Author Topic: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race  (Read 259601 times)

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #210 on: February 26, 2018, 11:29:01 AM »
It’s hard to beat the Ace for speed in small downwind conditions if you are a serious competitor.

But I own an 14x25 carbon Ace yet have just bought an SIC RS. So that should tell you something.

And you wouldn’t want an Ace for competing in the conditions shown in this vid. Here, low volume and a flat deck is king.

https://youtu.be/WSTIYCfQZAI

(Incredible footage of them surfing raceboards in that vid btw).

So no-one is arguing with you, photofr.

But the Ace is a great place to start if you were thinking about designing a rough waters board, and you were from a “boat” rather than “board” background. You simply can’t argue with the results, over many years. This is of course exactly what Mistral did. In fact I’ve got the actual Ace that the designers of the Mistral Equinox used as a starting point for their design. There are pencil markings of measurements all over it. The Equinox proved to be a highly effective rough waters race board.

And now of course there are clog designs everywhere. ONE, Sunova, NSP etc etc. All variations on the Ace concept, with a few variations thrown in (e.g concave vs. convex bottoms).

But maybe Nelo are e.g. going to bring out a board that is like an Ace in reverse, ie. pointy axe bow at the front, with a bit fat bulbous ass :) When the first pics of the Ace arrived many people mistook the tail for the bow :)

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #211 on: February 26, 2018, 08:46:13 PM »
Is the fin box really far from the tail. I thought that the Spartan was super stable more so than the larger dolphin pivot. It is definitly rock solid when on the tail on a good fast glide on a steeper bump.

I missed that one. Yes the fin box is 38" from the tail. I too thought the Spartan would work, I've used it instead of the Dolphin Pivot on my tippy Red with good results, but it didn't do the trick for me
on the unlimited.
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ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #212 on: February 27, 2018, 01:20:36 AM »
the ISA don't do official sprints or a downwind events at their worlds ?

They'd have had downwinders if the weather had co-operated. The ICF will have to have a backup plan in Portugal too. Sprints, yes:
https://www.supthemag.com/photos/2017-isa-world-sup-paddleboard-championship-gallery-recap-results/

And who can forget this performance? Probably the most remarkable athletic feat I have ever seen in a SUP race (by Kai Lenny). http://www.supracer.com/video-kai-lenny-stand-up-paddleboarding-race/



there's a video of Kai's incredible (flat water) 800m performance.

True, but these aren't specifically titled events as such i.e. world sprints champions, world downwind champion, etc ? The ICF is taking a much more prescribed (or is it contrived ? - you decide) approach to SUP racing.

Your point is valid about being able to guarantee conditions to do so though but it should be noted that this championships is being bolted onto the Nelo Summer challenge event which has been run as a downwind surfski race for some years successfully. It could be argued that's the ICF doing it on the cheap (as the current event organiser will be dealing with it rather than the ICF managing a standalone event) but I can say from friends that this event is extremely well run and with a good track record. If the ICF go open entry (and that's what the insiders are telling me), then that's a smart move and one that will help get the deepest field possible without the typically political national team selections (and will also help bankroll it due to the extra numbers present).

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #213 on: February 27, 2018, 07:47:55 AM »
Is the fin box really far from the tail. I thought that the Spartan was super stable more so than the larger dolphin pivot. It is definitly rock solid when on the tail on a good fast glide on a steeper bump.

I missed that one. Yes the fin box is 38" from the tail. I too thought the Spartan would work, I've used it instead of the Dolphin Pivot on my tippy Red with good results, but it didn't do the trick for me
on the unlimited.

38" yes that is some way. BTW when measuring is it customary to measure from the back, the front or the middle of the fin box?
I remember some indications given by Larry about the depth of the fin been related with the placement of the fin box i.e. closer to the tail shorter the fin but I cannot find the post again and it might have been on FB.

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Naish Nalu 11'4" x 30" 180L Andaman 520
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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #214 on: February 27, 2018, 10:30:42 AM »
Is the fin box really far from the tail. I thought that the Spartan was super stable more so than the larger dolphin pivot. It is definitly rock solid when on the tail on a good fast glide on a steeper bump.

I missed that one. Yes the fin box is 38" from the tail. I too thought the Spartan would work, I've used it instead of the Dolphin Pivot on my tippy Red with good results, but it didn't do the trick for me
on the unlimited.

38" yes that is some way. BTW when measuring is it customary to measure from the back, the front or the middle of the fin box?
I remember some indications given by Larry about the depth of the fin been related with the placement of the fin box i.e. closer to the tail shorter the fin but I cannot find the post again and it might have been on FB.

Yes, that’s rule of thumb but tail rocker is a factor as well.
The reason for that is the closer to tail the more interference
With the release therefor you’re force to go smaller otherwise
The board stalls.

Measurment from the back of the box.
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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #215 on: February 27, 2018, 11:39:47 AM »
Yes, that’s rule of thumb but tail rocker is a factor as well.
The reason for that is the closer to tail the more interference
With the release therefor you’re force to go smaller otherwise
The board stalls.

That's it. Thanks for the reminder.
I always have to pay attention with my Vapor as the box is about 8 or 9 inches from the tail.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2018, 11:41:45 AM by Luc Benac »
Sunova Allwater 14'x25.5" 303L Viento 520
Sunova Torpedo 14'x27" 286L Salish 500
Naish Nalu 11'4" x 30" 180L Andaman 520
Sunova Steeze 10' x 31" 150L
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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #216 on: February 27, 2018, 12:17:11 PM »
Yes, that’s rule of thumb but tail rocker is a factor as well.
The reason for that is the closer to tail the more interference
With the release therefor you’re force to go smaller otherwise
The board stalls.

That's it. Thanks for the reminder.
I always have to pay attention with my Vapor as the box is about 8 or 9 inches from the tail.
Yes, also tail width/volume. All other things being equal (which they often aren’t), it takes a bigger fin to control a bigger ass.

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #217 on: February 27, 2018, 05:38:21 PM »
Yes, that’s rule of thumb but tail rocker is a factor as well.
The reason for that is the closer to tail the more interference
With the release therefor you’re force to go smaller otherwise
The board stalls.

That's it. Thanks for the reminder.
I always have to pay attention with my Vapor as the box is about 8 or 9 inches from the tail.
Yes, also tail width/volume. All other things being equal (which they often aren’t), it takes a bigger fin to control a bigger ass.

Yes, but less factor of depth as total fin area, which brings us back to fin box placement.
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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #218 on: February 27, 2018, 09:49:45 PM »
Yes, that’s rule of thumb but tail rocker is a factor as well.
The reason for that is the closer to tail the more interference
With the release therefor you’re force to go smaller otherwise
The board stalls.

That's it. Thanks for the reminder.
I always have to pay attention with my Vapor as the box is about 8 or 9 inches from the tail.
Yes, also tail width/volume. All other things being equal (which they often aren’t), it takes a bigger fin to control a bigger ass.

Yes, but less factor of depth as total fin area, which brings us back to fin box placement.
Well, it depends on the application, doesn’t it? For downwinding you need a lot greater depth than for flat water. Depth will depend on rocker and fin placement (as well as how tall your fin is, of course).

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #219 on: February 28, 2018, 01:08:22 AM »
MY PLAN with my new Nelo board:
- Health: training, and staying in good healthy shape.
- Paddling more long distance: about 300 km per month.
- Flat water 80% (canal mostly)
- Calmer Open Ocean perhaps 20%

I really don't see myself racing for anything other than 30+ km races, therefore do not really see myself competing on many races.

The feedback I really want to see is what is this board like in cross-chop or in a drafting situation ?

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #220 on: February 28, 2018, 01:25:03 AM »
Perhaps the answers can be found when looking at the big picture, and since we cannot whitewater SUP, surf SUP, tour SUP, long distance SUP, flat water SUP, Downwind SUP.... with the same board, why would you want to have a single board do it all? Find me a bike that can excel with it all?!

Here's something that YOU WON'T WANT TO TAKE SERIOUSLY

My next board?
It's going to be an Ace-Like-Shape for calmer waters, because I can let someone else do all the work for 17km (while drafting him). I am hoping that conserving all that energy will allow me to sprint away near the finish. For this, I will need to ensure that my new board can excel in drafting.

I won't need to worry about glide, I won't need to worry about durability, or weight of my board - I just need to make that the guy in front of me suffers the entire way while pulling old me.

I am certain that the above attitude will enrich the sport of SUP, and even allow SUP design to flourish to its fullest.  :-[

Nelo SUP - 14' x 23"
Nelo Surfski 560M - 18'4" x 17"

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #221 on: February 28, 2018, 01:41:42 AM »
1) Perhaps the answers can be found when looking at the big picture, and since we cannot whitewater SUP, surf SUP, tour SUP, long distance SUP, flat water SUP, Downwind SUP.... with the same board, why would you want to have a single board do it all? Find me a bike that can excel with it all?!

2) My next board?
It's going to be an Ace-Like-Shape for calmer waters, because I can let someone else do all the work for 17km (while drafting him). I am hoping that conserving all that energy will allow me to sprint away near the finish. For this, I will need to ensure that my new board can excel in drafting.


1) ..... because if you go to an event like the worlds, you'll need a board that may have to handle a variety of events. That's why the flatwater board market is limited (with Naish dropping the concept entirely).

2) I actually agree with this to a point. It's why I opted for a narrower Allstar this year (and one of the boards I'd consider next year would be a narrower version of the same thing). Unless you're the kind of athlete who is going to be leading the opening kilometres, you're going to need to deal with major cross chop so a flatwater board may well not be the best option for mid pack athletes. However, for those people from a cycling background, there are tactical options to getting rid of 'tail suckers'. I had a situation last year whereby I has someone sit on me for 10km. In the end, you find you can verbally coerce them to come and take a turn or to drop back or I just physically stop paddling and panic them out. At a recreational racing level, that will work.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2018, 02:29:50 AM by ukgm »

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #222 on: February 28, 2018, 02:03:13 AM »
I can totally see middle of the pack paddlers enjoying the Nelo board as if it were meant for them. In fact, I can see the larger Nelo suitable for a great many athletes who do not race, but who enjoy THE GLIDE in calmer waters.

I'll be the judge when I get mine, but I can totally see myself drafting and even catching small bumps while using the Nelo board. Sure, it will be harder than drafting aboard an Allstar, but I have a hard time imagining that the Nelo board will be harder to draft with than say the Sprint 14x23, and even less so while using the Sprint 17'6" x 23".

The Nelo board seems to have quite a bit of rear rocker - thus perhaps opening the door to smaller DW conditions and drafting. Riders will have to adapt though, because the Nelo board is likely to feel completely differently than an Allstar board.
Nelo SUP - 14' x 23"
Nelo Surfski 560M - 18'4" x 17"

ukgm

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #223 on: February 28, 2018, 02:55:58 AM »
I can totally see middle of the pack paddlers enjoying the Nelo board as if it were meant for them.

I can't..... but that's why I'd like to see the feedback of being in that scenario. Either way, with a board like this, I wouldn't hope to be stuck in the middle of the pack in the first place.

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Re: NELO is in for the games with Light Signature Race
« Reply #224 on: February 28, 2018, 03:14:40 AM »
I will see how many times I will swim.  ;D
SIC RS 14x23, 2018
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Lightcorp Signature Race 14x24.75, 2018 (sold)
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Jimmy Lewis Sidewinder 14x25, 2016 (sold)
Sprint 14x23, 2015 (sold)
JL Stiletto 14x28, 2014 (sold)

 


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