Poll

This is a uniquely informed and diverse group to survey on any question, most definitely this one.  At this point, for whom would you cast your ballot?

Trump
19 (46.3%)
Biden
9 (22%)
Sanders
8 (19.5%)
Booker
4 (9.8%)
Klobuchar
1 (2.4%)

Total Members Voted: 41

Voting closed: March 21, 2019, 04:39:47 PM

Author Topic: 2020 Vision  (Read 124077 times)

jpeter

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #750 on: May 01, 2019, 11:02:25 AM »
....a nd do was Comey

...and Jeff Sessions.  The whole group has been Republican.  If you didn't like these investigations the logical choice would be vote Democrat.

Sometimes I forget that Trump just woke up one morning and decided to investigate himself. 

I'm done with beating my head against the wall.   

Admin

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #751 on: May 01, 2019, 12:32:30 PM »
He didn't decide to investigate himself.  He tried everything he could to prevent it.  He just couldn't find anyone to appoint that was corrupt enough not to initiate the investigation. 

Area 10

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #752 on: May 01, 2019, 12:45:48 PM »
....a nd do was Comey

...and Jeff Sessions.  The whole group has been Republican.  If you didn't like these investigations the logical choice would be vote Democrat.

Sometimes I forget that Trump just woke up one morning and decided to investigate himself. 

I'm done with beating my head against the wall.
Try reading Fear: Trump in the White House by Bob Woodward. Trump is regarded as too corrupt, erratic and ill-informed to be entrusted with the safety of the US, by even his own people.

https://www.amazon.com/Fear-Trump-White-Bob-Woodward/dp/1501175513

There was a case to answer: That’s why he was investigated. It was an example of your democratic system working very properly, as part of the necessary checks and balances to try to ensure that you don’t end up with some mad dictator as POTUS. You should be celebrating that you live in a country where that can happen. If Trump was given free rein, you wouldn’t be.

PonoBill

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #753 on: May 02, 2019, 11:48:21 AM »
media??--some is crap--fox breitbart etc--but national review, wash post, ny times wsj, npr--these are credible entities that consider good fact checking critical to their reporting, and their brand--and they lean both ways politically, but they value facts and accurate reporting

Don't be so sure, media slant is automatic, even from sources that do attempt to be factual. But as far as the nature of the Mueller investigation goes, the facts are readily available--it certainly was a Republican investigation. Trump had to fire a raft of republicans he appointed, and get the the bottom of the barrel (Barr) to finally force it to a close.

As a lifelong Republican (50+ years) I consider it a little glimmer of responsibility and integrity from a party that has otherwise disappointed me greatly.
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pdxmike

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #754 on: May 02, 2019, 09:16:51 PM »
Here's one of several similar charts about media bias:


https://www.adfontesmedia.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Media-Bias-Chart_4.0_8_28_2018-min.jpg


This one has left-to-right bias left to right, and false-to-factual bottom to top.  Always the possibility it's biased itself.

eastbound

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #755 on: May 03, 2019, 03:25:42 AM »
cool chart, tho, as you say, the chartmakers themselves risk being biased

placements are consistent with what id expect, tho with some interesting surprises

a good add to the chart would be the nielson ratings or some measure of extent of consumption---like FOX is likely the most heavily consumed by far, among all the fact=challenged--whereas the mainstream, more centrist media, that is also heavily consumed is way less fact-challenged---kinda validates what ive been saying
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 03:28:37 AM by eastbound »
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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #756 on: May 03, 2019, 03:28:44 AM »
Were I compiling an infographic there would be two factors. 

1. Do you know the political leanings of the anchors/writers?  If so, to what degree does that color the content?
2. How well are the opposing views represented?

I watch CNN (among others) and there is no way that they can be viewed as Neutral or in any part Neutral.  It is very us vs them.  I am part of the us but I still dislike that fact.

eastbound

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #757 on: May 03, 2019, 03:30:52 AM »
whatever the case, cnn is way less fact-challenged than fox

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #758 on: May 03, 2019, 04:07:59 AM »
whatever the case, cnn is way less fact-challenged than fox

I agree with that.  But they are in no part neutral. 

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #759 on: May 03, 2019, 04:23:03 AM »
There will always be bias - even if it is only in what events are covered, rather than how. That is an error of omission. But the real worry are the errors of commission made by some (mostly newer) outlets, especially digital media, where there seems to be little or no penalty for spreading falsehoods. I imagine that in time, each democracy will have to develop codes of conduct for *all* media outlets that are backed by serious financial, and perhaps criminal, penalties for knowingly passing on information that is untrue. If the members in a democracy do not have a common fact base to refer to, or can’t believe anything they hear or read, it will fundamentally undermine that democracy.

This recognition is probably what is behind Russia’s recent mooted changes to their internet system, as they anticipate a retaliation from the West for their interferences in the democratic process. In this way, this is going to be more a matter of defence and security rather than politics.

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #760 on: May 03, 2019, 04:47:57 AM »

eastbound

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #761 on: May 03, 2019, 05:30:03 AM »
whatever the case, cnn is way less fact-challenged than fox

I agree with that.  But they are in no part neutral.

agree cnn and all news sources lean, but they dont lie and stretch the truth to anywhere near the extent of FOX, in support of their leanings

and breitbart??  these sources feed their garbage to millions of americans

daily kos?  might have a couple thousand daily readers

whatever the case, excellent chart
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paddlinglass

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #762 on: May 03, 2019, 09:53:44 AM »
"I watch CNN (among others) and there is no way that they can be viewed as Neutral or in any part Neutral.  It is very us vs them.  I am part of the us but I still dislike that fact."

They've got you--and millions of others--duped, Admin.
CNN is "us vs them, but the "us" is the establishment/ruling elite and "them" is the rest of the population.
And until the majority of people start viewing candidates, policies and elections in terms of the establishment vs the people,
as opposed of Dem vs Repub, power will remain in the hands of corporations and the 1% instead of the people, where it belongs.

Just one example of how CNN (and all msm) is on the side of the ruling class:  why do you think Biden is promoted so heavily over Bernie?
And why was Bernie so ignored in 2016?

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #763 on: May 03, 2019, 10:13:58 AM »
Just one example of how CNN (and all msm) is on the side of the ruling class:  why do you think Biden is promoted so heavily over Bernie?
And why was Bernie so ignored in 2016?

Biden was polling well ahead of Bernie before he ever announced.  There was surprisingly little positive coverage (or coverage at all) of Biden before he announced.  More hair sniffing stuff than anything else.  It would be a huge stretch to say that Biden's support is Media based.  Biden's support is very simply Trump based.

eastbound

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Re: 2020 Vision
« Reply #764 on: May 03, 2019, 11:46:02 AM »
and biden over bernie? so be it--but cnn makes legit effort to make its case with checked facts, not lies---therein lies the difference
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