Author Topic: Is GoFoil the Only Option?  (Read 32940 times)

Sam the Surfer

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #75 on: February 17, 2017, 07:53:06 PM »
This is so cool! We have been riding the hydrofoil behind boats and making tbars and wings to get 25+ feet off the water!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGVirl7OLPw

Had an opportunity to ride with Rush Randle on the North Shore behind a wave runner and use the waves as a kicker. He surfed on a wakeboard with snowboard boots with a foil and landed a flip in the wave. Super Cool!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJSH2CbPAOg

These surfing tbar applications are much thinner and lighter... interesting...


SURFFOILS

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #76 on: February 18, 2017, 01:03:28 AM »
Patents!  Patents!  All I see are STRAPS, STRAPS, STRAPS. 

I mean it's only Dave Kalama for god's sake.  He actually looks quite happy.
The straps are for pitch control but theres a new Gen of foils due out that have much better control. Initially a single piece foil with development continuing...

surfcowboy

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #77 on: February 18, 2017, 03:59:18 PM »
Surffoils, is that you from sways? Welcome either way but if so, I've watched your work for years.

SURFFOILS

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #78 on: February 19, 2017, 02:06:14 AM »
Hi Surfcowboy, Yes Im the same guy from Sways. Foiling is an interesting offshoot of so many water sports. From what I know in the recreational arena, there were a water ski guy Walter Woodward back in the 1960's who made basic ladder foils for his water skis for towing behind boats, later in 1990, 2 guys made a sit down towing version called the Air Chair which went on to be Its own sport with the long strut that we know but with full Aluminium foils.
At some point around 2006 Laird Hamilton cottoned on to the idea and put one of the Aluminium foils onto a snowboard or something similar with boots and blew everyone away. And it stopped there.
 But for me that's where it started. Ive hand built about 130 foil setups from glass, carbon, thermoplastics, Aluminium but only for shortboard surfing. And a bit of prone and SUP.  There are videos  and stills of people surfing my foils in the surf as far back as 2013, prone, standup, all styles but the foil design is for beach and reef breaks, tube-riding, bottom turns and cutbacks in hollow breaking waves.
The Horue guys are killing it for diversity on Kitefoils and then SUP foiling started, initially on downwinds chasing runners on longer boards, quickly moving to shorter board length but the foil design is basically the same as the Air Chair foils...a long single strut /mast with a 2 foil setup, larger foil in front and trailing foil set at a-Ve AOA. A highly successful setup  creating lift from the principles of Bernoulli.

 And how great has it developed now ! So many startup Foil manufacturers making great designs, so many amazing videos to feast on and Theres a great future in foil design to come.

However foiling is a lot more than a single submerged twin foil setup. 8)

Foiling has passed by the regular surfing industry/market but SUPs are the perfect vehicle for foils, and the future of SUP foil design relies on the manufacturers, as soon as one company innovates, the rest will follow.

As long as people are buying into SUP oiling it will get so much better and easier and cheaper.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2017, 02:31:12 AM by SURFFOILS »

surfcowboy

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #79 on: February 19, 2017, 11:48:07 PM »
Love it man. Your bodyboard foil was great and such a well executed design.

Check out what PonoBill is cooking up with the geezer foil. And then of course SupUK is doing great stuff. This is a fun and open minded crew. Glad to have you on here.

Admin

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #80 on: February 20, 2017, 02:37:50 AM »
SURFFOILS,

I am shocked with the current foil frenzy that a foilcraft hasn't been developed for downwind sit down yet.  That is a natural.  Twice the power of SUP for a double bladed paddle, same swell energy.  The boat itself could be greatly reduced from any current form.  I would love to see creative guy with foil experience take a crack at that.  Someone is going to turn that industry on it's head. 

yugi

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #81 on: February 20, 2017, 03:30:52 AM »
^ no doubt they will

However sit-down ain't for me. I absolutely hated the sit down aspect of the airchair. One feels so handicapped and cramped.

PonoBill

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #82 on: February 20, 2017, 05:55:34 AM »
Yeah, you could sit on the geezer foil. I'm thinking of a walker frame for it if my knee goes much weaker, but yeah. With a surface penetrating foil you'd have two options for pitch control--a surface sensor managing AOA or put the chair on slides. Don't need a huge amount of control, the foils self-stabilize a bit by losing area as the nose rises.

I'm chafing at the bit to get back to work on this and other projects. We'll probably be leaving San Diego in a week to head back to Hood River. It's been nice, living among the lotus-eaters, but it's time to get back to my shop.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

blueplanetsurf

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #83 on: February 20, 2017, 06:06:24 AM »
SURFFOILS,

I am shocked with the current foil frenzy that a foilcraft hasn't been developed for downwind sit down yet.  That is a natural.  Twice the power of SUP for a double bladed paddle, same swell energy.  The boat itself could be greatly reduced from any current form.  I would love to see creative guy with foil experience take a crack at that.  Someone is going to turn that industry on it's head.

I'm sure you heard about the Flyak http://www.keystonekayaks.com/new_kayak_019.htm
It's been around for a while, I'm not sure if anyone has tried it on downwinders.
Robert Stehlik
Blue Planet Surf Shop, Honolulu
Hawaii's SUP HQ
http://www.blueplanetsurf.com

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #84 on: February 20, 2017, 06:43:20 AM »
I am imagining something much smaller (waveski size ?) with a foil setup similar to the current SUP/ surf foils with an integrated rudder.  It seems like you could replace the maintenance pumping with paddling as you should always be within reach of the water.  Possibly a shorter mast would work.  Possibly a lower drag foil could be used. You could likely control pitch with upper body position.

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #85 on: February 20, 2017, 08:33:40 AM »
the issue would be the turbulent surface region on wind chop, makes control quite difficult and can demand some fairly large weight movements on your feet let alone on your ass while trying to paddle
if the foil is within 200-300mm of the surface you are affected quite alot by the waves and then add to that the weight and leverage of a ski swinging round out there infront and you will see why it hasnt been done. something like this is extremely hard to fly on your feet, now try sitting down!

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #86 on: February 20, 2017, 01:08:57 PM »
Hi Container,

That board looks like 12 feet or so.  I am thinking 7 to 8 feet.  You are thinking harder seated?  I would expect the opposite.

supuk

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #87 on: February 20, 2017, 02:08:46 PM »
A small kayack with a sliding seat like a rowing boat perhaps. Once I get my foils built I will happily try then on anythinh !

SURFFOILS

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #88 on: February 21, 2017, 01:56:28 AM »
 Now , do you choose a foil that comes from flat water ski-boat foiling background  or from a surfing pedigree ?
 The early ski boat foils have a single mast with a twin foil setup where the back foil digs down into the wave creating drag to promote an uplift of the bigger main front foil. And then when riding you have to balance that negative grip to create a smooth positive  lift.
 The single mast means you need a thick board to support your weight and the overall lift is dependant on constant flow over the NACA foil shape. But is that ski boat foil setup right for surfing ?
« Last Edit: February 21, 2017, 02:22:07 AM by SURFFOILS »

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Re: Is GoFoil the Only Option?
« Reply #89 on: February 21, 2017, 06:22:44 AM »
I keep thinking that a little carbon waveski like the image below (possibly smaller) with a relatively low drag foil would be a blast for downwind.  I have paddled one of these things in tiny non breaking waves and if you think it is easy to get in on a SUP... It feels like you have twice the power of a single SUP blade and obviously loads more than when surfing.  I am not sure what foil design would be best but it would be nice to stick with a single mast, double foil setup if workable. 


 


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