Author Topic: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!  (Read 3811 times)

surfercook

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2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« on: July 15, 2018, 02:25:13 PM »
But I'm gonna keep at it. At least I didn't cut myself this time. My buddy who is WAY better than me at just about everything managed to cut himself. Wasn't as bad as it looked, thankfully. He's like 15 yrs younger and an amazing athlete.
We shared the Naish foil on the 7'0" Raptor that I'm demo-ing. Gonna ditch the Naish foil for a Gofoil Maloko. the Naish is a much smaller wing.

First semi-controlled flight. Actually managed to drop in and surf the board a bit then launch the foil. didn't even come close to controlling the landing though.
vlcsnap-2018-07-15-15h34m47s695 by surfercook, on Flickr

YIKES!
vlcsnap-2018-07-15-15h34m56s208 by surfercook, on Flickr

Dodo birdin'!
vlcsnap-2018-07-15-15h35m14s018 by surfercook, on Flickr

Quite a bit of this goin' on tday.
vlcsnap-2018-07-15-15h31m00s158 by surfercook, on Flickr

Thought for sure my buddy was med center bound on this one.
vlcsnap-2018-07-15-15h36m19s869 by surfercook, on Flickr

But he displayed excellent control flying once he shook off the wipe
vlcsnap-2018-07-15-15h40m32s925 by surfercook, on Flickr

...unlike me!
vlcsnap-2018-07-15-16h49m11s299 by surfercook, on Flickr

Baby steps...slow and steady. But I will be relentless. Guessing a coupla months of this.
vlcsnap-2018-07-15-16h50m38s202 by surfercook, on Flickr
« Last Edit: July 15, 2018, 02:28:29 PM by surfercook »
One could go into a mall in Kansas and ask a teenager "What is a surfer looking for?, and the answer will always be, "The perfect wave"
 9'11"-145 ltr     8'0"-127 ltr  8'1"-116 ltr     8'0"- 110 ltr   72" Methane & Riviera Camo

Zooport

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #1 on: July 15, 2018, 03:30:00 PM »
Pic 5 looked like his face was headed straight for the point of the foil wing. 
8'6 Soul Compass
9'1 Sunova Creek
9'6 WaveStorm SUP
9'8 Starboard Element

surfcowboy

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #2 on: July 15, 2018, 04:04:37 PM »
And yet it didn't happen. So once again, the worst case envisioned did not come true. Also, neither was struck with a heat attack and they drove safely to and from the beach.

You look pretty good in most of those, cook. Looks like you're going to get this with a bit more time on the water.

So much could go wrong, and yet, most times it doesn't.


Looking good!
« Last Edit: July 15, 2018, 04:09:35 PM by surfcowboy »

SUPeter

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #3 on: July 15, 2018, 04:09:12 PM »
Its always fun!  Great for your second session.  Try keeping both  your feet on or near the stringer and your chest facing forward.  In the pics, It seems like your feet are positioned to each side of the stringer.  I could be wrong and the pics only make it seem like that.  Good luck!

supthecreek

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2018, 06:04:24 PM »
Way to go Cookieman.... here's your new theme song! :)


Beasho

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #5 on: July 16, 2018, 06:09:50 AM »
Just checked my notes from My Second Session. (Maybe the 3rd session if you count the first ever 4 attempts I had on Haley's board)

Session Number 2:

Conditions similar to 1st day.  5 - 7 feet and choppy.  Not ideal but the foil has given me new inspiration and vision into what is possible.

Notable accomplishments:
  • I managed several times to crash off the foil and then re-fly the foil without falling off.  2X I skipped off the surface twice without falling
  • I took off and did a gentle turn down the line.  Going down the line is very scary, hard to do and speed increases dramatically turning the foil into a bucking bronco that needs to be tamed
  • I made a drop and was riding then a secondary wave/bump rose up in front of me and I was able to pump the board, while on the foil, climb over the bump and drop into the next trough  OMG  :D

The last point was a huge milestone.  I have never on a SUP been able to approach a wave from behind, climb up the back (no matter how small) and then slide down the front again.  I had images of Kai connecting swells on a downwinder.

And this was My Second Session On the Foil:  Longest ride 147 yards & 25 seconds.  13 waves > 10 seconds.

Here were the stats:
http://surf.traceup.com/stats/u?uId=530606&vId=85246

PS:  Consider this a Public Service Announcement.  While I don't want to surf with a bunch of Foilers I believe this opens up a whole new landscape of otherwise imperfect spots from the outer periphery of point breaks to outer sand bars, up and down the entire East & West Coast . . . .  More to come.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2018, 06:36:03 AM by Beasho »

Beasho

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #6 on: July 16, 2018, 06:15:13 AM »
But I'm gonna keep at it. At least I didn't cut myself this time. . . .


Try keeping both  your feet on or near the stringer and your chest facing forward.  In the pics, It seems like your feet are positioned to each side of the stringer.

SUPeter is 100% correct here.  I am not sure that anyone could fly the foil with offset feet like the picture above.  It looks like you corrected it later. 

I call it a 1970's skateboard stance.  Your feet need to be 100% centered on the board. 

AND I would put a SHARPY MARK at 25" in front of the front Bolt of the foil.  I have taught 3 people to foil and applied this mark to 5 different foil boards and it has been SPOT ON.  Your front foot needs to be within +/- 1" of this forward placement.  Back foot directly on TOP of the Mast.  All the brands are converging so this will be a good place to start.  Again it will be within an INCH of where your front foot needs to be.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2018, 06:21:56 AM by Beasho »

Beasho

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #7 on: July 16, 2018, 06:33:21 AM »
PS:  As a continued public service announcement I am going to push back and say:

FOILING IS EASY

Give it a few more sessions . . . . say 10. 

If you are an experienced SUP'er it may be the easiest sport you ever tried to learn!!!!!!!!

I have now watched 2 people behind my 5 horsepower boat get up and fly on their 1st attempt.  One was my 20 year old nephew Chase who has NO experience on a SUP but is a very talented wake-boarder, waterskier and skier.  He was flying, dropping without falling and re-flying and cutting across the wake within 5 attempts (will post video). 

The other was my windsurf amigo Marc from 20 years ago.  Very talented windsurfer and water-skier.  Just learning to SUP.  He too was up and flying comfortably behind the boat IMMEDIATELY.  I was surprised.  The only other person I have seen document this quick learning experience was Evan Lloyd. 

However if I put these two in the surf they would NOT be as successful because they are NOT strong SUP'ers.   
« Last Edit: July 16, 2018, 06:40:46 AM by Beasho »

surfercook

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #8 on: July 16, 2018, 06:36:38 AM »
More support, suggestions, guidance, and foil stoke is helping me to keep on keeping on. Thanx all! I sometimes feel like giving up and returning to "Ground level". The waves were really nice yesterday and I pretty much gave up a regular sup sesh to try and progress, which I feel I have done.
I am going to mark the 25" point and try to center my stance next go. Also I will be on my V-Box because....drum roll.....the install is done!
I wanted to video the install but was busy skoolin' the foil while it was being done. Thankfully my installer took some good pictures.
I noticed the Naish Malolo which I was on has the specs right on the foil. I knew it was a slightly smaller wing than the KeNalu 'IWA775. Have a feeling the IWA will fly easier w/better and more smooth lift and sustained flight. What exactly is the "Aspect Ratio"?
'IWA775- 250mm x 775mm- 1496cm2 aspect ratio 4.14
« Last Edit: July 16, 2018, 06:43:48 AM by surfercook »
One could go into a mall in Kansas and ask a teenager "What is a surfer looking for?, and the answer will always be, "The perfect wave"
 9'11"-145 ltr     8'0"-127 ltr  8'1"-116 ltr     8'0"- 110 ltr   72" Methane & Riviera Camo

Beasho

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2018, 06:46:37 AM »
Here is some more motivation.   

A couple shots of my daughter Ruby age 15.  She IS a strong paddler and had practiced behind the boat for ~ 1 hour over 3 sessions. 

It took me 10 sessions on the Easy Foiler to take off with my front foot in the front strap.  I screamed so loud my 1st session I saw stars and almost blacked out. 

 Ruby's 1st Session in the waves:

In the top photo you can see her feet perfectly positioned.  Front foot in the strap, back foot against the rear strap.  Then she flies.  I only saw this from the still shots after the fact.

She made 4 attempts.  Had one flight of 60 yards touched down and paddled away without falling.  Then she fell a few times and suggested I ruined her surfing life forever . . . . .  hit the foil and (all truth be told got a big bruise on her calf) . . . . . So that was the end of her foiling for the week.       
« Last Edit: July 16, 2018, 06:56:08 AM by Beasho »

surfercook

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2018, 02:22:45 PM »
Beasho, I appreciate the extra effort and detailed descriptions you are putting into my post here. Very stoking and strong...like you and your daughter! Ruby rules!



Still wanting some schooling on the specs for foils though.
What exactly is the "Aspect Ratio"?
'IWA775-
250mm x 775mm - Wing span and width?
1496cm2 - overall surface area of forward wing?
aspect ratio 4.14 - ????
« Last Edit: July 16, 2018, 03:15:28 PM by surfercook »
One could go into a mall in Kansas and ask a teenager "What is a surfer looking for?, and the answer will always be, "The perfect wave"
 9'11"-145 ltr     8'0"-127 ltr  8'1"-116 ltr     8'0"- 110 ltr   72" Methane & Riviera Camo

Beasho

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #11 on: July 17, 2018, 06:09:55 AM »
I sometimes feel like giving up and returning to "Ground level". The waves were really nice yesterday and I pretty much gave up a regular sup sesh to try and progress . . .

I was speaking with my new Foil Amigo, Paul age 66, in Rhode Island.  He said he just purchased a brand new Sunova Creek and doesn't know what to do because he feels like selling all of his traditional SUP boards.

FOILING IS THAT GOOD!

The foil effectively Doubles the wave size.
   This comes from the speed, elevation, ability to fly down the line and ultimate carvability

  • 2 ft wave feels like a 4 ft wave
  • 3 ft wave feels like a 6 ft wave
  • 4 ft wave --> 8 ft wave
  • 5 ft wave --> 10 ft wave
  • 10 ft wave --> 20 ft wave

In anything less than 10 feet I will grab for my foil.  When it gets to be 10ft+ it gets to be a hard decision.   Either learn to foil in big stuff, which involves a steep learning curve, or go back to my roots on a SUP. 

Stasis is Death
« Last Edit: July 17, 2018, 06:14:41 AM by Beasho »

opie

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #12 on: July 17, 2018, 06:55:07 AM »
Aspect ratio is width over length.  So wide and skinny front to back is high aspect ratio. 

Bean

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #13 on: July 17, 2018, 07:55:32 AM »
In other words, a wing that averages 10cm accross (the chord) and 40cm long would have an aspect ratio of 4.0:1.  Accordingly, longer/narrower wings (think glider) would have a high aspect ratio.

PonoBill

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Re: 2nd Foil Sesh...NOT EASY!
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2018, 07:57:31 AM »
Yup, you're doin' it wrong--at least from the pictures. There's two things you need to make sure you have in your head before you foil again. Number one--bail early and often. From the pictures it looks like you and your friend are trying to "save it" meaning you're leaning on the rail to try to recover when the foil is tipping sideways. THAT DOESN'T WORK. All it does is cause the wing to lift more strongly in the bad direction and lets you jackknife on the foil.

I was fortunate to have lots of people around me who know how to foil and who were willing to teach me. That's what they yelled at me whenever I did that. Bail off the back if the foil starts to go out of control. You are NOT going to fix it. Start over.

Number two--both feet need to be across the stringer and your body rotated to face forward. Weight on your front foot. If you are in the right position the foil will come up flat and you can control how quickly it rises. If you aren't, you can't control the wing. It's not the board you are surfing, it's the wing. With your feet in more of a surf stance you can't control pitch and you will induce uncontrolled roll. Foot position and body direction are the two most important things. It's almost impossible to learn to foil without getting that right. Time on the water won't help if you don't get correct position. There are a few people who foil out of position, but they are freaks.

Don't take the pictures of Ruby as a guide, she's standing sideways. She'd have much more roll control if she rotated her trunk to face forward. With your heavy head, and equally heavy butt hanging over the rail sideways, it's very difficult to keep the board from rolling when you don't want it to. People with great balance or experience can do that, but trunk rotated forward, butt and head over the middle of the board is critical for beginners like you and me.

Dig out the videos Sam Pa'e did. I found them very helpful.

Incidentally Beasho, I note the place name on your photos. Three words: Matunuck Oyster Co. Awesome place. Bob, Sue and I went to Matunuk after my nephew's wedding. Flat junk, so we didn't get wet, but as we were leaving I remembered the Oyster joint. I wasn't really hungry but turned around as we were leaving (separate cars) to do a drive by. Wound up eating some oysters and having a beer. Should have called Bob, but it was a pretty weird time of the day to eat
« Last Edit: July 17, 2018, 08:16:45 AM by PonoBill »
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