SIC FX Pro vs JL Sidewinder?

[Board Stiff]

Is there anybody here that's tried both the SIC FX Pro and the JL Sidewinder and can compare how the two feel and perform on the water? I got to demo the SIC FX Pro last summer on my usual ocean race course and really liked it. It's unlikely I'd get to demo a Sidewinder around here before buying one, so it'd be great to hear from anyone who's tried both boards.

Thanks!

BS

[Area 10]

Are these two boards a comparable price where you live? Here is Europe the Sideorder is usefully cheaper, and probably better built too (it is a full PVC sandwich I think).

[Badger]

Here is Europe the Sideorder is usefully cheaper, and probably better built too (it is a full PVC sandwich I think).

I'll have a PVC sandwich with a sideorder of SIC FX please.

No wait. The PVC sandwich is the sideorder. Give me a SIC FX with a side of PVC. Hold the Carbon.   

[viatormundi]

I tried both. The Sidewinder is more stable. I could not use them for long time but talked to a rider who paddled both of the boards longer periods of time. According to him Sidewinder is slightly faster in the flatter water. The FX Pro hasn't been so popular in Spain as X-Pro model (the flat water version). Many riders have not switched to FX Pro as expected. Also there is the cost issue. Sidewinder is significantly cheaper compared to FX Pro. IMHO Sidewinder and Allstar are better boards for mixed condition races.

[Board Stiff]

Are these two boards a comparable price where you live? Here is Europe the Sideorder is usefully cheaper, and probably better built too (it is a full PVC sandwich I think).

MSRPs are close enough for price not to be a factor. The FX may be a lot cheaper and immediately available with current deals.

The JL carbon sandwich does sound like a sturdier build than the SIC single carbon composite, though it may all be marketing hype. The finish on my SIC X-14 pro seems more resistant to nicks and scuffs than that on my JL M-12'6, but fortunately I haven't done anything to put them to the test structurally yet.

[Board Stiff]

I'll have a PVC sandwich with a sideorder of SIC FX please.

No wait. The PVC sandwich is the sideorder. Give me a SIC FX with a side of PVC. Hold the Carbon.   

https://youtu.be/TVdvyWK6NiI

[MaineSUP]

Feel free to take my FX out if you're up this way and want to try it again.

[Board Stiff]

Feel free to take my FX out if you're up this way and want to try it again.

Thanks! How are you liking that board after a full summer of racing and any wind or waves this fall? Has it been manageable in all conditions, or do you stick to the Dart when it isn't relatively flat?

[MaineSUP]

BS, I got out on the FX-Pro quite a bit this summer and used it for all of the Casco Bay Series races.  It was a definite adjustment from the Dart and I settled in on it pretty good. In mellow conditions its a blast, fast, and the narrowness allows you to get vertical with the paddle.  In mixed up conditions it still does surprisingly well for how narrow it is but requires constant focus and balance and adjustment.  In August I got my first real surf sup (Speeed) and since then all I've really wanted to do is take out the Speeed and surf, even if the waves are bad.  So, I haven't had the FX out this fall or winter.  At this stage of the season if I were to go out for a downwinder or in messier conditions I'd probably take the Dart. I'm glad to have the FX-Pro though.  There's definitely a time and place for it.

[Board Stiff]

I tried both. The Sidewinder is more stable. I could not use them for long time but talked to a rider who paddled both of the boards longer periods of time. According to him Sidewinder is slightly faster in the flatter water. The FX Pro hasn't been so popular in Spain as X-Pro model (the flat water version). Many riders have not switched to FX Pro as expected. Also there is the cost issue. Sidewinder is significantly cheaper compared to FX Pro. IMHO Sidewinder and Allstar are better boards for mixed condition races.

Viatormundi - That's very interesting to hear about the FX not displacing the X-Pro. I currently own an X-14 Pro and am looking at the FX or Sidewinder as a replacement for it. The X-14 Pro is terrific in glassy conditions, but it's a pain to paddle in any kind of chop, especially from the side. When I paddled the FX, it was about as fast in flatwater, but much smoother and more stable when encountering some wind chop. It was actually the smoothest board I've ever felt riding over light wind chop. Felt like riding on air! Are the riders that aren't switching racing in mostly very flat conditions, or are they using the X-Pro even in more turbulent conditions?

I'm also a bit surprised to hear that Sidewinder is faster than the FX in flatwater. Based only on their shapes and marketing descriptions, I'd have assumed that the FX would have the edge in flatter water, whereas the Sidewinder would surpass it as conditions got messier or heading downwind. If the Sidewinder is also faster in the flats and more stable, then it sounds like the Sidewinder is actually better in any conditions, in addition to being built tougher! That would be a quite an accomplishment, given how impressive the FX is. I wish they were more readily available for demo around here. 

[Board Stiff]

BS, I got out on the FX-Pro quite a bit this summer and used it for all of the Casco Bay Series races.  It was a definite adjustment from the Dart and I settled in on it pretty good. In mellow conditions its a blast, fast, and the narrowness allows you to get vertical with the paddle.  In mixed up conditions it still does surprisingly well for how narrow it is but requires constant focus and balance and adjustment.  In August I got my first real surf sup (Speeed) and since then all I've really wanted to do is take out the Speeed and surf, even if the waves are bad.  So, I haven't had the FX out this fall or winter.  At this stage of the season if I were to go out for a downwinder or in messier conditions I'd probably take the Dart. I'm glad to have the FX-Pro though.  There's definitely a time and place for it.

You looked pretty comfortable on that FX in most races I remember following you. Did you happen to do the Sunday morning one around Richmond Island that everyone was falling like crazy during? I think that was the first one that Raf had the demo FX at, and its those kind of conditions that I'm especially concerned about with the FX. I'm sure it's a lot better than the X-14 Pro in those conditions (I rode my M-12'6 that day), anyway! 

[MaineSUP]

I did not run that sunday race around richmond island.  If I knew that I would encounter that type of burliness (3-4 foot windswell reflecting off the rocks, etc.) I wouldn't take the FX.  I think that if you put your time on the FX you could go out in those types of conditions and do fine, probably devote more energy to staying on the board than you would like, but I think you could do it.  Since I'm a very recreational racer, I would probably take out a wider board when things get that challenging because I'd have more fun that way.

[Area 10]

I tried both. The Sidewinder is more stable. I could not use them for long time but talked to a rider who paddled both of the boards longer periods of time. According to him Sidewinder is slightly faster in the flatter water.

Viatormundi - That's very interesting to hear about the FX not displacing the X-Pro. I currently own an X-14 Pro and am looking at the FX or Sidewinder as a replacement for it. The X-14 Pro is terrific in glassy conditions, but it's a pain to paddle in any kind of chop, especially from the side. When I paddled the FX, it was about as fast in flatwater, but much smoother and more stable when encountering some wind chop. It was actually the smoothest board I've ever felt riding over light wind chop. Felt like riding on air! Are the riders that aren't switching racing in mostly very flat conditions, or are they using the X-Pro even in more turbulent conditions?

I'm also a bit surprised to hear that Sidewinder is faster than the FX in flatwater. Based only on their shapes and marketing descriptions, I'd have assumed that the FX would have the edge in flatter water, whereas the Sidewinder would surpass it as conditions got messier or heading downwind. If the Sidewinder is also faster in the flats and more stable, then it sounds like the Sidewinder is actually better in any conditions, in addition to being built tougher! That would be a quite an accomplishment, given how impressive the FX is. I wish they were more readily available for demo around here. 

You need to be careful about weights with the Sidewinder IMO. I demoed the 14x25 Sideorder and was very surprised at how fast it was. But I now own the 14x23 Sideboard (253 litres) and I am very much slower on it. Some of this is the fact that I am a wobbly on a board that narrow. But also it seems to sit a bit too low in the water and it either ploughs the nose or sinks the tail, depending on where I stand. Basically, I think I am probably too heavy for the design at that volume to be optimal for me.

So, if weighing about 80kgs before clothing, I am too heavy for the 14x23 (with a quoted max recommended weight limit of 85kgs), and the 14x25 is only 21L more volume, I'm guessing that you wouldn't have to be too heavy before the 14x25 wouldn't work too well for you either. JL quote max rider weight of 95 kgs for the 14x25, but if my experience are anything to go by, I'd demo the board carefully before buying if you are anywhere near that weight.
 
I'm thinking that maybe the FX 14x25, with all that volume (290L), and more nose and tail rocker, might be less sensitive to rider weight?

Just a thought... I'm pretty sure that the FX 14x25 would be quite a lot faster for me than the 14x23 Sideboard in flat water. Or pretty much anywhere, for that matter. The 14x25 Sideboard and the FX Pro would probably be a much closer match.

[Board Stiff]

You need to be careful about weights with the Sidewinder IMO. I demoed the 14x25 Sideorder and was very surprised at how fast it was. But I now own the 14x23 Sideboard (253 litres) and I am very much slower on it. Some of this is the fact that I am a wobbly on a board that narrow. But also it seems to sit a bit too low in the water and it either ploughs the nose or sinks the tail, depending on where I stand. Basically, I think I am probably too heavy for the design at that volume to be optimal for me.

So, if weighing about 80kgs before clothing, I am too heavy for the 14x23 (with a quoted max recommended weight limit of 85kgs), and the 14x25 is only 21L more volume, I'm guessing that you wouldn't have to be too heavy before the 14x25 wouldn't work too well for you either. JL quote max rider weight of 95 kgs for the 14x25, but if my experience are anything to go by, I'd demo the board carefully before buying if you are anywhere near that weight.
 
I'm thinking that maybe the FX 14x25, with all that volume (290L), and more nose and tail rocker, might be less sensitive to rider weight?

Just a thought... I'm pretty sure that the FX 14x25 would be quite a lot faster for me than the 14x23 Sideboard in flat water. Or pretty much anywhere, for that matter. The 14x25 Sideboard and the FX Pro would probably be a much closer match.

Thanks A10, good to know! I currently weigh about 80 kg and would be looking at the 25" FX or Sidewinder, which will probably be more than enough challenge for me when conditions get messy.

I think I saw you describe the Sidewinder and FX on anther forum as not being direct competitors... the FX competing more directly with the All-Star, while the Sidewinder was aimed at the same niche as the Vapor, Bullet V2, etc. Did you mean this strictly in terms of market positioning, or more broadly, in terms of the range of conditions and use cases in which each of these boards optimally performs?

Having paddled both the FX and the V2, I feel like either one could handle the entire range of conditions I race in, but each is clearly optimized for a different subset of that range. I'm primarily interested in the FX and Sidewinder for the situations in which the FX outperforms the V2, but if the Sidewinder is as fast as the FX in flat conditions where FX beats V2, and better than the FX in conditions where V2 beats FX (messy ocean or moderate downwind), then it would appear to be a much more versatile board than the FX. Does that sound right to you, assuming a properly sized rider for the Sidewinder?

[Area 10]

Well, I can't say anything directly about the Sideboard vs the FX since although I have Sideorder I've been foiled at every attempt to buy a FX. Never has it been so hard to spend a small fortune than my efforts to buy an FX. So, I've given up. It sounds like there is a surfeit of FX stock in some markets and too little in others.

My comment about competitors for the Sideorder referred to marketing strategy rather than actual use, in the same way as for instance the marketing for the Bark Vapor hardly mentions (and I think didn't use to at all) downwinding, yet that is its strength by a long chalk. The Sidewinder has defied categorization really - many people have used it for long pure flat water races (like the 11 cities), whereas to look at it its design origins look pure prone paddleboard. The 14x25 with a medium-weight paddler on it (like you) goes far faster than you'd think. However, it is still at its heart I think an ocean raceboard in terms of concept. The U-Boat was JL's flat water board. But I'm not sure that there is much difference in pure straight line speed between the two boards, and the Sideboard is probably better to draft with, and is certainly more stable. 

The the FX is, according to those owners who have contacted me about it, very much an out-and-out raceboard, and was originally oriented more towards flat water. So, we have the odd situation where a ocean-oriented design turns out to be almost better at pure flat water, and a relatively more flat-water oriented board that people are buying for ocean work. It's funny the way things turn out.