Author Topic: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?  (Read 6574 times)

APPST_Paddle

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #60 on: May 02, 2018, 07:57:17 AM »
Ok, so given my options and probably a 75/25 split between flatwater/race training and some light downwinding, what are your thoughts:

BIC Tracer WS 14' x 21.5"
BIC Tracer WS 14' x 24.5"
SIC Bullet V2 14' x 27.5"

7'6" JL Super Frank Lean
8'8" JL SuperTech 
10'1" JL Black and Blue
Kenalu Ho'oloa 95, Hippostick Al Pro 7.5

warmuth

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #61 on: May 02, 2018, 10:08:33 AM »
  Just as an indication, almost no one races on a 22. Not that you canít do it but youíve got to be realistic when comparing yourself to anyone who pulls it off successfully.

This has changed in the UK substantially this year. At the biggest race in the UK held last month, out of a field of 40 male 14ft paddlers, ~15% of those were on boards around 21 inches in width. Nobody in the top 10 was on anything wider than 24.5 (and most were on 23 or narrower). The race game is changing and if it continues this way, I'll be leaving it within 2-3 years.

  How many of them are regular guys just wanting to do some racing? One of the guys in Florida who wins a ton of races is on a 22. Heís also a freak and has ability far beyond an average decent racer. Itís only changing in respect to the fast guys competing with themselves. The almost part of almost no one is referring to the top few % of elites that actually have a chance of winning.

yugi

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #62 on: May 02, 2018, 12:43:47 PM »
Ok, so given my options and probably a 75/25 split between flatwater/race training and some light downwinding, what are your thoughts:

BIC Tracer WS 14' x 21.5"
BIC Tracer WS 14' x 24.5"
SIC Bullet V2 14' x 27.5"

You said light downwinding ... Ahhhhh... now you're talking.

Tracers:
Sorry, Exec summary is: ďlast seasonĒ.
Donít get me wrong. I liked the Tracer. Like, 5 years ago. Was an OK allroundish flatwater board.
You said DW. So Tracer dismissed.

Bullet V2:
Not exactly your best pick for a race board. Nope, not when you said you felt happy on a 21Ē wide needle-noser.
Yes, OK for:
- nice deal
- winter riding in very cold water (way up on all that volume your feet do stay nice an dry all winter)
- DW in Kn 18+

Bullet is a very nice allround/DW board, but with your board skills and wanting to do the occasional race; Kayaís Blackfish is exactly what you want (worth the 30% upgrade).  Light DW included [at your skillset]. Or something that shape.

Ask Kaya or DK78.

APPST_Paddle

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #63 on: May 02, 2018, 12:49:32 PM »
Ok, so given my options and probably a 75/25 split between flatwater/race training and some light downwinding, what are your thoughts:

BIC Tracer WS 14' x 21.5"
BIC Tracer WS 14' x 24.5"
SIC Bullet V2 14' x 27.5"

You said light downwinding ... Ahhhhh... now you're talking.

Tracers:
Sorry, Exec summary is: ďlast seasonĒ.
Donít get me wrong. I liked the Tracer. Like, 5 years ago. Was an OK allroundish flatwater board.
You said DW. So Tracer dismissed.

Bullet V2:
Not exactly your best pick for a race board. Nope, not when you said you felt happy on a 21Ē wide needle-noser.
Yes, OK for:
- nice deal
- winter riding in very cold water (way up on all that volume your feet do stay nice an dry all winter)
- DW in Kn 18+

Bullet is a very nice allround/DW board, but with your board skills and wanting to do the occasional race; Kayaís Blackfish is exactly what you want (worth the 30% upgrade).  Light DW included [at your skillset]. Or something that shape.

Ask Kaya or DK78.

Cool, thanks. Good info, yeah, and by downwinding, I mostly mean going to the beach and heading in the direction of the current/light wind (less than 10 knots) and maybe riding a little bump in the water. I want mostly speed for racing that I can still get through chop without wanting to poke my eyes out.
7'6" JL Super Frank Lean
8'8" JL SuperTech 
10'1" JL Black and Blue
Kenalu Ho'oloa 95, Hippostick Al Pro 7.5

yugi

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #64 on: May 02, 2018, 01:00:45 PM »
  Just as an indication, almost no one races on a 22. Not that you canít do it but youíve got to be realistic when comparing yourself to anyone who pulls it off successfully.

This has changed in the UK substantially this year. At the biggest race in the UK held last month, out of a field of 40 male 14ft paddlers, ~15% of those were on boards around 21 inches in width. Nobody in the top 10 was on anything wider than 24.5 (and most were on 23 or narrower). The race game is changing and if it continues this way, I'll be leaving it within 2-3 years.

First:
A10 has long said UK race scene is pure flatwater canals. So numbers not pertinent for you APPST. Ask A10, he used to be a displacement nose kind of guy

Second:
Width means very little. Itís the shape (and a bit more) that counts. A parallel outline board provides a lot more overall stability for its widest point. A fish shapeís wide point is much wider than itís realistic stability.

EXEC SUMMARY:
with a board like an Infinity Backfish x24 you will have a good:
- allround training board
- race board
- light DW board (I know youy'll kite when it honks, I kite)
... - and light (which you will notice counts a lot on these huge boards)

« Last Edit: May 02, 2018, 01:06:54 PM by yugi »

Luc Benac

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #65 on: May 02, 2018, 01:27:51 PM »
Yes the Blackfish at this price if you leave close enough is a no-brainer. Not even sure why to discuss it :-)
Bark Vapor 14' x 26" 271L
* Black Project Hydro 77
* Kenalu Mana 82

Ace-GT 17'4" x 27" 313L
* Black Project Hydro 85
* Kenalu Mana 90

Infinity Whiplash 14" x 25" 262L

APPST_Paddle

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #66 on: May 02, 2018, 02:19:44 PM »
Yes the Blackfish at this price if you leave close enough is a no-brainer. Not even sure why to discuss it :-)

Yeah, that's a solid 14 hour drive for me.
7'6" JL Super Frank Lean
8'8" JL SuperTech 
10'1" JL Black and Blue
Kenalu Ho'oloa 95, Hippostick Al Pro 7.5

Luc Benac

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #67 on: May 02, 2018, 03:12:32 PM »
Yes the Blackfish at this price if you leave close enough is a no-brainer. Not even sure why to discuss it :-)

Yeah, that's a solid 14 hour drive for me.

Often the same problem in Canada :-)
Bark Vapor 14' x 26" 271L
* Black Project Hydro 77
* Kenalu Mana 82

Ace-GT 17'4" x 27" 313L
* Black Project Hydro 85
* Kenalu Mana 90

Infinity Whiplash 14" x 25" 262L

ukgm

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #68 on: May 03, 2018, 12:14:04 AM »
  Just as an indication, almost no one races on a 22. Not that you canít do it but youíve got to be realistic when comparing yourself to anyone who pulls it off successfully.

This has changed in the UK substantially this year. At the biggest race in the UK held last month, out of a field of 40 male 14ft paddlers, ~15% of those were on boards around 21 inches in width. Nobody in the top 10 was on anything wider than 24.5 (and most were on 23 or narrower). The race game is changing and if it continues this way, I'll be leaving it within 2-3 years.

First:
A10 has long said UK race scene is pure flatwater canals. So numbers not pertinent for you APPST. Ask A10, he used to be a displacement nose kind of guy

That's not true. It's a mix of rivers, estuaries and relatively flat sea races. Of the top 3 events we had in 2017, one was a river race, one was estuary based and the third was a mix. However, I'm of the firm opinion that unless you are an athlete who will win races with clear water, you should go for the narrowest allwater board you can produce full power with. I think flatwater specific boards are limited and not not as tactically flexible as contemporary allwater boards.

Here's a stat for you though: The Head of the Dart was the biggest distance racing event in the UK in 2016 & 2017 (and probably will be in 2018). It takes place on a mix of a river and an estuary. The average width of the top 10 placing males on a 14ft board at the race in 2016 was 24 inches, in 2017 it was 23.6 inches and in 2018 it fell again to 22.4 inches.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2018, 12:49:03 AM by ukgm »

yugi

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #69 on: May 03, 2018, 01:37:30 AM »
^ agree

ukgm

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #70 on: May 03, 2018, 02:25:46 AM »
^ agree

By the way, the 2018 downward skew on the width from that UK race data can be entirely attributed to many paddlers buying and racing the Starboard sprint in 21.5 width.

yugi

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #71 on: May 03, 2018, 02:06:22 PM »
Booth is fast.

Makes one jones for a Sprint too.

Eagle

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #72 on: May 06, 2018, 02:16:13 PM »
"By the way, the 2018 downward skew on the width from that UK race data can be entirely attributed to many paddlers buying and racing the Starboard sprint in 21.5 width."

Yeah that 21.5 Sprint is a killer efficient board on flat.  Can understand the popularity and is the best ever SUP I have ever paddled to accelerate and hold speed.  The 23 AS does not nearly glide as well -> but is so much better in cross chop and in waves DW.

The narrow limit at this point seems to be around 21.5 for races.  Anything less is getting very narrow to balance on in real world race ocean conditions.
Fast is FUN!   8)
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APPST_Paddle

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #73 on: May 16, 2018, 06:45:56 PM »
Update to this - is there any reason to look at a 12'6" or is everything going to 14' only?
7'6" JL Super Frank Lean
8'8" JL SuperTech 
10'1" JL Black and Blue
Kenalu Ho'oloa 95, Hippostick Al Pro 7.5

ukgm

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Re: Thinking about a Race Board, what should I get?
« Reply #74 on: May 17, 2018, 12:19:22 AM »
Update to this - is there any reason to look at a 12'6" or is everything going to 14' only?

It depends on your aims. As far as international competition goes, it will all be 14ft class only next year. However, if you only paddle for pleasure or do the odd race domestically, 12'6 may be fine. In my country, mens 12'6 racing is pretty much dead. For ladies, it is still evenly split between 12'6 and 14ft.

However, bear in mind that selling a 12'6 board secondhand is getting increasingly difficult.