids and cranky first wife there twice yearly for some 15 years--thankfully she stopped coming after a few--and then i lost her--nuther thkfully
no snowboards---sorry

not cheap, but my favorite lift-serviced skiing, and way cheap compared to most other options--vail? no thanks--overrun with newly moneyed folk who chose vail that year instead of vegas or disney--mountain experience?? nope -- money experience
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cnski

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Re: The business of Skiing
« Reply #14 on: April 03, 2019, 06:04:20 PM »
This season has been fantastic at Alta snowwise but the Ikon pass has really affected the experience. All the locals are up in arms much like the Jackson Hole locals. Passholders are writing letters to management left and right. I bet Alta will not be part of it after their contract expires after next season. It's just not the Alta experience. And management knows it. Lifties are saying that 30-40% of the skiers getting on the chair are Ikon passholders. It has changed the game for sure. Totally noticable from last season. It's just plain awful and the traffic up and down little cottonwood canyon is monumental. It certainly has not been an Ikonic experience for locals. I've been a passholder in that canyon all my life and put in 70+ days there this season with over 1,000,000 vertical feet skied.  I then left to start a new job in Rhode Island. I now live one block from the beach. I come home after work and walk my kite stuff down to the water to finish the day. I can tell my quality of life will be better with my new arrangement. I'm sure come next December I will be wishing I was home. My vacation time will be spent skiing Alta and being with friends and family. Maybe I need an Ikon pass now. Great.