Foil mount install ( twin finbox style)

[supuk]

Thought I would do a little thread on installing some twin finboxes in to a old board for any one wondering how to.

personaly I feel it's important to spread the load so I opted for a HD foam insert. I also went for the futures long board box and they also spead the load and are a one pice box so nice and strong.

The first step for me was to laminate a block of foam and the  to cnc the HD insert to take the finboxes making the install easer and more accurate.

Next it is important to establish the waterline of the board and set the board on your stand with this level.

Then mark your center line and your position from tail, I opted for 20" from the tail.
Once you have this I lay down the insert and use masking tape to mark out the area that will be cut out.

For the cutting out I used a multi tool but this is were you need to go quite carefully as you will want to get a nice flat bottom and you will also want to make sure that when the insert is in it sits at 0deg to the water line. This could be done with a router and jig however would require a little setting up and most probably would not want to waste the time.

After you are sure you have the insert sittting in the hole how you want it's time to bond it in and for this I use a foaming pu wood glue similar to gorilla glue.be sure to get a even coat over all surfaces before spraying with a mist of water, inserting and then weighing them Fermly down ( I'm using lead bricks that I cast) be sure to regularly cheque to make sure it does not lift while drying.

[surfcowboy]

I'm gonna tack on to this thread to talk about foil angle, since it's related to this install.

I checked my Simmons today and I estimate that it's 2-3 degrees off of vertical if I mount flush to the board. It'd need a slight recess in the front and mbe aybe 5mm or 1/4" "proud" in the back to get it dead 90° to the board and give me a 0° angle of attack on the foil.

Is this an issue? I don't think it would be but I just want to check. Also, I'm assuming it'll take come careful measuring (or maybe a jig) to route it correctly for the foam box.

Am I overthinking it or is this in fact better for flight?

[supuk]

as I have found its very hard to get the angle right first time. I originally opted for a 90deg angle to the board however soon found what looks right on the land was quite different to the water. I have ended up spacing the front of the plate back up to point the foil back down as when you paddle the nose tends to rise and tail sink so naturally point the foil up so this needs to be compensated. What I have also found that you don't want is the deck of the board to be pointing down at the front as it takes pressure of your front foot and leads to a lot lest control on pitch.  I would set it with  the back of the box slightly lower than you think which will allow you to shim it back towards 90deg if you need.

[Dwight (DW)]

I took my board out and paddled it with a measuring stick taped to nose and level across deck at handle. It took several tries, but I finally found my boards angle while paddling.

On the Tuttle cassette, this put the cassette sunk 1/4" at front, flush at rear.

[Weasels wake]

Are there no adjustable fuselage angles as part of the foil assembly, offered by any of the foil manufactures?
Seems to me that it should be easy to incorporate.  Mast angles (forward to rear) seem to be inconsequential.

[supuk]

You can get some with shims to cange the insidence between front and rear wing but not seen anything for adjusting the hole foil assemberly

[surfcowboy]

Dwight, that is about where I'd be and thank you for setting my mind straight, yes, sunk in front instead of raised but with a foam cassette I could split the difference. I also think that if you're making your own you could go with a bigger plate to spread the load out beyond the bolts. Maybe even just a couple of inches but seems like that'd help a bit.

UK, I forgot I could shim a bit too. And yes, I'm betting that the tail is down a bit since the back of that Simmons is so thin. I'll paddle it this weekend and get a look too.

[Newps]

Are there no adjustable fuselage angles as part of the foil assembly, offered by any of the foil manufactures?
Seems to me that it should be easy to incorporate.  Mast angles (forward to rear) seem to be inconsequential.

There will be shortly... .

I am really liking this setup by the way.  I believe being able to slide the foil forward and backwards ( in conjunction with adjusting the fuselage angle ) will open up different foiling styles.  Right now most are surfing with a forward foot bias, much like snowboarding on groomed runs.  There is also another adjustment that no one is talking about, that could potentially change the way we foil and make it more like surfing ( off the back foot ).  Keep in mind I have not foil yet and this is all speculation.  I will however have my Tuttle boxed board ( 7'8" L41) and new foil (??) in the next week to start testing these theories.

[SUP Sports ®]

No offense to anyone wanting to get into foiling...but, it kinda blows my mind how many people that haven't actually ever done it, have such strong opinions about it...

Reminds me of a plaque that hung in the Oceanography Dept. in college about Oceanographers that haven't actually been to sea...kinda like sex virgins...lots of enthusiasm...but, more accurately, it's referred to as ignorance...;-)

There are dozens of forums and blog posts by virgin foilers out on the inter-web doing this who haven't even made the investment in foiling gear yet...so, I'm not saying this to anyone specifically on this forum...but, it is certainly an observation from someone who has over 100 foil crashes under my belt..and, am approached by folks at the water's edge with those, IMHO,  ignorant opinions...way worse than the early days of standup...like "why do you want to do that?"...etc...and, some of these guys have been doing water sports for decades...ummmm...the answer is as simple as the question of "why does a dog lick his cojones?"...;-)

[patfly]

While you are not off the mark with your comment, I would expect someone with your experience might add to the conversation rather than flame. Just say'n

[surfcowboy]

Thanks to those sharing info and to those who are trying to work all this stuff out.

In good news, there's not a big enough market for this stuff to even worry about the intellectual property so the setups and foil info will probably flow pretty freely.

To the leaders in the foil business I've got good news and bad news. The good news is, you're the biggest foil company in the world. The bad news is, you're the biggest foil company in the world.

The tech isn't done here. Lots of speculation to be done. I'm in a business that thrives on people having silly ideas and testing them in collaboration long before anyone is an expert. The results are open sourced and people make businesses out of supporting and doing what the average person doesn't want to do. This feels like home to me.

I will note that the Foil category is pretty much an extension/hybrid of the Shape Shack. Beware all who enter. It feels far from professional other than the great shapers who help all of us out with our crazy builds.

Now, about these angles. Seems like less rocker is the jam and if you have rocker, you need to adjust for it at least a little.