Author Topic: Downwinding - How to unstick a 14' board in 25 knot offshore conditions? - vid  (Read 7936 times)

Off-Shore

  • Teahupoo Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 1663
    • View Profile
    • HksupaHK SUP and Downwinding
We had two great sessions this past Monday on a near shore run with little fetch and then on an offshore run with ocean (ground swell). What was interesting was I seem to find it harder to unstick a 14' board than a longer one and get on the plane in these off-shore conditions (see vid below), but not at all in the near shore where this 14' skipped from glide to glide with ease.

I'd be interested to know from those more experienced than me what I am doing wrong. On this 14', I felt in order to catch the faster moving waves in the higher winds I needed to stay further forward, but when I stepped back, the board stalled... probably stepping back too early or I'm just not light enough on my feet. Or I just wasn't paddling fast enough. The board is the Blue Planet Bump Rider 14 x 27". In these conditions I know I would have no problems unsticking my SIC F16v3 or the SIC Bullet 17-4 which being longer I think does not stall so easily when you step back (due to the longer profile) and they also force you to stay way back to ensure the nose of the board does not plow into the wave ahead and there is a bigger surface area to catch the wave going under you..

Be interested to hear your comments...

https://youtu.be/gbMIld3NP1c
GoPro Hero 5 Black with Sail Systems 3rd Mount (which had been moved off centre by an earlier fall)
SB 9' x 33' x 4.1" - RPC 9'8" iSUP - SB All-Star 12'6" - Blue Planet Bump Rider 14 - SB Ace 14 x 27 - RedAir 14' Elite Race - SIC Bullet 14v1 TWC - SICMaui F16v3 Custom

YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/HksupaHk_SUP_and_Downwinding

Eagle

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2426
    • View Profile
Hey OS - not very experienced myself - just some old middle aged guy.  But looked like again your feet were stuck in one spot and weighted a bit too far aft.  When I catch glides onto a plane on both my Bullet V2 and M14 - I am about where the handle is - then step back to keep the nose just on the verge of pearling.  In a lot of wind though - I just stay back especially if steep and deep.  Slower but safer.

How does that BR float you vs your Bullet?  That would be a direct comparable.  Your F16 and the Bullet 17.4 have massively more float vs those 14s.
Fast is FUN!   8)
Dominator - Touring Pintail - Bullet V2 - M14 - AS23

supuk

  • Teahupoo Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 1957
    • View Profile
you could maybe start by moving your stroke ad catch forward as you are not getting a huge amount of reach in your stroke, this will give you more lift during the power phase and bring the board out of the water rather than pulling it down.

PonoBill

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 25864
    • View Profile
In a word, wrong board. Yeah, okay, you can make the 14' work, but fast moving swells are why we Mauians are all on 17' Bullets. Steep windswells are 14' territory. Yes, you can hang out on the nose and paddle like a maniac, but why?
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

yugi

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2228
    • View Profile
...
 Yes, you can hang out on the nose and paddle like a maniac, but why?

Because you can.



^ George "because it's there" Mallory

Night Wing

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2724
  • Piney Woods of Southeast Texas
    • View Profile
Just curious.

In keeping with a 14' board in lieu of a longer board such as a 17' SIC Bullet, instead of the 14'x27" Bump Rider, would a 14'x30" Bump Rider have been a better board in those wave and wind conditions you experienced?

Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters (2 Dukes)
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters
CJ Nelson Parallax: 9'3" x 23 1/2" x 3 3/16" @ 78.8 Liters (prone surfing longboard; Thunderbolt Technologies build in Red construction)

yugi

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2228
    • View Profile

PonoBill

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 25864
    • View Profile
But with a purpose. On the big stuff a 17 connects while the big swells roll under a 14. One MPH makes a big difference, but five is night and day.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

yugi

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2228
    • View Profile
^ Oh I’m sure it does. I’m sure it does.
Offshore even has 2, no? But that wasn’t the question.

The answer is you can. (or was it 42?)

I certainly wouldn’t complain if I had perfectly groomed conditions. I’ve got mostly marginal conditions and when it honks it gets wildly messy. It’s actually a bit of a blast making that stuff work for you.

I don’t Telemark or Singlespeed because it’s easier either. Speaking of groomed conditions I never ski on groomers - I’m always in the wild unpasturised snow. Love skiing crud and it'll love you back.

“Live like you’ll die tomorrow, learn like you’ll live forever” - Gandhi

Off-Shore

  • Teahupoo Status
  • ******
  • Posts: 1663
    • View Profile
    • HksupaHK SUP and Downwinding
In a word, wrong board. Yeah, okay, you can make the 14' work, but fast moving swells are why we Mauians are all on 17' Bullets. Steep windswells are 14' territory. Yes, you can hang out on the nose and paddle like a maniac, but why?

Pono, this is exactly what I thought.. In fact my buddy who I was paddling with who has a SICMaui Bullet 17-4 and a 2017 NSP Travis Grant 17'10" x 24" was also on a 14' and mid run, as he passed me he shouted out "We brought the wrong boards!!!".. But there we were... and conditions were awesome.... and it was frustrating....

Just curious.

In keeping with a 14' board in lieu of a longer board such as a 17' SIC Bullet, instead of the 14'x27" Bump Rider, would a 14'x30" Bump Rider have been a better board in those wave and wind conditions you experienced?

Interestingly, I asked Robert Stehlik about this, and he suggested the 30" Bump Rider would be better in these conditions for me. Probably because I would feel more confident and be able to paddle harder and not worry about the wibble wobble.. but as Pono says above, it appeared to me the swells were moving too fast and a longer board would be better

^ Oh I’m sure it does. I’m sure it does.
Offshore even has 2, no? But that wasn’t the question.

The answer is you can. (or was it 42?)

I certainly wouldn’t complain if I had perfectly groomed conditions. I’ve got mostly marginal conditions and when it honks it gets wildly messy. It’s actually a bit of a blast making that stuff work for you.

I don’t Telemark or Singlespeed because it’s easier either. Speaking of groomed conditions I never ski on groomers - I’m always in the wild unpasturised snow. Love skiing crud and it'll love you back.

“Live like you’ll die tomorrow, learn like you’ll live forever” - Gandhi

Yugi.. 42? It may appear that way, but I'm just good at borrowing boards or swapping them mid paddle so it only appears I have lots of boards...  ;). Actually I only have one unlimited, the SICMaui F16v3 which if it is ever like this again, will be used instead of a 14'.

I'm trying to put together a vid combining back-country downhill powder ski footage with downwind SUP footage for you and the other skier/downwinders out there... I think there are parallels (at least with the downhill bits).. sort of like a combined surfing + snowboarding vid. Although I'm sure it sounds better than it will look.. I've managed to convert almost all my back-country ski buddies to SUP and downwinding over the years..
« Last Edit: February 08, 2017, 12:33:22 AM by Off-Shore »
SB 9' x 33' x 4.1" - RPC 9'8" iSUP - SB All-Star 12'6" - Blue Planet Bump Rider 14 - SB Ace 14 x 27 - RedAir 14' Elite Race - SIC Bullet 14v1 TWC - SICMaui F16v3 Custom

YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/HksupaHk_SUP_and_Downwinding

Badger

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2662
  • Seacoast NH
    • View Profile


I would think going from 27" to 30" would be quite a trade off. What you gain in stability, you might lose in speed and maneuverability.

I'd sure like to see how an M-14 @ 28" would compare in those conditions.




Kalama E3 6'1 x 23" 105L
Axis HPS 980 / PNG 1300
Sunova Flow  8'10 X 31"  119L
Me - 6'0" - 165lbs - 66yo

Muskoka SUP

  • Peahi Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 863
    • View Profile
^ Oh I’m sure it does. I’m sure it does.
Offshore even has 2, no? But that wasn’t the question.

The answer is you can. (or was it 42?)

I certainly wouldn’t complain if I had perfectly groomed conditions. I’ve got mostly marginal conditions and when it honks it gets wildly messy. It’s actually a bit of a blast making that stuff work for you.

I don’t Telemark or Singlespeed because it’s easier either. Speaking of groomed conditions I never ski on groomers - I’m always in the wild unpasturised snow. Love skiing crud and it'll love you back.

“Live like you’ll die tomorrow, learn like you’ll live forever” - Gandhi

You're obviously stoooopid.  Just sayin'
It ain't over until the fat board sinks....

yugi

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2228
    • View Profile
^ yes sir

I still have a bunch of these if you need one for your SUP, you pinhead.

Eagle

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 2426
    • View Profile
badger - yeah would have thought the BR27 - Bullet 14 - and M14 to all be designed to "unstick" in those conditions.  Those 3 boards were designed for Hawaii open ocean and 25 kts.  From the BR27 web desc -

"It has a planing hull designed for fast downwind runs and open ocean racing."

So the BR stalling and instability was odd and unexpected.  The conditions in the vid looked actually really nice.  Just about perfect.  Maybe Robert can comment why that board could not "unstick".  Both my Bullet V2 and M14 would have.
Fast is FUN!   8)
Dominator - Touring Pintail - Bullet V2 - M14 - AS23

Area 10

  • Cortez Bank Status
  • *****
  • Posts: 4057
    • View Profile
I've not found any board yet that works well in all conditions and all of the time. You don't know if any other 14s would have been better on that day because you didn't try them back-to-back. You can't tell much about conditions from videos. There can be all sorts of effects going on beneath the surface of the water that can hinder planing. So I think it would be premature to get on Robert's case just on the basis of this one outing.

 


SimplePortal 2.3.7 © 2008-2024, SimplePortal