Author Topic: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?  (Read 98230 times)

ukgm

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2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« on: April 12, 2017, 07:46:47 AM »
I'm starting to hear whispers that in 2018 a couple of brands may well be moving even further towards focusing on all conditions boards and away (or even ditching) condition specific board specializations. Anyone else heard anything yet ? We've got Lost Mills next month so that might shed some light on what's coming.

Board Stiff

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2017, 10:46:49 AM »
Please, no 2018 rumors while I'm still trying to make up my mind on a 2017!  ;D

But seriously, any more details you can share?

ukgm

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2017, 10:59:13 AM »
Please, no 2018 rumors while I'm still trying to make up my mind on a 2017!  ;D


Don't buy 2017, we're too deep into the season, the 2018 stuff will surface soon and if that doesn't suit you, the sales will start in less than 6 months.


Board Stiff

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2017, 11:20:32 AM »
Too deep in the season? The ice just melted here, and my first race won't be until June!  :D

viatormundi

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2017, 12:59:24 PM »
What I heard is that more brands will have concave bottom shapes like the Allstars. I don't believe in this one board does all thing. In pure flatwater conditions boards like Strike or Sprint are faster. In medium chop boards like Sidewinder or Allstar excel and in downwind a real downwind board is faster such as Bullet or Rail.

burchas

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2017, 06:52:35 PM »
I'm starting to hear whispers that in 2018 a couple of brands may well be moving even further towards focusing on all conditions boards and away (or even ditching) condition specific board specializations. Anyone else heard anything yet ? We've got Lost Mills next month so that might shed some light on what's coming.

It sounds more like you're fishing for information ;) if you heared something please share so we can further dig in...

I'll definitely echo your suggestion to hold off on 2017, at least until OR this summer.

But if you're looking to check the pulse on new boards, stay tuned for Carolina Cup...
in progress...

ukgm

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2017, 09:12:18 AM »
I'm starting to hear whispers that in 2018 a couple of brands may well be moving even further towards focusing on all conditions boards and away (or even ditching) condition specific board specializations. Anyone else heard anything yet ? We've got Lost Mills next month so that might shed some light on what's coming.

But if you're looking to check the pulse on new boards, stay tuned for Carolina Cup...

Do new boards appear there that early ?

burchas

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #7 on: April 13, 2017, 09:28:10 AM »
I'm starting to hear whispers that in 2018 a couple of brands may well be moving even further towards focusing on all conditions boards and away (or even ditching) condition specific board specializations. Anyone else heard anything yet ? We've got Lost Mills next month so that might shed some light on what's coming.

But if you're looking to check the pulse on new boards, stay tuned for Carolina Cup...

Do new boards appear there that early ?

Indeed they do. Even earlier than that.

Take a closer look at the recent world tour race in Maui. You could see some 2018 models
there. Some maybe easier to spot since they are not an existing models in a company lineup (SIC), but some are just an evolution of existing models (Focus).

The stakes at the Carolina Cup are even higher and the competition this year I read will be the
most fierce in the history of the event so draw your conclusion.
in progress...

Rideordie

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2017, 08:12:02 AM »
Burchas,
I will be heading out tomorrow for the Carolina Cup.  Not racing this year, but I will be watching closely, testing all the boards and having a few beers.  PM me if you are going and want to say hello.  I'll buy you a beer and we can talk boards.   
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Naish Glide 14 (v2)
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KeNalu Mana 90 100 Flex

Area 10

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2017, 11:30:35 AM »
What I heard is that more brands will have concave bottom shapes like the Allstars. I don't believe in this one board does all thing. In pure flatwater conditions boards like Strike or Sprint are faster. In medium chop boards like Sidewinder or Allstar excel and in downwind a real downwind board is faster such as Bullet or Rail.
Yes. But I think that the "all-waters" type designs are popular largely because they make drafting easier, as well as the fact that you can buoy turn them more easily (than flat water boards) and are better for beach starts etc. Plus you can go narrower for a given stability. In other words, they are popular for racing because of their ease of handling rather than their out-and-out speed. Planing-nose boards can however be surprisingly quick over very short sprint distances, if you have the power.

So I think the choice of these boards by racers substantially reflects the realities of racing formats these days. If we raced in lanes, or mostly raced big downwind, then the boards would look different.

Btw, don't try telling the ardent Ace fans here that a Bullet or Rail is faster downwind than their board. They'll start foaming at the mouth and posting videos of talented youngsters with the balance of gymnasts and energy that makes the energizer bunny look like a sloth doing impossible things in a standup clog :)


PonoBill

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2017, 11:38:57 AM »
Someone with more patience and focus (that's easy) might look at the finless tunnel design. They're kind of halfway there. I couldn't make the thing turn, but I'm sure some of those young SUP monkeys could make it behave. No question it was fast. I could hold 7mph, I'm thinking guys like Conner could hold 9. Of course, mine is 18 feet long, so that helps, but it had no bow wave and almost no stern wave. I think I was actually getting the water in the tunnel to stall and sheer, but no way to prove that other than all that surface area should have made it very draggy, and it wasn't. I'll take it down off the wall this summer and play with it some more--right after GF2/3/4, RC Rudder 2.0 and eFoils.  Good thing I have rampaging ADD or I'd never get anything done.

So the newest designs are somewhat interesting but mostly irrelevant. They all seem to be tweaking "use case" rather than performance. That's because at 14' there isn't much to tweak. If you want to go fast in the flats, then make it as narrow as you can, and flat on the bottom, and keep as much of the board in the water as you can. That's as fast as you can go in flatwater.

A very accomplished paddler in somewhat rougher water could probably gain some speed with a bottom shape that optimized pumping. How many people can maintain a race-quality stroke while pumping a board consistently for the duration of a race? Two? Three? Of course, you can sell performance to people who will never have the athletic prowess to perform. Suckers like me fall for that every time.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2017, 12:04:41 PM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

viatormundi

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2017, 11:43:30 AM »
What I heard is that more brands will have concave bottom shapes like the Allstars. I don't believe in this one board does all thing. In pure flatwater conditions boards like Strike or Sprint are faster. In medium chop boards like Sidewinder or Allstar excel and in downwind a real downwind board is faster such as Bullet or Rail.
Yes. But I think that the "all-waters" type designs are popular largely because they make drafting easier, as well as the fact that you can buoy turn them more easily (than flat water boards) and are better for beach starts etc. Plus you can go narrower for a given stability. In other words, they are popular for racing because of their ease of handling rather than their out-and-out speed. Planing-nose boards can however be surprisingly quick over very short sprint distances, if you have the power.

So I think the choice of these boards by racers substantially reflects the realities of racing formats these days. If we raced in lanes, or mostly raced big downwind, then the boards would look different.

Btw, don't try telling the ardent Ace fans here that a Bullet or Rail is faster downwind than their board. They'll start foaming at the mouth and posting videos of talented youngsters with the balance of gymnasts and energy that makes the energizer bunny look like a sloth doing impossible things in a standup clog :)

Totally agree!

Board Stiff

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2017, 12:28:13 PM »
Yes. But I think that the "all-waters" type designs are popular largely because they make drafting easier, as well as the fact that you can buoy turn them more easily (than flat water boards) and are better for beach starts etc. Plus you can go narrower for a given stability. In other words, they are popular for racing because of their ease of handling rather than their out-and-out speed. Planing-nose boards can however be surprisingly quick over very short sprint distances, if you have the power.

At least for the casual racer, a big attraction of these boards is that you can race them effectively (or at least enjoyably) in a wider range of conditions (including changing or unpredictable conditions). A 14x25 "all-water" board might be a little slower in glassy water than a narrower shape that's optimized for clean conditions, but realistically for me, the difference probably doesn't even put me one place higher/lower in the middle of the pack final results. But when conditions get a little messy, I'm probably falling quite a few places behind and having a lot less fun on the narrow flatwater-optimized board, as I'm falling in constantly and wasting energy balancing instead of paddling with power and form.

At least that's what I told myself when I ordered a new Sidewinder!  :D

FloridaWindSUP

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2017, 01:14:21 PM »
I heard a rumor that a big blue board brand was going to shift marketing focus from their all-water board to their flatwater board, which they will tweak a bit and start recommending for anything flatter than knee high chop.

That's interesting what Pono Bill said about "use case" being the focus now instead of performance. Also interesting about a narrow flat bottom board with maximum waterline being the fastest for pure flat water. Bill, what are some board models that you think are already optimally shaped for pure flatwater speed? Does the StarBoard Sprint count even though it has the funny concaves on the bottom? What about the idea that some flatwater board shapes are fastest in short sprints where they can get some lift and others with more cutting bows are faster for longer hauls in flatwater? Riviera made some tongue-depressor shaped variants on their RP raceboard that they recommend for short sprint and surf races but say are less efficient for long distance paddling. https://www.rivierapaddlesurf.com/collections/sup-used/products/14x22-rp-raceboard-2 
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TallDude

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Re: 2018 Raceboard rumours ?
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2017, 02:20:31 PM »
Also interesting about a narrow flat bottom board with maximum waterline being the fastest for pure flat water. Bill, what are some board models that you think are already optimally shaped for pure flatwater speed?
I'll answer that. Anything narrower than 24" and longer than 14'. This was, is, and still will be the fastest board I have ever wobbled through a flat water race on. It was designed over 10 years ago. It's 19'8 x 22.5" . So if you want the fastest board, don't wait for next years models. You have to have it custom made... for you. ;) If only Craig Richmond would start making SUP race boards again.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2017, 02:24:37 PM by TallDude »
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