Author Topic: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?  (Read 4011 times)

Board Stiff

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Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« on: April 11, 2017, 11:12:03 AM »
Finally made up my mind to buy a Sidewinder 14' x 25" in Carbon construction, and of course that model is now back-ordered in Carbon for a couple months. :'( 
Signature construction is currently available.

Anybody here tried this or other JL boards in both constructions? I'm interested in hearing how they compare and whether it's worth waiting for the Carbon one. I know the cost and weight difference, but how about performance, feel (stiffness/flex, etc), and durability?

Thanks!

BS


JimK

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2017, 05:22:17 AM »
Hey Luke,



JimK
« Last Edit: April 12, 2017, 05:28:23 AM by JimK »

warmuth

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2017, 05:59:10 AM »
  I've only paddled the carbon version so I can't compare the two. While it's probably the most flexible feeling board I've owned it's not really noticeable unless I'm pounding upwind in chop. I do not feel any flex paddling in flat water but can feel it a bit moving fore/aft when pivot turning. Im a bit nervous about it in surf and have taken it out once but probably won't do it again. I haven't had it long enough to comment on durability but JL has an almost universally great reputation for well built boards.

Board Stiff

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2017, 08:56:06 AM »
Warmuth, thanks for the feedback. What's your concern with taking it in the surf? Does it feel structurally flimsy?

BS

PonoBill

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2017, 09:57:15 AM »
Warmuth, it's a Jimmy board, which means full sandwich. It might flex (Jimmy likes flex) but it's still stronger than most boards. I doubt you need to worry.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

warmuth

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2017, 10:28:32 AM »
 I'm probably a bit more paranoid with it just because it does feel like a lighter less tough board. I don't doubt its stronger overall than most other boards being a full sandwich but it's still in the back of my mind every time I feel it shuddering in the surf. To be fair I'm nervous on all my race boards here since I have to surf waves with a lot of pitch and have to catch them pretty much in the surf zone and not way outside. Overall I don't have any complaints about the board at all, the surf paranoia is just what happens on a $3000 board that you really don't want to turn into scrap haha.

Eagle

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2017, 10:53:39 AM »
A couple carbon boards we have flex and a couple do not much.  Our glass sandwich JL M14 does flex a bit at the tip but it does just bounce back.  Have never had an issue with flex -> and kinda like some to absorb slamming into waves anyways.  Makes the board a bit more forgiving.  Even the 17.4 production Bullet does this.

My pref tho is carbon for lighter weight provided the layup is not too light and flimsy.  For us about 24 lbs is already too light for a 14.  Dave notes he added more reinf and weight on his 2017 WL to add more durability -> about 1 to 1.5 lbs.  Jimmy has moved to carbon and would be interesting to hear more reviews on his carbon boards.  Too light can be a problem like the carbon AS23.  The top carbon sandwich skin is very thin.  Too thin for me.  Would prefer a board maybe 25 lbs.  Always our pref is durability and extended lifsespan.  All our boards still basically are structurally sound luckily.

Edit:  Imbed vimeo failed  :(

Fast is FUN!   8)
Dominator - Touring Pintail - Bullet V2 - M14 - AS23

Board Stiff

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #7 on: April 12, 2017, 11:34:00 AM »
My pref tho is carbon for lighter weight provided the layup is not too light and flimsy.  For us about 24 lbs is already too light for a 14. 

Eagle - is your carbon preference specifically for weight, or also for other performance characteristics of that material? JL Sidewinder 14' x 25" is 23# in carbon, 25# in signature construction. Based strictly on weight, it sounds like the signature construction would be in your sweet spot for a 14' board, unless Jimmy's carbon sandwich manages to be a lot tougher at a lower weight than other carbon constructions out there.

warmuth

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #8 on: April 12, 2017, 11:56:44 AM »
  If the difference really is only two pounds I'd save the money. 25 pounds is still a light board. 

viatormundi

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #9 on: April 12, 2017, 12:56:19 PM »
I just received the carbon version white color Sidewinder 14x25. It is a great board. If you are going to compete in races I would recommend the carbon version. If you are going to use it for touring or own fitness then the regular construction should be fine. The picture was taken when I arrived after paddling 24km on it.


Eagle

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2017, 01:42:48 PM »
BS - If only 2 lbs more at 25 in glass sandwich my pref would probs be that.  Would only go for 23 carbon if really serious about racing.  The benefit of carbon is just lighter weight to accelerate onto a DW bump and hoist overhead onto a rack.  For us a 25 lb more durable board is much better than a 24 lb that cracks easily like the AS23.  Am always super careful so as not to crack the topsides on that board.  But can say that board is my fav by far for performance in the ocean AW.  Super fun board that AS23 though fragile.

Very light carbon boards feel kinda like they can crack super easy and are too brittle and flimsy for us.  The SW carbon may be perf fine though.  The tried and true JL glass sandwich we have is very durable though.  Fell onto its side and just some paint chipped off the nose.  The glass under was completely rock solid.
Fast is FUN!   8)
Dominator - Touring Pintail - Bullet V2 - M14 - AS23

Eagle

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2017, 02:37:10 PM »
For us any 14 board at 25 - 26 lbs is perfectly fine provided it does not crack or easily dent.

A 25 Sprint that I was going to buy years ago had a crack on inspection - and my AS23 got a paddle whack crack from a friend falling off.  The carbon boards were around 23 lbs and 24 lbs respectively.  Both cracked carbon skins looked way too thin and should not have passed QC.  supuk talks about this from time to time.

The glass M14 we have is 28 lbs.  Which def feels over-built.  Like our 27.5 lb SB Touring carbon which feels massively over-built for carbon.  That one also fell over and just lost some paint.  The carbon under was also rock solid.  So probs just depends on who built the board that day and how much care they put into it.  Luck of the draw kinda.  So a bit heavier layup is probs good for durability -> carbon or glass sandwich.

Our 1/2 carbon Dom at 26.5 lbs and Bullet SCC at 26.5 lbs are both ok but the Dom pressure dents.  The Bullet SCC has been tough but paint does chip from impacts.  All issues have been only cosmetic.  Maybe some have had good luck with very light carbon layups.  Both lighter boards I have used have cracked like eggshells.
Fast is FUN!   8)
Dominator - Touring Pintail - Bullet V2 - M14 - AS23

Board Stiff

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2017, 07:59:12 PM »
Y'all make some good points. I like to race, but not very competitively, and a couple pound difference in board weight is not going to put me on the podium. And I could probably shave a lot more than 2 lbs off myself!  ;D

The main benefit of carbon for me would be less weight to lift on and off the car and lug to and from the water, and any reduction in fatigue, wear and tear on the joints, etc from improved glide or less effort propelling a reduced board mass over long distances. The difference is really more about comfort and convenience than actual race performance.

Whereas other 14' carbon raceboards I've paddled and considered, like SIC's X-14 Pro and FX, weigh in around 24-25 lbs, the JL signature construction probably wouldn't feel particularly heavy to me anyway.

Badger

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Re: Sidewinder - Carbon or Signature construction?
« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2017, 11:34:24 PM »
You made the right choice not going with the carbon. Signature is much more rugged.

That shape is a rocket. I can't wait to see it and try it.

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