Ok, an Allwave or a Widepoint?

[BigSlaveDave]

This is kinda a continuation of my "good longboard" post from a couple of days ago.  After everyone's good comments I decided the 9'5" Alwave was the right board for me, because although I can ride my SB Noserider fine, it's really unstable for me in the chop.

So i started calling around for prices.  When I talked to the guy at a noted shop, where they are known to know what they are talking about, and the guys that sold me the Noserider, they said the Allwave was going in the wrong direction (and he sells both).

The guy said that, yeah, width is good for stability, but you don't want it in the tail.  You want in where you need it--in the middle.  He suggested that the SB Widepoint was the way to go.  I know it's easy to stir up shit on the net, but any opinions?  Don't want to cause a brawl or anything. 

BSD

[SUP Sports ®]

Before there was a Starboard 9'5" Wide Point or a Fanatic 9'6" All Wave, there was SUP Sports® 9'6" Stoke...
If you are gonna do due diligence in this board genre, I'd recommend giving it a look...lot's of eye candy in this link...;-)

http://supsports.com/standup-paddle-boards/stoke-series/

Designed in Cali, I've shipped them to hot surfers all over NorCal, Oregon, and the Pacific Northwest...let alone all over the globe...it's a proven design...
We have heaps of pics on our site...BTW, I hear lots of chatter on other boards but not one impressive pic in action...;-)

The production versions are built in 3 different widths and volumes...at the 9'6" length...I don't think that the Euro windsurf companies are doing that...
Single sided Australian Pine veneers are only $1299 with custom fins and the best leash on the market...we have never had one buckle or break...
Again, we have demos available at our shop...come on down and check them out...but, we encourage you to get on a demo of the boards you mentioned before hand...I know that it will make the decision easier...;-)

[Zooport]

This is kinda a continuation of my "good longboard" post from a couple of days ago.  After everyone's good comments I decided the 9'5" Alwave was the right board for me, because although I can ride my SB Noserider fine, it's really unstable for me in the chop.

So i started calling around for prices.  When I talked to the guy at a noted shop, where they are known to know what they are talking about, and the guys that sold me the Noserider, they said the Allwave was going in the wrong direction (and he sells both).

The guy said that, yeah, width is good for stability, but you don't want it in the tail.  You want in where you need it--in the middle.  He suggested that the SB Widepoint was the way to go.  I know it's easy to stir up shit on the net, but any opinions?  Don't want to cause a brawl or anything. 

BSD

You can't go wrong with either, IMO.  Both are great boards and I think they are somewhat similar in performance, although I have not ridden a Widepoint. 

[supthecreek]

No brawls...  discussion is good. No one gets away with bullshit that way.... point, counter point brings out useful info.

I love to research boards when looking to buy... sometimes it can be hard to get a good comparison without them side by side, so I use side by side pictures.
It helps me to see the options. see pic below...

The new Wide Point looks like a much improved design over the previous model, but I've never seen one.
I can't tell about the tail rocker, which I feel is very important in larger boards.
I read a lot of forums, but I don't see much feedback on the Wide Points anymore, maybe the new shape will change that, maybe not.

Google each model for reviews and see if any resonate with you.

The dealer that sold you a board, that you are NOT comfortable on, may not be the best person to solve a problem he walked you into. I personally would never recommend a 30" wide board with a narrow tail, to a large new SUP'r.... but I believe in comfort over struggle when learning. Many recommend struggle. :

If the dealer sells both, pick them up, lay them side by side...give them a good solid look.... ask if you can demo both at the same time.
get the one thats right for you... not someone else.

That should get you in the right direction... have  fun


(Prices... don't forget JimK... I'm pretty sure no one beats his Allwave pricing) tell him you are a Zoner!!!

1st picture shows the simple numbers side by side, with the highest numbers in each category in red...

2nd pic is me on my "wide tail" Allwave... it's not wide and not a problem 

[BigSlaveDave]

No brawls...  discussion is good. No one gets away with bullshit that way.... point, counter point brings out useful info.

I love to research boards when looking to buy... sometimes it can be hard to get a good comparison without them side by side, so I use side by side pictures.
It helps me to see the options. see pic below...

The new Wide Point looks like a much improved design over the previous model, but I've never seen one.
I can't tell about the tail rocker, which I feel is very important in larger boards.
I read a lot of forums, but I don't see much feedback on the Wide Points anymore, maybe the new shape will change that, maybe not.

Google each model for reviews and see if any resonate with you.

The dealer that sold you a board, that you are NOT comfortable on, may not be the best person to solve a problem he walked you into. I personally would never recommend a 30" wide board with a narrow tail, to a large new SUP'r.... but I believe in comfort over struggle when learning. Many recommend struggle. :

If the dealer sells both, pick them up, lay them side by side...give them a good solid look.... ask if you can demo both at the same time.
get the one thats right for you... not someone else.

That should get you in the right direction... have  fun


(Prices... don't forget JimK... I'm pretty sure no one beats his Allwave pricing) tell him you are a Zoner!!!

1st picture shows the simple numbers side by side, with the highest numbers in each category in red...

2nd pic is me on my "wide tail" Allwave... it's not wide and not a problem 

Thanks for this comparison.  Really the Allwave doesn't look like the tails any wider than the Widepoint.  I think the Allwave is the ticket.

[BigSlaveDave]

Although those Stoke boards look pretty good too.  Too much choice!

[SlatchJim]

I've riden the stoke and the wide point (older version) and I found the stoke had way better glide and seemed more balanced & refined than the WP.  Don't know much about the new WPs.  For All Wave reviews, I'd defer to STC.  *press easy button* Demo if you can.  Nobody knows you better than you.

[SUP Sports ®]

Aloha BSD,
Ultimately, it's your choice...your money...etc...but, to answer a question with a question, why limit yourself to a compromise between either vanilla or chocolate type SUP's from big windsurf companies when you can have a custom surf SUP board built, here in Cali, to the exact build specs, dims, and graphics that you want and need?

http://supsports.com/standup-paddle-boards/california-custom-series/

I have tweaked my Stoke design to satisfy big wave chargers from here to Humboldt and on up the Oregon Coast to Canada...to nose rider Stokes for Florida and Virginia...the American flag board shown below is my Stoke template reduced to 9'2" and 33" wide @ 159 liters...for a San Diego client...this is a full epoxy with S glass...1.5# foam...Powerline stringer...custom bamboo fin set...etc...$1499...

Also shown are a couple of locally built 9'6" x 33" Stokes @ 170 liters...these didn't last 2 days in our shop...our top selling board for bigger guys who know how to surf...I'm cutting a couple of more this weekend...light, strong, and US made...

We have our production 9'6" Stokes of different widths and volumes (30.5" @ 150 liters, 32" @ 165 liters, 33.5" @ 175 liters) on our demo racks...paddle them...surf them...then, get down to personally customizing it, if there is anything you want to adjust on the dims...or, you can simply pick up one of our production boards straight off the racks and you are good to go...

I've been riding custom surfboards, sailboards, and SUP's my whole surfing life...over 40 years now...
I don't know about you...but, I never settled for a compromised shape, milquetoast looking, cookie cutter production surfboard...
Our try before you buy demo option guarantees that you are gonna get a surfing board that's built just right for you...the first time...doesn't get much better than that...

http://supsports.com/stoked/stoked-life-clients/

[standuped]

BigSlaveDave  You need to go to this shop and demo these boards.  The Stoke will most likely be my next board for Oregon.  If you are cost conscious you will love the wood version because in many PNW scenarios the slight extra weight is what you want and saves $$$. There is a guy at my spot that picked up a woodie used from some one who went carbon and he is killing it as far as connecting sections, making it back out dry and catching them early (this is my definition of killing it, basically not getting killed)   I am jeleous of you cause you can just very easily just drive to the shop.  It's on my do list to get there  and demo and spec out, but life and surfing what I already have is slowing this down.  I would also boldly recommend that you don't go below 160ltrs, but that's just me. 

 

Before there was a Starboard 9'5" Wide Point or a Fanatic 9'6" All Wave, there was SUP Sports® 9'6" Stoke...
If you are gonna do due diligence in this board genre, I'd recommend giving it a look...lot's of eye candy in this link...;-)

http://supsports.com/standup-paddle-boards/stoke-series/

Designed in Cali, I've shipped them to hot surfers all over NorCal, Oregon, and the Pacific Northwest...let alone all over the globe...it's a proven design...
We have heaps of pics on our site...BTW, I hear lots of chatter on other boards but not one impressive pic in action...;-)

The production versions are built in 3 different widths and volumes...at the 9'6" length...I don't think that the Euro windsurf companies are doing that...
Single sided Australian Pine veneers are only $1299 with custom fins and the best leash on the market...we have never had one buckle or break...
Again, we have demos available at our shop...come on down and check them out...but, we encourage you to get on a demo of the boards you mentioned before hand...I know that it will make the decision easier...;-)

[gorgebob]

We just tested the 8'10" Widepoint , 8'11" DC NSP, and the 9'1" mini mod. However smaller boards the test was fun and the least volume mini mod with the wide tail is the one that ended up in our Garage. Testing with all the same fins is key as well to not ware yourself out before useing each one.
The widepoint was the most stable, the NSP DC 2nd and the Mini Mod at the least volume 3rd although easy to paddle. 

[Sup-position]

Seriously, support your Local Shop.
Really hard for the Little Guys to make it .

You already have a rapport with them, they should work with you.
Take the Nose Rider in on a swap/trade.
Loyalty will get you farther in the long run...

Build your local Crew....

[SuppaTime]

I have a 9-5 WP and like it a lot. It is my only board and I ride it from 2' to OH+ and it does fine across that range, but I think its sweet spot is really head-high or less surf. Good stability, good maneuverability. My only complaint is I wish it had more acceleration but that could easily be me. I wonder if the 32" wide boards are giving up some speed for stability.

One other thing - I have chipped paint off the rails quite a bit with my crappy paddling technique. Seems a little vulnerable to that, but from what I hear and see, all production boards have that problem.

I am thinking of going shorter with less volume for smaller waves, and longer/narrower for larger waves. But for a one-board quiver, the WP is a good choice, IMO.

[SUP Sports ®]

I have a 9-5 WP and like it a lot. It is my only board and I ride it from 2' to OH+ and it does fine across that range, but I think its sweet spot is really head-high or less surf. Good stability, good maneuverability. My only complaint is I wish it had more acceleration but that could easily be me. I wonder if the 32" wide boards are giving up some speed for stability.

Not necessarily...a wider board can be much faster than a board with too much, or misplaced rocker...the acceleration issue that you note in the WP is due to excessive rocker and it's placement...see graphic...

The Stoke has a flatter and faster rocker...but, you will likely never pearl it because of where it is strategically placed...;-)

Even though plan forms can appear similar, there are important elements like rocker, volume distribution, bottom contours, rail shape, construction, and fin placement...etc...to name a few...that will distinguish big differences in riding characteristics between boards with similar looking outlines...

[quote}
One other thing - I have chipped paint off the rails quite a bit with my crappy paddling technique. Seems a little vulnerable to that, but from what I hear and see, all production boards have that problem.[/quote]

Many of the production boards do have that chipping problem...some use gel coat on the rails and after a short while it looks like a woodpecker has been going at it...

Our production boards use a proprietary clear coat that protects the paint...we have demos on our racks that are over 3 years old and have been paddled, surfed, and banged on by 100's of novice paddlers with no paint chipping...we don't sell them off because it helps to show the durability...

[bts]

>>>Width is good for stability, but you don't want it in the tail<<<

I don't agree with (part of) that statement.

Tail width does help with stability. Wide tail boards with quad or five fin setups ride differently than narrow tailed boards.  How you feel about that is a matter of preference.

[SUP Sports ®]

>>>Width is good for stability, but you don't want it in the tail<<<

I don't agree with (part of) that statement.

Tail width does help with stability. Wide tail boards with quad or five fin setups ride differently than narrow tailed boards.  How you feel about that is a matter of preference.

I agree, Brian...there are far too many preconceived notions and too much dogmatic nonsense regarding tail widths...and, tail thicknesses for that matter...
My wide tailed Jammers and Hammers prove that point...fin selection and fin placement have a lot to do with the overall equation...as well as efficient use of the biggest fin on your board...the paddle...;-)