Author Topic: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race  (Read 50550 times)

Area 10

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #525 on: August 10, 2018, 01:15:49 AM »
A word from the maker
https://www.facebook.com/100004232409595/posts/1098957243588679/
Sounds like the shaper is on the same voyage of discovery that the leading brands have been on - and that racers go through when they start out. Everyone is looking for “free” speed so they turn to obvious possibilities such as rounded hulls, less weight, minimising wetted surface, and then add a few fancy tweaks for show, such as complex chines etc. And then they do their testing in pure flat water - on the grounds that that is the most reliable test.

But what they end up with is something that is really difficult to use, and quite often looks a bit of a dog’s dinner. As soon as the paddler uses it in conditions it wasn’t tested in - surprise surprise - it is as fast as a dog’ dinner too.

IMO there really isn’t any simple way to a design like the All Star, Sprint, RS, Maliko etc. Except to copy them. They have been honed by experience more than theory. Hard yards all over the world. And by multiple riders - this is important I think because otherwise you end up with quite singular handling characteristics that might suit your particular pro but not the average Joe (could this perhaps be said of Travis’s influence on some of the NSP designs?).

So, if Lightcorp stay the course (and my prediction is that after a couple of seasons of trying, and relatively few sales, they will go back to their core business, like so many others), they’ll probably end up with a decent compromise design in 2-3 years’ time that can rival the main brands. But right at this moment I’m not quite sure what it is about that video - or the rather poorly-written design notes- that was supposed to convince me to buy one of these boards.

I really hope that they get it right soon though. With the imminent financial meltdown that Brexit is going to cause, we here in the UK could do with a local(ish) brand that makes boards that are gonna last forever because soon none of us are going to be able to afford new boards! But they’d better do it quick, before the Euro softens too when we default on the 100bn euro payment that the EU thinks it is going to get from us when we leave the EU, and voters in Italy, France and Germany start to resent financially supporting the poorer EU countries... we live in interesting times.

Lake Paddler

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #526 on: August 10, 2018, 01:54:15 AM »
The new GT with 23.5 width is too narrow for me. Maximum rider weight according to specification at 90 kg.
...and recommended minimum rider weight: 78 kg. It's an extremely narrow range.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2018, 02:15:34 AM by Lake Paddler »

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #527 on: August 10, 2018, 02:38:42 AM »
The new GT with 23.5 width is too narrow for me. Maximum rider weight according to specification at 90 kg.
...and recommended minimum rider weight: 78 kg. It's an extremely narrow range.

Its what happens when you design something scientifically with a targeted waterline. I had a nice email from them this morning with some more thoughts and details. I'm not sure i agree with their design but I oike their process and at least it offers a different angle to the masses.

Area 10

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #528 on: August 10, 2018, 03:20:14 AM »
The new GT with 23.5 width is too narrow for me. Maximum rider weight according to specification at 90 kg.
...and recommended minimum rider weight: 78 kg. It's an extremely narrow range.

Its what happens when you design something scientifically with a targeted waterline. I had a nice email from them this morning with some more thoughts and details. I'm not sure i agree with their design but I oike their process and at least it offers a different angle to the masses.
78kg minimum? Most of the top racers these days would be a bit lighter than this, surely? Is this aimed at the “competitive but not a podium regular” racer? I seem to remember someone (Jim Terrell? Danny Ching?) saying a few years ago that the optimal weight for a male SUP racer is around 70-75kg...?? So maybe they think that if you are over 78kgs you aren’t going to be wanting to paddle anything narrower than 23.5” wide, and you are most likely a decent weekend warrior but not likely to threaten the best?

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #529 on: August 10, 2018, 03:48:44 AM »
The new GT with 23.5 width is too narrow for me. Maximum rider weight according to specification at 90 kg.
...and recommended minimum rider weight: 78 kg. It's an extremely narrow range.

Its what happens when you design something scientifically with a targeted waterline. I had a nice email from them this morning with some more thoughts and details. I'm not sure i agree with their design but I oike their process and at least it offers a different angle to the masses.
78kg minimum? Most of the top racers these days would be a bit lighter than this, surely? Is this aimed at the “competitive but not a podium regular” racer? I seem to remember someone (Jim Terrell? Danny Ching?) saying a few years ago that the optimal weight for a male SUP racer is around 70-75kg...?? So maybe they think that if you are over 78kgs you aren’t going to be wanting to paddle anything narrower than 23.5” wide, and you are most likely a decent weekend warrior but not likely to threaten the best?

It depends on whether their volume is catering for elites or to the wider market that would buy the board. It's the opposite approach to Naish who seem to design the volume of their race boards based on the weight of an elite paddler or their team riders (but is too low for the market in my view).

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #530 on: August 10, 2018, 08:51:40 AM »
ukgm - we’ve been here before. It’s stupid you trying to win (at an elite level) on a 14ft board. You are too big. You should be on an UL. If people like you won’t carry the torch for UL then that really is an example of turkeys voting for Christmas.

But if you are irrevocably focussed on volume (because of this), then have you tried a 2018 14x22.5 Ace? It is a design that is tolerant of changes in waterline.

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #531 on: September 01, 2018, 12:01:20 AM »
ukgm - we’ve been here before. It’s stupid you trying to win (at an elite level) on a 14ft board. You are too big. You should be on an UL. If people like you won’t carry the torch for UL then that really is an example of turkeys voting for Christmas.

But if you are irrevocably focussed on volume (because of this), then have you tried a 2018 14x22.5 Ace? It is a design that is tolerant of changes in waterline.

Well, if you go down the road of suitability, I shouldn't be paddling at all - I should either be playing basketball or sitting in a rowing 8. If you get too hung up about sporting disposition for a sport like SUP (that is still in the very early stages of its development), few of us should be racing at all. It's about playing positively with the hand you have in the environment you like than continually berating yourself about what you don't. My bottom line is that I am not an elite athlete - I am an age grouper/amateur who has a trophy cabinet filled with the fruits of that labour but those limitations.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2018, 12:28:43 AM by ukgm »

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #532 on: September 01, 2018, 01:23:57 AM »
ukgm - we’ve been here before. It’s stupid you trying to win (at an elite level) on a 14ft board. You are too big. You should be on an UL. If people like you won’t carry the torch for UL then that really is an example of turkeys voting for Christmas.

But if you are irrevocably focussed on volume (because of this), then have you tried a 2018 14x22.5 Ace? It is a design that is tolerant of changes in waterline.

Well, if you go down the road of suitability, I shouldn't be paddling at all - I should either be playing basketball or sitting in a rowing 8. If you get too hung up about sporting disposition for a sport like SUP (that is still in the very early stages of its development), few of us should be racing at all. It's about playing positively with the hand you have in the environment you like than continually berating yourself about what you don't. My bottom line is that I am not an elite athlete - I am an age grouper/amateur who has a trophy cabinet filled with the fruits of that labour but those limitations.
The more important point is about paddling *pleasure*. All those hours you spend training for races that are a slog on a 14 could be much nicer if you were on an UL. It would be better for your body, and more enjoyable. But instead of showing leadership in your chosen role within the sport, you are apparently choosing to reinforce a system that conspires against your own, and reduces innovation. It’s a missed opportunity IMO.

But maybe you just haven’t paddled enough on UL boards yet. Hopefully ONE, SUNOVA, Starboard etc will have distributors in Europe who will be willing to bring at least one or two of their UL models in, and this will kick-start a change, despite the narrow-mindedness of the increasingly irrelevant race scene. Once you’ve tried an UL it is hard to go back to a wider, slower, less stable design, and you start asking yourself why people would insist on the equivalent of a rule that everyone in the London marathon must run in leather army boots.

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #533 on: September 01, 2018, 02:26:19 AM »
ukgm - we’ve been here before. It’s stupid you trying to win (at an elite level) on a 14ft board. You are too big. You should be on an UL. If people like you won’t carry the torch for UL then that really is an example of turkeys voting for Christmas.

But if you are irrevocably focussed on volume (because of this), then have you tried a 2018 14x22.5 Ace? It is a design that is tolerant of changes in waterline.

Well, if you go down the road of suitability, I shouldn't be paddling at all - I should either be playing basketball or sitting in a rowing 8. If you get too hung up about sporting disposition for a sport like SUP (that is still in the very early stages of its development), few of us should be racing at all. It's about playing positively with the hand you have in the environment you like than continually berating yourself about what you don't. My bottom line is that I am not an elite athlete - I am an age grouper/amateur who has a trophy cabinet filled with the fruits of that labour but those limitations.
1) The more important point is about paddling *pleasure*. All those hours you spend training for races that are a slog on a 14 could be much nicer if you were on an UL. It would be better for your body, and more enjoyable. But maybe you just haven’t paddled enough on UL boards yet. Hopefully ONE, SUNOVA, Starboard etc will have distributors in Europe who will be willing to bring at least one or two of their UL models in, and this will kick-start a change, despite the narrow-mindedness of the increasingly irrelevant race scene. Once you’ve tried an UL it is hard to go back to a wider, slower, less stable design, and you start asking yourself why people would insist on the equivalent of a rule that everyone in the London marathon must run in leather army boots.

2) But instead of showing leadership in your chosen role within the sport, you are apparently choosing to reinforce a system that conspires against your own, and reduces innovation. It’s a missed opportunity IMO.



1) I suspect the reason I have been enjoying paddling my surfski more than my SUP is possibly relating to the sensations you allude to. However, the attraction of moving something hard has pleasures of its own. The best example I can think of is bench pressing 40kg 40 times or being able to shunt 100kg 4 times. Or the difference between racing a 12'6 inflatable vs a 14ft hard board (as i did a couple of years back for naish). It's not better or worse, just different. That said. I don't disagree with what you're describing on this and agree with you.

2) Due to work and family commitments I can only probably race across 2-3 sports for 15 weekends per year. Of those, probably 3-4 are SUP related. Of those, 2 are big events where I (rarely) get the chance to race the very best of your peers. I'm not going to blow the few opportunities I have to race something that isn't even allowable within our current legislation or to wave a banner in an event whereby I might not be able to race again for another couple of months. However, if you're suggesting I'm closed minded to paddling one in totality, not at all. I'm able to access several boards from a variety of brands shortly and I'll try anything I can access and I've enquired about several boards (including some production UL's). To get back on thread, I have recently been given the chance to test both Nelo's.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2018, 02:41:23 AM by ukgm »

Area 10

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #534 on: September 01, 2018, 03:00:52 AM »
Have you tried the Lightcorp race paddle?

mr_proper

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #535 on: September 01, 2018, 03:26:17 AM »
To get back on thread, I have recently been given the chance to test both Nelo's.

Unfortunately you are too far away, otherwise you would like to test my Nelo.
And unfortunately, I have not used the Nelo since I got the RS because the RS is so much more fun. But my wife like the Nelo. Nevertheless, I will sell it to buy another RS.
SIC RS 14x23, 2018
SIC RS 14x26, 2018
Lightcorp Signature Race 14x24.75, 2018 (sold)
JP Australia AdventurAir 12x36, 2017
Starboard Allstar 14x24.5, 2017 (sold)
SIC Bullet 14x27.25 TWC, 2015
Jimmy Lewis Sidewinder 14x25, 2016 (sold)
Sprint 14x23, 2015 (sold)
JL Stiletto 14x28, 2014 (sold)

Lake Paddler

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #536 on: September 01, 2018, 03:49:57 AM »
To get back on thread, I have recently been given the chance to test both Nelo's.
Nice. Then you would be able to compare their Signature 2.0 to the SB Sprint 14'x21.5". I would be particularly interested in the performance of the GT.

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #537 on: September 01, 2018, 04:02:31 AM »
Have you tried the Lightcorp race paddle?

Nope.

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #538 on: September 28, 2018, 03:31:50 PM »
I just spotted this recent review of the Nelo vs a Starboard Sprint on youtube.

Here:

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #539 on: September 30, 2018, 03:13:12 AM »
I totally agree with this video. I'll add that, after more than 4 months paddling the Nelo 14x23 (version 2) in all types of different conditions all over France, the Nelo board has a lot of positive attributes. My favorite two are:
- Durability (the board still looks brand spanking new, after nearly 1500 km on the water)
- Super light (I was able to paddle in one of the most magical places in France, with an approach that was nearly 2km long)

So while carrying a board isn't the point of buying a board, it is sometimes an absolute must. The lightweight Nelo excelled in that sense, and paddling has - so far - being nothing short of a pleasure.

Here's "Le pont du Gars" near the town of Avignon in France
(during a super calm day)


Nelo SUP - 14' x 23"
Nelo Surfski 560M - 18'4" x 17"