Sitting (OC1, surfski) vs. Standing (SUP)

[Kwolfe]

In the first year, it was just the V8 and SUP.  Then in year two came the OC1.  Once I got that, the SUP started seeing much less time.  These days, I paddle my V14 3 out of 5 times.  I tore my achilles this spring so my SUP hasn't touched the water yet.

I hear the V8 Pro is damn near the same as the v10 sport.  I would try a V10 if you can find one to demo.  Its similar in stability to my 550.  The biggest thing I found when getting into a more advanced ski was the lack of primary stability.  You need to get used to the looseness/twitch that you don't get with a more stable ski.  Once you understand the boats behavior, the rest falls in line.

[ukgm]

In the first year, it was just the V8 and SUP.  Then in year two came the OC1.  Once I got that, the SUP started seeing much less time.  These days, I paddle my V14 3 out of 5 times.  I tore my achilles this spring so my SUP hasn't touched the water yet.

I hear the V8 Pro is damn near the same as the v10 sport.  I would try a V10 if you can find one to demo.  Its similar in stability to my 550.  The biggest thing I found when getting into a more advanced ski was the lack of primary stability.  You need to get used to the looseness/twitch that you don't get with a more stable ski.  Once you understand the boats behavior, the rest falls in line.

Thanks for that. That's useful.

[Eagle]

Personally like the V10 Sport better overall vs the V10 for rougher waters.  Sport plows thru easily under full power whereas the V10 feels quicker to tip.  Both nice but as a beginner -> nod goes to the more stable Sport for all waters.  Was told by Bob that is better to err on more stability vs less for open water slop and chop.

Erogonomics of the bucket was perfectly ok and the seat felt very comfortable.  If we were to get a surfski -> this would be the one to start.  Boat was very stable but delivered very nice consistent speed when powered up.  Would be a nice option vs SUP for many.

https://www.epickayaks.com/v10-sport

[ukgm]

Personally like the V10 Sport better overall vs the V10 for rougher waters.  Sport plows thru easily under full power whereas the V10 feels quicker to tip.  Both nice but as a beginner -> nod goes to the more stable Sport for all waters.  Was told by Bob that is better to err on more stability vs less for open water slop and chop.

Erogonomics of the bucket was perfectly ok and the seat felt very comfortable.  If we were to get a surfski -> this would be the one to start.  Boat was very stable but delivered very nice consistent speed when powered up.  Would be a nice option vs SUP for many.

https://www.epickayaks.com/v10-sport

I can certainly recommend the V8 pro. Its considerably shorter than the V10 Sport (making garage storage easier) and Epic's own published data claims that despite this (and its wider width), its raw flatwater paddling performance is only 30 seconds slower than the V10 Sport over a 10km paddle.

[Eagle]

The V10 Sport was only 15 sec slower than the V10 and V10L -> and only 10 sec slower than the V12 in that test.  While was faster than the V14 over 10 km flat water for an intermediate.  Based on that -> would stick to the Sport and just grow with it over time.  That was the basic recommendation from Bob.

Paddling the V10 and especially V10L for me -> would def yield much slower times in rough conditions.  Was very difficult to put down consistent full power with full leg drive in the V10L.  Had to pull back way too much due to its quick roll.  The V10 does feel faster with cleaner glide and lower drag -> but only on flat at this point.  In chop had to also pull back.  So your time and speed may be slower than in your Pro.

So moral is -> best to try each boat firsthand to determine what will work optimum for your purposes.  Def for me -> would not get any boat tippy narrow like the V10L unless you really needed one.  Do you not have demo days over there or know a friend who has a V10 to try yourself?

Over here can try all but the Pro.  For some reason Bob does not have that boat as a demo.  It seems that most just go from a V8 to a V10 Sport.  There is a very noticeable difference in stability for every inch drop in width.

[FloridaWindSUP]

I have limited opportunities to try other surfskis, but I did get to do a ~9 km island rounding in rough conditions on a Stellar SR (19'2 x 18.9"), and found that to be delightfully easy and fun in comparison with my v12. It didn't hurt my butt as much, either. I don't know how much of that was due to the seat shape and how much was due to the stability reducing my "white knuckle" tendency to wedge myself against the back of the seat when feeling unstable.

[Eagle]

Yeah that makes complete sense.  18.9 is a very comfy width for a beginner.  The V12 is a lot tippier and hard for many to put down full power -> especially in waves.  No way I would get a V12 as a starter.  Even if priced for a song.  My buddy has one in black.  Too tippy for me!

Can see progessing to a V10.  But would have to paddle a lot more than I do now.  Which is basically zero.  But oddly have been checking out CL for one.   

[cocoloco]

The leap between beginner/entry level and Intermediate skis can be a huge one. There are a few skis that can be called "transitional" such as the V8 Pro and Think ZEN that feel almost as stable but are a step up in performance. Myself, I'm so happy with the fun:speed factor of my Think ACE that I'd be hard pressed to buy anything else (other than a ZEN). In a recent race I found myself easily passing V 10's and V 12 (as well as a good number of OC 1 and 2's). Why? Stability lets you focus on technique 100%. Where others where reacting to every twitch with a panic brace I was zig-zag surfing the course. As Oscar Chalupsky says: "Stability before Ability".

[Eagle]

Yeah Bob says the V10 is an intermediate ski and not recommended as a starter.  He noted on flat is one thing -> but you do not want to be dumped in big ocean waves.  As a beginner would have to agree.  Many that have V14 and V12 -> use the Sport in waves.

Did try the Ace a few years ago.  Was a very stable ski -> but found the cockpit a bit too wide for me.  Remember Daryl told me he put a flat section on the underside to cut roll.  But for sure can appreciate how some are jiggly and slow on skis way too narrow for their ability level.

Always stability first for me as well.  Putting full power down is so much more fun and satisfying than worrying you will roll out on a tippy ski.  As noted the V10 Sport goes a decent speed for such a stable boat.  Yesterday I was going full power and the boat scooted along just fine.  Now just to find a full carbon black one depreciated for a good price.  Hmm?  Seems in very short supply that one unfortunately.  But have my eyes on the lookout now.   

[Kwolfe]

Just to follow up with this thread, I got out on the lake this morning with my 14x26.5 Allstar for an hour.  I haven't paddled SUP this season due to tearing my achilles early in the spring.

At regular fitness pace, I was holding roughly 5-5.2mph over 5 miles.  At the same effort, my OC1 is usually at 6.5mph and my V14 at 7.1mph.  I think I'm going to sell the Allstar and get a nice cruiser for when I just want to relax on the water and when my wife wants to paddle.

This is why surfskis and OC1 get really addicting.