Author Topic: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads  (Read 5501 times)

StarboardSUPMan

  • Malibu Status
  • **
  • Posts: 55
    • View Profile
    • Email
Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« on: December 03, 2018, 06:18:48 PM »
I'm having a issues with my wider tailed board sliding out on my on bottom turns and hard turns in general.  I recently got a smaller more performance oriented board for bigger better days.  It has a thruster fin setup and really got me to lay into my bottom turns.  Then when I returned to riding my wide tail board I found I would slide the tail out if I put the same pressure to turn the performance board.  I've got a Future Controller Quad setup on the board.  I find I have to feather my turns on my wide tail board to keep drive and hold.  I can only put about 75% of what I  want to to keep from sliding out.  As I keep progressing and getting better I'm wondering is this just a characteristic of wide tail boards?  Should I switch my board over to a thruster setup instead, or is there a quad setup that will provide better hold?

The wide tail board is 7'4" x 32" Custom board.  The performance board is a 8'4" x 28 Lokahi Custom Pro.

Here are some pics of the boards trying to determine the difference.  Wide tail board the front fins are 20" apart, rears are 15" apart.  On my performance board the fronts are 15" apart.  The wide tail has a fin depth of 4.5" while the performance has 4.75".  Overall I have a lot more fin area on the wide tail board which I thought would give me the hold I need.















mrbig

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2465
    • View Profile
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2018, 07:44:30 PM »
It looks like the fins on the blue board are very close together which would increase looseness and instability.

Am a quad dude and will use a nubster if things get too funky..
« Last Edit: December 03, 2018, 08:07:20 PM by mrbig »
Let it come to you..
SMIK 9'2" Hipster Mini Mal
SMIK 8'8" Short Mac Freo Rainbow Bridge
SMIK 8'4" Hipster Twin
King's 8'2" Accelerator SharkBoy

jarvissup

  • Rincon Status
  • ***
  • Posts: 228
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2018, 03:51:50 AM »
I was a JP team rider when the JP Slate came out in 2015 they sent them out with a quad set up. The Slate had the, exact, problem you're having when run as a quad. Guys from here to Australia were putting trying 5 fin set ups' Nubsters etc. I found it worked best as a Thruster, and in 2016 they started sending them out with a Thruster set up and marketing it as a board to be run with Thrusters. It was so much better as a Thruster there was even talk of only putting 3 fin boxes in the Slates so folks woudn't mess them up with a bunch of fins....true story.

Dwight (DW)

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 4780
    • View Profile
    • supSURFmachines
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2018, 03:59:55 AM »
Quads can be made to work with wide tails, if the shaper makes the effort to find the right fin placement. Unfortunately just doing what you’ve always done on little boards doesn’t apply. So you end up with quads that don’t work and there is no fin combination that can fix bad placement.

madeinsantacruz

  • Malibu Status
  • **
  • Posts: 91
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2018, 05:50:11 AM »
Throw a fifth fin in that center box and move it all the way back.  I'd try a nubster first.  If it still feels too slippery on bottom turns then try a smaller shortboard center fin.

Bean

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 4212
    • View Profile
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2018, 06:39:16 AM »
... I recently got a smaller more performance oriented board for bigger better days.  It has a thruster fin setup and really got me to lay into my bottom turns.  Then when I returned to riding my wide tail board I found I would slide the tail out if I put the same pressure to turn the performance board. 

How is your rear foot placement?  I have to remind myself, a little further back and a little closer to the rail, every time I ride my mini-simmons.

Badger

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2662
  • Seacoast NH
    • View Profile
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2018, 07:06:22 AM »
How much do you weigh? Rider weight plays a major role in how fins behave.
Kalama E3 6'1 x 23" 105L
Axis HPS 980 / PNG 1300
Sunova Flow  8'10 X 31"  119L
Me - 6'0" - 165lbs - 66yo

SUP Sports ®

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 3216
  • Stoked For Life ®
    • View Profile
    • SUP Sports ®
    • Email
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2018, 08:14:06 AM »
Throw a fifth fin in that center box and move it all the way back.  I'd try a nubster first.  If it still feels too slippery on bottom turns then try a smaller shortboard center fin.

Ditto...this works on all of our wide tail designed boards...
I've designed two StubNubs that work very well...2.25" and 3.19"...but, I also build 4" and 5" centers for bigger guys and tri-fin riders...

https://supsports.com/sup-fins

...and, don't forget that your paddle is the biggest fin on your board...;-)




Mahalos...{:~)

WARDOG ®
Owner/CEO  StandUp Paddle Sports®  &   SurfingSports®.com, Inc.

(805)962-SUPS (7877) store
(888)805-9978 toll free

Retail Store:
Standup Paddle Sports, LLC
121 Santa Barbara St.
Santa Barbara, CA 93101

JimK

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2154
  • Big Guys can have fun too!
    • View Profile
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2018, 08:38:30 AM »
I'd go with a standard thruster set up or Get bigger side fins plenty of options for bigger QUADS
If you need help PM me

JimK
Extreme Windsurfing

Night Wing

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2724
  • Piney Woods of Southeast Texas
    • View Profile
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2018, 08:40:10 AM »
I'm with WarDog on his comments. Since I'm 144 lbs, with my 5 fin box, 8'11" Hammer with a wide chisel tail, I use a 2.25" nubster fin in the center box if the wave height conditions call for it when I'm sup surfing my Hammer.

When those conditions occur, I use (2, 5"), (2, 4") and (1, 2.25").
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters (2 Dukes)
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters
CJ Nelson Parallax: 9'3" x 23 1/2" x 3 3/16" @ 78.8 Liters (prone surfing longboard; Thunderbolt Technologies build in Red construction)

SlatchJim

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2614
    • View Profile
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2018, 10:20:16 AM »
Sounds like you've solved the problem on your own.  Run the board as a thruster.
There's too many variables for anyone to give you anything more than their own perspective, some valuable and some not so much.
My wife loves three fins.  I go quads or single.  Son loves thruster or 2+1 on the same board I like quads on.
Play around with set ups and go with what you like best... kinda like what you're doing already.  :D

mrbig

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2465
    • View Profile
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2018, 11:20:48 AM »
True enough. It's all about personal choice.

One observation is that many manufacturers place the center box, in a five box setup, in a location such that it is impossible to have the center in the correct location.

This leads to the observation that such and such a board doesn't work as a thruster.

Another funny looking nub for fun!
« Last Edit: December 04, 2018, 11:31:20 AM by mrbig »
Let it come to you..
SMIK 9'2" Hipster Mini Mal
SMIK 8'8" Short Mac Freo Rainbow Bridge
SMIK 8'4" Hipster Twin
King's 8'2" Accelerator SharkBoy

JEG

  • Teahupoo Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 1016
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2018, 12:22:14 PM »
either a 5th fin (nubster) or thruster.

Beasho

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 3224
    • View Profile
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2018, 01:45:10 PM »
I had this exact same response from my L41.  It was 8' 2" x 32" and the widest board I ever SUP surfed.

When turning the board on a rail the tail would also slide out. 

I realized that the WIDE tail is a huge planing surface and rides HIGH in the water.  When put on a rail a wide board will lift the outside fins out of the water very early and you effectively LOSE any resistance from those outboard fins.  The flat planing surface, unlike a pintail, just adds to the buoyant insult and everything slides away.

This became a challenge.  Hold JUST the right angle and the board would maintain speed and hold.  JUST don't go too far or it breaks free.  Eventually this was a fun and manageable game.

By no means should you expect such a wide,fat tail to lay-down into a fully carveable, shortboard style turn.     

StarboardSUPMan

  • Malibu Status
  • **
  • Posts: 55
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Wide Tail Board Sliding Out with Quads
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2018, 03:25:15 PM »
Thanks for all the responses!  I'm going to try running this board with a nubster first since I like how the board surfs with quads.  If that doesn't work I'll try the  thruster setup and see if that gets me the hold I'm looking for.  My friend has a few other quad setups so I may see if those fins are any bigger than what I've currently got in it.

I'm 175lbs, 6'2".  The board is somewhere between 120-130 Liters.  So it is a little on the big side for me.

I made sure my foot is all the way back on the board as I know that can be part of the sliding out problem.  I am not however putting my foot on the rail, I usually just move my foot straight back.  I will try putting my foot on the inside rail and see if that helps the turns as well.

The waves here in central Florida are sub par at the moment so I can't do any testing for a few days.

 


SimplePortal 2.3.7 © 2008-2024, SimplePortal