Poll

This is a uniquely informed and diverse group to survey on any question, most definitely this one.  At this point, for whom would you cast your ballot?

Trump
19 (46.3%)
Biden
9 (22%)
Sanders
8 (19.5%)
Booker
4 (9.8%)
Klobuchar
1 (2.4%)

Total Members Voted: 41

Voting closed: March 21, 2019, 04:39:47 PM

Author Topic: 2020 Vision  (Read 44565 times)

RideTheGlide

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #525 on: April 12, 2019, 05:59:53 AM »
On previous surgeries, I enjoyed the opioids a little overmuch, so after my recent one (shoulder scope), I didn't get them. It really wasn't that bad. Yes, I think the drug industry is convincing us that we should never have to deal with anything there if there is a pill to make it more comfortable. And while I take responsibility for my issues with the painkillers, I have had experience with lots of other things over the course of many years and nothing else had that kind of pull. I was able to pull out of the dive but I completely understand why not everyone does. Opioids should be a last resort for severe pain and patients should be closely monitored, IMO. But they were giving them out like candy.
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Bean

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #526 on: April 12, 2019, 08:44:20 AM »
For pain management, as you intimated RTG, opioids could be a complete disaster.

But modern opioids still have their place, are very effective in anesthesia where the patient is put out and brought back relatively quickly and the patient is not left with the memory imprint of the intense euphoria.  This was made possible in the 60's with a very fast acting synthetic opioid (fentanyl), that is 40-50 times more powerful than Heroin.

The irony is that the current opioid crisis in the US is fueled by the influx of pharmaceutical grade fentanyl, which is smuggled into the US from China through Mexico and and to a much lesser degree, Canada.  You can't lab your own fentanyl here in the US for the cost of ready made product, that's how inexpensive it is...

eastbound

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #527 on: April 12, 2019, 12:07:55 PM »
i can tell, after a few pain management episodes where i used opioids, that i am wired to be addicted.

i am definitely not one of those folk who say "they dont do anything but make me nauseous"---they make me feel gooooood, and they make me not care a whit about anything unpleasant--bad recipe.

ill stick to the green, thks,  with a minimal sprinkling of alcohol

if/when i get my hip replaced, i will use gingerly, if at all
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PonoBill

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #528 on: April 12, 2019, 10:34:20 PM »
Nope, not at all. I don't have a particular bent towards addiction. If I did I'd be sleeping in an alley somewhere or long dead. I did about everything I could think of in the 60's and 70's. But I don't do painkillers after surgery. Advil takes the edge off, the rest is just a matter of pushing it down. I took a Vicodin once after a particularly long and complicated shoulder surgery. I didn't like it, and the pain seemed worse when it wore off. I don't necessarily recommend that course to other people, but I'm better off without pain killers of any serious kind. I've even cut my use of Advil for minor muscle pain way back to almost nothing.
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Area 10

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #529 on: April 13, 2019, 04:48:29 AM »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-47917900

Hahaha! Little Rocket Man outplays the spray-tan Imperial Kleagle yet again. Now it’s the US’s fault that no denuclearisation has taken place. The US has the “wrong attitude” and is not serious in its intent. But Donnie is lovely anyway...

Well played, you blubbersome despot. Although it must be like playing chess with a blindfolded donkey.

PonoBill

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #530 on: April 13, 2019, 12:58:28 PM »
An insult to Donkeys everywhere.
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RideTheGlide

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #531 on: April 13, 2019, 02:07:05 PM »
For pain management, as you intimated RTG, opioids could be a complete disaster.

But modern opioids still have their place, are very effective in anesthesia where the patient is put out and brought back relatively quickly and the patient is not left with the memory imprint of the intense euphoria.  This was made possible in the 60's with a very fast acting synthetic opioid (fentanyl), that is 40-50 times more powerful than Heroin.

The irony is that the current opioid crisis in the US is fueled by the influx of pharmaceutical grade fentanyl, which is smuggled into the US from China through Mexico and and to a much lesser degree, Canada.  You can't lab your own fentanyl here in the US for the cost of ready made product, that's how inexpensive it is...

"the memory imprint of the intense euphoria" - that's a good technical description of "a fleeting glimpse, out of the corner of my eye". Some people shrug it off and some of us go "Holy shit!" and while I was never the best behaved child in class, I don't think it is purely flawed character that pulled me in (though it likely contributed).
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Area 10

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #532 on: April 13, 2019, 04:36:14 PM »
If Trump was the leader of my country I’d be abusing fentanyl as well :)

Mind you, we aren’t doing much better right now, so I guess that people in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones... recently, our Parliament has been like a private school debating society meeting held after a pub crawl.


« Last Edit: April 13, 2019, 04:40:29 PM by Area 10 »

spirit4earth

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #533 on: April 13, 2019, 04:53:50 PM »
Area 10, I think the UK is in the same dire straits that the US is in.  I do think this is crisis time, indeed.

eastbound

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #534 on: April 14, 2019, 05:52:58 PM »
mainstreaming of opioid addiction in the usa is courtesy of the sackler family and their their huge US pharma corp, manufacturer and aggressive fraudulent marketer of oxycontin, purdue pharma

there have always been illegal opioids like heroin and fentanyl

sackler/purdue, with all their lawyers and lobbyists, and the aggressive lying marketing, and manufacture and distribution of ridiculous quantities of such an obviously addictive dangerous drug as oxycontin, is why we are where we are today
« Last Edit: April 14, 2019, 06:26:35 PM by eastbound »
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mrbig

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #535 on: April 14, 2019, 06:00:00 PM »
+1 Eastie. Massive doses of Oxy for chronic lower back pain. Really?
Let it come to you..
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Rider

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #536 on: April 14, 2019, 07:14:09 PM »
Does anybody believe in personal responsibility anymore?
« Last Edit: April 15, 2019, 04:14:26 AM by Admin »

eastbound

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #537 on: April 15, 2019, 02:37:23 AM »
i sure do--and hopefully the courts hold the sackler family personally responsible for the damage theyve done to thousands of Americans---lawsuits are in play now--it's via discovery in those suits thsat we know the sackler family knew very well of what it was doing
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Bean

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #538 on: April 15, 2019, 07:30:42 AM »
Let the lawsuits fall where they may, but there is plenty of blame to go around for the US opiod crisis.  It all comes down to understanding why individuals feel the need to self-medicate.

Maybe it's time we look at the Swiss model here in the US...get the drugs out of the courtroom and into a clinical setting.




eastbound

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #539 on: April 15, 2019, 08:01:57 AM »
or portugal, where theyve had huge success reducing rates of drug abuse---after they decriminalized all forms of drug use

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/22/opinion/sunday/portugal-drug-decriminalization.html

https://transformdrugs.org/drug-decriminalisation-in-portugal-setting-the-record-straight/

or colorado where opioid use has declined markedly, after the legalization of rec cannabis use.....

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/04/02/598787768/opioid-use-lower-in-states-that-eased-marijuana-laws

https://drugabuse.com/legalizing-marijuana-decreases-fatal-opiate-overdoses/

the war on drugs has been a war on our own young people--a total failure by any measure--and certainly a failure for the families who've been damaged by incarceration of non-violent drug abusing family members

but hey we are the most aggressive jailers of our own.........
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