REPAIRING BROKEN BOARD: Should I fill foam voids with spackle before glassing?

[magentawave]

I'm repairing a board that I let get t-boned by the lip of an 8' face. It was so dumb what I did but I done did it. Anywhoooo, some of the little eps foam balls pulled away as I stripped the glass. In most of those areas it's only one foam ball deep that pulled away but there's a part on one of the rails where it's at least 1/2" deep.

QUESTION:

1) Should I fill the voids with spackle just like I would do when sealing a newly shaped blank - and even that 1/2" deep area on the rail?

2) I forget now, but what's the best and LIGHTEST spackle to use?

3) In the few minutes it took me to get out of the water the  glass pulled away from the bottom at about the halfway point almost to the tail. That glass was still tight close to the rail on the bottom so I cut it away about 1' from the edge of the rail which means there's a step down from that 1" of glass to the foam all along the rail on the bottom. How would you deal with that step down?

Thanks, homies!

[TallDude]

The spackle is only good as a thin spread / sealer, not a deep filler. Try the gorilla glue with a little water mist on it. Let it expand and cure, then sand it to shape.

[magentawave]

The spackle is only good as a thin spread / sealer, not a deep filler. Try the gorilla glue with a little water mist on it. Let it expand and cure, then sand it to shape.

Can you explain this "water misting" technique a little more, please. Do you apply the Gorilla Glue with the same kind of plastic spreader I would use to seal a blank with spackle? Do you mist it with water from a spray bottle immediately? What is the point of the misting?

Thanks

[jrandy]

Hi Magenta, the GG needs a tiny amount of water or moisture to expand and cure.
Techniques were discussed recently on this thread:
https://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,32837.0.html

[magentawave]

I just read that thread. Thank you! I will use Gorilla Glue. Any suggestions for how to deal with the step down from the glass to the foam along the rail on the bottom? I need some ideas for how to even that out.

[PonoBill]

It's best to mix the gorilla glue with some water instead of just misting it.

Shoot a picture of the step. Generally, for any sizable foam damage, I glue on some foam and reshape it. I think that's a lot easier than trying to build up with any kind of expanding stuff.

[supuk]

pop a few pictures up and it will be a lot easier to give a correct method. You have to be a little carful with gorilla glues as it is horrible to sand. if you have large bits of foam missing replace like for like, you can use a small amount of gorilla glue to stick the new foam back in.

[Beasho]

Here is the video I made on mixing the Gorilla Glue with water and resulting density & context of the material.

I am convinced that Gorilla glue is far superior to Epoxy with microballoons for addressing missing chunks of foam.

Yes - It is hard to sand, I use a sharp knife to get it close to its desired shape.  Good news - If you over sand just remix some Gorilla Glue and REBUILD THE SHAPE. 

Alternately if you have an extremely large, and relatively normal shape, of missing foam use this method to glue in the block of EPS / other foam and then cut back from there.

[eDUBz]

Router out the area for a nice clean repair and use the expanding foam to bond New EPS and reshape it. If you end up just filling the area use Microballons or q-cell with slow kick hardner, will work but adds a lil more weight.

[magentawave]

Thanks for all of the tips, guys. Here's some photos... 

The problem as you can see is that the cloth literally tore from rail to rail from the impact of the lip as if it was cut with a utility knife and on my way back in the entire section of cloth pulled away from the foam all the way back to the back fin boxes. Thanks to the carbon deck patch I added when I bought this board and possibly the carbon innegra the foam core did NOT break. In fact, after pulling off the deck pad and the cloth on the bottom I can see that the only "breaks" into the foam were on each rail.

Instead of trying to match the old carbon innegra with new carbon innegra (or whatever it is) and trying to match the existing colors, my plan is to lay down a layer of plain weave carbon cloth followed by a layer of something sacrificial so I don't sand through the carbon. I think I can make it look great and still be super strong without adding much weight. Here's my questions...

1) How would you deal with the step down or drop off from the existing cloth along the rails on the bottom (where I cut it) to the foam? You can see where I cut it along the rail with the utility knife in the 3rd photo down.

2) I need to fill the holes where the foam balls pulled out plus seal the foam. What do you recommend I fill those holes with? Light weight spackle? If so, what brand?

3) Would you use 4.8 oz plain weave carbon or 5.8 oz plain weave carbon?

4) What weight of fiberglass cloth would you lay down AFTER the carbon?

Thanks again.

[supuk]

I have to admit with that much of the bottom gone and the pain in the ass it is to feather into vector net maybe it would be worth pulling the rest and just do a full lam on the bottom and wrap the rail.

[magentawave]

I have to admit with that much of the bottom gone and the pain in the ass it is to feather into vector net maybe it would be worth pulling the rest and just do a full lam on the bottom and wrap the rail.

I considered that but that opens up another can of worms when it comes to matching the weave of the new vector net to the old at the rails on the bottom and then my cutting away of the old cloth along the rails would have to be perfect and it's NOT in the tail simply because I had to cut close in order to find cloth that still adhered to the foam. Hmmm, but maybe I should pull ALL the cloth off the bottom and then glass with carbon? So that brings up another question. My ASSUMPTION with glassing over the old with black plain weave carbon is that it would be 100% opaque and therefore totally hide all the old color/cloth underneath it. Is that assumption correct?

[supuk]

I would cut the rest of the bottom as you have done as if it was a cut lap then just sand the hot coat of the rails till you just touch the glass. not shore what everyone's fascination in carbon is  but I would ether just to a a 6+4 or 6+6 lam of e glass on the bottom, you could use vector net again but in this case I would probably not.

when you lam the bottom you could first do a pigmented panel that would help bring the bottom back up before doing a clear lam with laps or just do a solid pigmented lam around the rail with a cut lap on the deck. I would never use carbon unless your prepared to vac bag it as it doesn't really make the use of the properties carbon can give.

[magentawave]

I would cut the rest of the bottom as you have done as if it was a cut lap then just sand the hot coat of the rails till you just touch the glass. not shore what everyone's fascination in carbon is  but I would ether just to a a 6+4 or 6+6 lam of e glass on the bottom, you could use vector net again but in this case I would probably not.

when you lam the bottom you could first do a pigmented panel that would help bring the bottom back up before doing a clear lam with laps or just do a solid pigmented lam around the rail with a cut lap on the deck. I would never use carbon unless your prepared to vac bag it as it doesn't really make the use of the properties carbon can give.

Ultimately I want it to look as if it was never repaired. Maybe I'm wrong but my thinking for using carbon was to hide everything underneath and perhaps the repair would be lighter than E or S. It's going to be tricky to make it look as if it was never repaired with E or S when dealing with the two broken sections that wrap around the rail up to the deck. I have an idea for doing carbon there that would hide that and still look good.

I need to fill the holes where the foam balls pulled out plus seal the foam. What do you recommend I fill those holes with? Light weight spackle?

Again, would black plain weave carbon totally hide everything underneath it?

Thanks again.

[TallDude]

Sticker..